International Did COVID come from a Lab in China? US Energy Dept asserts it was a lab leak [megathread]

[Bwagster]

Anyone who trust Fauci at this point in an idiot.

 

[Bwagster]

Combining the virus from a Horseshoe bat with SARS = Covid 19. It's about as natural as going to Dunkin Donuts and the clerk giving you 2 million dollars for the hell of it. It could happen but let's be real.

 

[Hadron90]

https://apnews.com/article/archive-fact-checking-9391149002

They proved like a year ago that it wasn’t manufactured in a lab:
Scientists have said that if the virus was made in a lab then its structure would reveal that it would have been created from viruses that are already known and there would be signs of manipulation.

“These two features of the virus, the mutations in the RBD portion of the spike protein and its distinct backbone, rules out laboratory manipulation as a potential origin for SARS-CoV-2,”


Thinly veiled propaganda designed to put the screws to China. Fauci is a proven liar (said no need for masks when he knew Covid was airborne) and will say whatever the admin in power tells him to.

That's been thoroughly debunked. Experts have testified before Congress that there are means of altering viruses during gain of function research that do not show these signs of manipulation.

 

[Tairy Hesticles]

It didn't destroy their economy, it destroyed everyone else's. I suppose it's possibly that 4 scientists studying bat coronaviruses all decided to go have lunch at the same wet market and happened to be infected by the same kind of virus they were studying, but I'm inclined to think there's a reason they allowed flights from Wuhan to other countries but not other party of China.

If you think that the Chinese government had the foresight to release a bioweapon onto its own population in anticipation that it would have a more negative impact on the rest of the world in a global economy where they make the majority of their money selling products to the countries that were even more negatively impacted, then why wouldn't they have found an easier way to be the global economic leader?

I don't for a second believe that we've been told the truth about what China knew and how they've used this virus to their advantage. Go back and read my posts in this thread arguing with people about that point. However, it is insane to think that China would create a bioweapon and release it on their own population, shut everything down for almost an entire year, and expect that it would benefit them in the long run. It's the equivalent of going all in on pocket 2's.

If the Chinese government is that good at destroying Western economies then they would have found a much better way to do it with much less risk involved. The reality is that they used this pandemic to their advantage after they were aware of it. I'm willing to bet that they will suffer some hefty consequences as a result.

The more that comes to light, the less likely countries are to trust China in the future. They played their hand, and they won in the short term, but they have obviously fucked the rest of the world on purpose. If they released this virus intentionally, they would have known this. If they were really able to manipulate the global economy like this, they would have been able to come up with a less risky plan to gain a bigger share. They simply used this pandemic as a skeezy way to gain short term returns, but they will suffer in the long run.

Taiwan numba wan

 

[Cubo de Sangre]

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/amphtml/did-coronavirus-escape-lab-idea-194907885.html


“The WHO report documents a meeting between its investigators and several members of the institute, including lab director Yuan Zhiming, who gave the joint team a tour of the facility.

At the meeting, representatives of WIV refuted the possibility that the coronavirus that causes COVID-19 could have leaked from the lab, noting that none of the three SARS-like viruses cultured in the laboratory are closely related to SARS-CoV-2.

They also pointed out that blood samples obtained from workers and students in a research group led by Shi Zhengli, a WIV virologist who studies SARS-like coronaviruses that originate in bats, contained no SARS-CoV-2 antibodies, which would indicate a current or past infection.”

They’ve investigated already. It’s extremely likely it leaked from a lab based on extensive research and since there’s no evidence to the contrary it’s deeply irresponsible of the Biden admin through its mouthpiece Fauci to say this so they can put the screws to China.

WHO wasn't allowed in immediately. China rebuffed every call for outside investigation. Only fools believe what the Chinese say. Regardless, stop conflating "leaked" with "man-made". The virus being naturally occurring still wouldn't disprove the possibility of a lab accident. China, having no motivation to do so, even refuted the wet-market story (which everyone was so quick to believe).

 

[nostradumbass]

If you think that the Chinese government had the foresight to release a bioweapon onto its own population in anticipation that it would have a more negative impact on the rest of the world in a global economy where they make the majority of their money selling products to the countries that were even more negatively impacted, then why wouldn't they have found an easier way to be the global economic leader?

I don't for a second believe that we've been told the truth about what China knew and how they've used this virus to their advantage. Go back and read my posts in this thread arguing with people about that point. However, it is insane to think that China would create a bioweapon and release it on their own population, shut everything down for almost an entire year, and expect that it would benefit them in the long run. It's the equivalent of going all in on pocket 2's.

If the Chinese government is that good at destroying Western economies then they would have found a much better way to do it with much less risk involved. The reality is that they used this pandemic to their advantage after they were aware of it. I'm willing to bet that they will suffer some hefty consequences as a result.

The more that comes to light, the less likely countries are to trust China in the future. They played their hand, and they won in the short term, but they have obviously fucked the rest of the world on purpose. If they released this virus intentionally, they would have known this. If they were really able to manipulate the global economy like this, they would have been able to come up with a less risky plan to gain a bigger share. They simply used this pandemic as a skeezy way to gain short term returns, but they will suffer in the long run.

Taiwan numba wan

I'm not saying the initial leak was intentional, I'm saying spreading it to the rest of the world was. They got a several month head start on containing it in their own country, and didn't say a word about it until had been spreading for months everywhere else because they wanted to make damn sure if they took a hit, everyone else was going to take a worse one. That's also why they were releasing fake videos of people dropping dead in the streets and in the middle of grocery stores.

 

[Madmick]

The bat caves are 1,500 kilometers from Wuhan. Why didn't the outbreak start there? Why did it start right next to a lab that turbo charges bat viruses?

The simple answer seems simple.

Did you stop to consider that no humans live in the bat cave?

Fauci helped secure the lab millions of dollars to collect the bat viruses. Lmao. What a shit show. Fauci had a cronie on record saying how easy it was to get a spike protein rigged to infect humans. December 2019.

What. The. Fuck.

If you're going to post incendiary claims like this you really need to provide a source.

 

[Madmick]

It “escaped”.

No it didn’t. They willfully allowed their citizens to board airplanes and spread it globally.

This was released.

You bigot CT nutter racist xenophobe, get that Alex Jones crap outta here.

This is the part that has me enraged. They didn’t allow any domestic flights from Wuhan, but allowed them to travel abroad while knowing about the infections. China needs to be sanctioned based on that alone, whether it originated in a lab or wet market or wherever. That doesn’t matter as much as this.

I'm not saying the initial leak was intentional, I'm saying spreading it to the rest of the world was. They got a several month head start on containing it in their own country, and didn't say a word about it until had been spreading for months everywhere else because they wanted to make damn sure if they took a hit, everyone else was going to take a worse one. That's also why they were releasing fake videos of people dropping dead in the streets and in the middle of grocery stores.

@floivanus, this is true, not a CT, and especially infuriating. The fact you believe this is more tinfoil is why this thread exists. Our own intelligence sources were the first to confirm this many months later. China knew there was an epidemic in their country, before the rest of the world had any idea what was going on, because of how tightly their media is locked down, and they did nothing to stop their own citizens from spreading it to the rest of the world. This is one of the greatest humanitarian crimes of the 21st century.

Otherwise, *sigh*, this thread really is showcasing how we deeply polarized we are in this country along partisan lines. It hurts us more than anyone else. People are either towing the normal talking points that have been blown up, sticking their fingers in their ears, pretending it's some sort of heresy to even discuss these possibilities, while as @Tairy Hesticles just posted on the first page, Politifact retracted their long-standing webpage deeming the Wuhan Lab Theory a "conspiracy theory". On the other side, you have some in here insisting this somehow validates the absurdly ignorant anti-science views on masks or lockdowns or other sensible measures Trump told them not to like. They're still determined to pretend the pandemic is "overblown"; some sort of business-as-usual seasonal infection. I assure you, this thread citing Fauci's softening on the lab theory do NOT validate those viewpoints.

 

[lifelessheap]

Did you stop to consider that no humans live in the bat cave?

If you're going to post incendiary claims like this you really need to provide a source.

Hey mad, why did the outbreak start next to a lab super charging bat viruses?

This thing is catchy? How could it make it so far without shitloads of people catching it?

Logic is a thing.

 

[Madmick]

Hey mad, why did the outbreak start next to a lab super charging bat viruses?

This thing is catchy? How could it make it so far without shitloads of people catching it?

Logic is a thing.

This isn't logic. This is just a guy who doesn't understand how viruses work bloviating in his own echo chamber.

 

[MicroBrew]

Do labs only have viruses they've created themselves, or do they have viruses found in nature that they study in the lab?

See that's the thing : it bugs me how the media ,and even Fauci , are talking about a lab leak as if that means the virus was engineered or modified in the lab, when it is totally plausbile that this virus is a naturally occuring virus that was taken to the lab for study.

A very similar virus was found in bats in a cave in Yunnan province , which is about 1000 miles away from the Wuhan lab and Seafood market. The Wuhan Inst. of Virology were studying coronaviruses from this cave.

 

[lifelessheap]

This isn't logic. This is just a guy who doesn't understand how viruses work bloviating in his own echo chamber.

Eh, you don't know shit and I hear no echoes. How are the echos up on that high horse?

A virus eminated feet from a lab that researched the exact type of virus.

Simple is simple. Gain of function is a million times easier in a lab vs nature and you know this. Know this. Know this. Know this.

Is there annekkkooo

 

[Wingslaught]

If you think that the Chinese government had the foresight to release a bioweapon onto its own population in anticipation that it would have a more negative impact on the rest of the world in a global economy where they make the majority of their money selling products to the countries that were even more negatively impacted, then why wouldn't they have found an easier way to be the global economic leader?

I don't for a second believe that we've been told the truth about what China knew and how they've used this virus to their advantage. Go back and read my posts in this thread arguing with people about that point. However, it is insane to think that China would create a bioweapon and release it on their own population, shut everything down for almost an entire year, and expect that it would benefit them in the long run. It's the equivalent of going all in on pocket 2's.

If the Chinese government is that good at destroying Western economies then they would have found a much better way to do it with much less risk involved. The reality is that they used this pandemic to their advantage after they were aware of it. I'm willing to bet that they will suffer some hefty consequences as a result.

The more that comes to light, the less likely countries are to trust China in the future. They played their hand, and they won in the short term, but they have obviously fucked the rest of the world on purpose. If they released this virus intentionally, they would have known this. If they were really able to manipulate the global economy like this, they would have been able to come up with a less risky plan to gain a bigger share. They simply used this pandemic as a skeezy way to gain short term returns, but they will suffer in the long run.

Taiwan numba wan

I think it's more likely that the virus leaked out unintentionally but was considered a potent bioweapon in development. Just look at the devastating, global impacts. It could be a biological Chernobyl.

 

[cleetus]

I don't think anyone is disputing that the NIH & NIAID under Fauci provided funding to the Wuhan Inst. of Virology. The dispute is in claiming the US provided funding for gain-of-function research.

That was the goblin's defense. He called gain of function something else. But that's EXACTLY what they were doing. Fucking semantic games.

 

[cleetus]

https://www.msn.com/en-in/news/othe...right-stand-with-anand-narasimhan/vi-BB1gzEFc

She's been saying this from day 1 of the CCP bioterror.

 

[SBJJ]

This isn't logic. This is just a guy who doesn't understand how viruses work bloviating in his own echo chamber.

Huh?

This is like saying a virus originated in the mountains of CA., but the first to catch it were in the bio lab in NV where said virus was being researched.

On this one, you are the one not using logic

 

[Madmick]

Huh?

This is like saying a virus originated in the mountains of CA., but the first to catch it were in the bio lab in NV where said virus was being researched.

On this one, you are the one not using logic

This is just it. We don't know for certain what happened in China. We sure as hell don't know the truth patient zero, and considering China's unwillingness to ever tell the truth, it's highly doubtful we ever will.

 

[SBJJ]

This is just it. We don't know for certain what happened in China. We sure as hell don't know the truth patient zero, and considering China's unwillingness to ever tell the truth, it's highly doubtful we ever will.

Egg Zakly!

But that is where logic comes into play.

And it's extremely illogical to still give any credence to the hap hazard excuse the CCP came up with on the fly that this came from a bat far far away....yet lab workers were at a minimum, some of the first infected. Lab workers working on this very virus!

If it walks like a COVID and it quacks like a COVID.

 

[Madmick]

Egg Zakly!

But that is where logic comes into play.

And it's extremely illogical to still give any credence to the hap hazard excuse the CCP came up with on the fly that this came from a bat far far away....yet lab workers were at a minimum, some of the first infected. Lab workers working on this very virus!

If it walks like a COVID and it quacks like a COVID.

If a bat infected an intermediary animal, particularly one transported to a distance market for consumption, it's entirely credible. You guys aren't thinking.

 

[ocean size]

Simple is simple. Gain of function is a million times easier in a lab vs nature and you know this.

Let's grant that gain of function is a million times easier in a lab: nature has more than a million times the bandwidth that a lab does - there are millions of animals to be infected, potentially with multiple coronaviruses simultaneously to allow recombination to occur.

If a bat infected an intermediary animal, particularly one transported to a distance market for consumption, it's entirely credible. You guys aren't thinking.

People are forgetting that while overall it was pretty similar to known bat strains, some sequences of SARS-CoV-2 were a good bit different, indicating likely years if not decades worth of differentiation and a most parsimonious explaination involving another animal besides a bat. So 'why wasn't it starting in a town near a bat cave' isn't a great question on its own.

Who knows— we could find out a pretty meh CoV leaked from the lab in 2018-19 and was endemic in the area for a while before naturally recombining in a market pangolin.

I think the biggest takeaway is anyone speaking in certainties is a dipshit or has an agenda (that isn't finding out the truth)