deadlift form check

Discussion in 'Strength & Conditioning Discussion' started by PWR1982, Sep 18, 2010.

  1. PWR1982

    PWR1982 Green Belt

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    There's conventional, snatch grip, and zercher deadlift in the video above. In conventional, I think the weight is not on my heels enough. Snatch grip and zercher, I really have no idea how those should be done properly, so I won't write anything.

    Also, I'm lowering the weight down extra slowly and using straps, because I have people living under me, we don't get on very well, and the floor isn't very strong... so even the smallest bump with the weights against the floor might cause me problems - and I really don't want to risk the bar falling out of my hands. I do additional grip training, so grip strength should be fine.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2010
  2. Tosa

    Tosa Red Belt

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    You're rushing the set-up, and not devloping any tension on the bar before the lift. You want to be in position to pull, with you with back (upper and lower) tight, exert 90% of the force you need to lift the bar...and then lift. Same thing for Snatch grip DLs.
     
  3. Brandon85

    Brandon85 Green Belt

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    I'll leave technique critique to those more knowledgeable than myself.

    Why don't you get some type of pads to put under the weights to help? Like a yoga mat or something?

    Tosa, what are the benefits to exerting 90% force prior to the pull?
     
  4. VoodooPlata

    VoodooPlata Brown Belt

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    I always try to exert something like 30% of the force needed to lift beforehand - my reasoning is that if i did 90% before the lift I could only develop 10% of the force with sufficient explosiveness but if i pull 30% then lift I can get 70 explosive %. Does that make sense to you? Is it a worse way of doing things?
     
  5. Tosa

    Tosa Red Belt

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    Not really. Explosiveness is about rate of force production / bar speed. Those things don't really matter until after the bar leaves the ground, unless your taking so long to get setup/tight that it's fatiguing you, and getting in the way of the lift...in which case your set-up is way to long, or your just not used to getting tight at the beginning of a lift.

    That said, I just write 90% because it gets the point across, it's not an exact thing. You want to have enough tension on the bar so that when the lift begins that there's no slack on the bar, there's no jerking motion, and the pull isn't sudden, causing any loss of tightness.

    It's like a que given to beginners sometimes...do the first inch of the pull real slow, then explode.

    It's about being very tight before the lift, and not lose that tightness by suddenly pulling.
     
  6. VoodooPlata

    VoodooPlata Brown Belt

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    Ok, thanks! My setup is pretty slow, but that has a lot to do with pacing back and forth, psyching and so forth... I know Louie Simmons once said not to do this, but I can't see myself lifting close to my max without getting good and aggressive beforehand. Which might be a bad thing.
     
  7. miaou

    miaou barely keeping it together

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    I agree with Tosa's advice. Breathe in, brace you core, get into position, tighten everything (especially lower-upper back), pull the slack off everything while feeling the weight on your heels, then pull.

    On some reps you do a half-assed lockout. Lock your knees and push your hips through (extend the hips, not the lower back).
     
  8. PWR1982

    PWR1982 Green Belt

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    I see... so I shouldn't do the stretch reflex thingy? I don't know if I can even call it that, I just feel stronger when I first lower my hips a bit, bend my arms, and then move them higher into my pulling positions, extending my arms, then pulling - or how do I do this while staying tight? Instead I should just get into what my pulling position will be, keep everything tight, pulling the bar just enough to not move it, and then pull?
     
  9. miaou

    miaou barely keeping it together

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    Everything from your fingers to your lower-back needs to stay tight as fuck. If you want to play around with your hip position, that's a different thing. But before you start any pulling, keep your core braced, your shoulders/scapulae pulled back and do not bend your fucking elbows.
     
  10. Cratos

    Cratos Banned Banned

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    Not for a deadlift.
     
  11. miaou

    miaou barely keeping it together

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    When you are deadlifting anything remotely heavy, you obviously are not going to be able to keep your scapulae fully retracted. When setting up, the "pull back" cue is to create a strong isometric contraction in the upper back. In order both for safety as well as for efficient force transfer through the kinetic chain you would need that, no?
     
  12. rckvl

    rckvl Blue Belt

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    "Mistake #2: Pulling the shoulder blades together

    This is a mistake I made for years. Stand in a deadlift stance and pull your shoulder blades together. Take a look at where your fingertips are. Now if you let your shoulders relax and even round forward a little you'll see your fingertips are much lower. This is why we teach a rounding of the upper back. First, the bar has to travel a shorter distance. Second, there's less stress on the shoulder region. It'll also help to keep your shoulder blades behind the bar. You'll read more on this later."
    -Dave Tate


    I don't know of any good deadlifters that advocate trying to keep your scapulae retracted during the deadlift.
     
  13. miaou

    miaou barely keeping it together

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    Yeah, I can't argue with Tate's advice on the deadlift!
     
  14. Cratos

    Cratos Banned Banned

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    What about guys who deadlift with a rounded thoracic spine?
     
  15. rckvl

    rckvl Blue Belt

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    Sarcasm doesn't suit you. I'm always open to learn new things, but you have yet to present a convincing reason as to why one would want to retract their scapulae at the start of a deadlift. You can keep plenty tight without doing that.
     
  16. miaou

    miaou barely keeping it together

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    That wasn't sarcasm. Tate's experience on deadlifting is around 1000x mine. There are sources stating that upper back should be extended and scapulae should be retracted, so I always took that for granted and didn't really take the time to question it.

    Tate is actually mistaken when he says that if you don't pull the shoulder blades back "the bar has to travel a shorter distance" (the distance the bar has to travel is only affected by the shoulder position in the lockout, and the shoulders need to be back for that), but his point that allowing for upper back rounding results in less stress on the shoulder girdle makes much sense.
     
  17. Cratos

    Cratos Banned Banned

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    For DLs or the Oly lifts?
     
  18. miaou

    miaou barely keeping it together

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  19. Tosa

    Tosa Red Belt

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    While upper back rounding doesn't change the distance the bar has to travel, it improves the leverages for the pull off the ground. The downside is it means more upper back strength is needed to lock out the lift.
     
  20. scoopj

    scoopj ackson

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    PWR, the cue I've heard is to squeeze the bar off of the floor; don't jerk it.
     

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