Could DC have been a GOAT if he stayed at HW?

DC would be successful no matter what he did. The guy is an incredible fighter
 
chinarice said:
Regardless of DC saying Cain was better, there is no point in their careers I would have picked Cain over DC had they ever fought. I watched the entirety of both their careers and always felt DC was better
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He was more durable. He could take whatever came,stay active and come back for more,regardless of weight class. I have nothing but respect for Cain,but DC actually achieved the long term potential that we didnt get to see from Cain consistently.
 
mkt said:
What? Mir had nothing for him. Mir's wrestling was too weak to ever get DC on the ground and DC wins the stand up every time.
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Yes,this is silly.
 
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achoo42 said:
What do you guys think?
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Cormier > 2014 Werdum
Cormier = 2015 Velasquez
Cormier < 2016 Miocic
Cormier <= 2016 Overeem
Cormier > 2017 JDS
Cormier > 2018 Ngannou

By the end of 2018 before the Lewis fight, Cormier sustained a back injury which effectively ended his career, so that's a good stopping point.

I think at best, Cormier could've gotten 7 top ten ranked wins at Heavyweight (Silva, Barnett, Mir, Werdum, Overeem, JDS, Ngannou) and been ranked at #5 among all Pride/UFC Heavyweight champions, but he wouldn't have been the HW GOAT.

Fight Professor said:
Most of his HW wins are solid but not top fighters like Bigfoot, Mir, Barnett and Big Country.
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Cormier currently 5 top ten ranked wins at Heavyweight, which makes him tied (w/ Barnett) at 10th most top ten ranked wins amongst all Pride/UFC Heavyweight champions; the majority of most champions' wins aren't against top ten ranked opponents, so this isn't something unique to Cormier.

#6 Antonio Silva
#8 Josh Barnett
#7 Frank Mir
#1 Stipe Miocic
#5 Derrick Lewis

https://forums.sherdog.com/threads/...st-top-10-ranked-wins-at-heavyweight.4148848/
 
achoo42 said:
Come on, Barnett, Mir, and Bigfoot weren't top heavyweights? Mir had just fought for the title before fighting DC, and shattered Big Nog's arm, knocked out Cro Cop, etc. Barnett was on a 8 fight win streak which includes finishing Sergei Kharitonov, also arguably a top 10 HW at the time. TRT Bigfoot was a monster who was 16-2 and had wins over Fedor, Arlovski, and would still go on to finish Overeem and Browne before his tragic skid.

Also Big Country wasn't a top heavyweight per se but he was good, better than many give him credit for, and DC ran circles around him.
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They were good, but not top. Mir breaking Nog's arm by luck is your parameter? The man was being beaten in the entire fight and got lucky because Nog's dumb pride, that's the truth. Bigfoot could be considered very good, but top just because he beat Fedor and Overeem? Slow AF, but ok, he could be considered almost a top guy just because those two. But Barnett being top is a joke.

I mean, don't get me wrong, but we can't over rate DC's HW opponents. He was good and his opponents were good at the most. The best one was Stipe (a real top guy) and probably was a fluke because of vicious eye pokes that became proved in the other two, when even with eye poke dirty tactics Stipe owned him. The problem was strength of competition, his own size and Cain being champ. And maybe timing, because unfortunately to fight at LHW and being fully successful there Jones shouldn't exist in the first place.
 
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Sincere Guy said:
They were good, but not top. Mir breaking Nog's arm by luck is your parameter? The man was being beaten in the entire fight and got lucky because Nog's dumb pride, that's the truth. Bigfoot could be considered very good, but top just because he beat Fedor and Overeem? Slow AF, but ok, he could be considered almost a top guy just because those two. But Barnett being top is a joke.

I mean, don't get me wrong, but we can't over rate DC's HW opponents. He was good and his opponents were good at the most. The best one was Stipe (a real top guy) and probably was a fluke because of vicious eye pokes that became proved in the other two, when even with eye poke dirty tactics Stipe owned him. The problem was strength of competition, his own size and Cain being champ.
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I agree Nogueira was beating Mir's ass and is a better fighter....but..I dont think Mir got "lucky because nog's dumb pride"

Nogueira just wasnt slick with his submissions as he used to be. He probably would have gotten that if it had been 5 yrs previous. You cant just supress that submission instinct even when your declining. Same thing happened with Texiera with Jiri. The older guys get,alot of the time they just lose that slickness with their submissions...but it doesnt mean they can just stop going for them in the heat of battle. Thats just how they fight.
 
Fight Professor said:
I completely forgot about the Lewis fight.
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Man i was worried for DC in that fight cos of the injuries he had coming into it,and it being short notice...but he got 4 mil for doing it...and it turned out to be a rather easy 4 mil to earn in the end.
 
HHJ said:
I agree Nogueira was beating Mir's ass and is a better fighter....but..I dont think Mir got "lucky because nog's dumb pride"

Nogueira just wasnt slick with his submissions as he used to be. He probably would have gotten that if it had been 5 yrs previous. You cant just supress that submission instinct even when your declining. Same thing happened with Texiera with Jiri. The older guys get,alot of the time they just lose that slickness with their submissions...but it doesnt mean they can just stop going for them in the heat of battle. Thats just how they fight.
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Man, you can watch it again how many times you want, seriously. Nog could gnp Mir to death and win the fight comfortably, but he tried to submit him because of that stupid "BEST HW BJJ" pride. Why he went for the submission in the first place? Watch how many times you want, the veredict asking that is the same. Nog was always proud AF.
 
Sincere Guy said:
Man, you can watch it again how many times you want, seriously. Nog could gnp Mir to death and win the fight comfortably, but he tried to submit him because of that stupid "BEST HW BJJ" pride. Why he went for the submission in the first place? Watch how many times you want, the veredict asking that is the same. Nog was always proud AF.
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Nogueira stopped GnPing Mir in the 2nd bout because Herb Dean warned Nog about hitting the back of Mir's head, when he wasn't hitting the back of Mir's head. The refereeing in that bout directly changed how Nog was fighting... the result is the result, and congrats to Mir for taking advantage of the situation given to him, but the bout definitely could have ended a different way.
 
Taric said:
Tim Sylvia has 5 titles. Congrats on being less accomplished than Sylvia when your talent level was much greater.
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If DC had started MMA straight out of college and fought during the Randy era, he would have been the GOAT HW no doubt about it. Or at least approaching Fedor level.
 
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Taric said:
Nogueira stopped GnPing Mir in the 2nd bout because Herb Dean warned Nog about hitting the back of Mir's head, when he wasn't hitting the back of Mir's head. The refereeing in that bout directly changed how Nog was fighting.
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Come on man lol. The question continues: why Nogueira went for the submission instead of gnp from hell? Like I said to HHJ, you can watch many times you want and the question stays the same. Nog lost the fight by being dumb and Mir by being smart, that's simple. Nog should never go for the submission in that situation in the first place, beating Mir easily in the entire fight like that.
 
achoo42 said:
If DC had started MMA straight out of college and fought during the Randy era, he would have been the GOAT HW no doubt about it. Or at least approaching Fedor level.
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Agreed.
 
Sincere Guy said:
Come on man lol. The question continues: why Nogueira went for the submission instead of gnp from hell? Like I said to HHJ, you can watch many times you want and the question stays the same.
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Cos thats what he does.

It's like ingrained in his DNA to snatch necks and wrists.
 
HHJ said:
Cos thats what he does.

It's like ingrained in his DNA to snatch necks and wrists.
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And went reckless and lost. Like, for free. Like I said, wrong decisions leads to wrong results.
 
Taric said:
I literally just told you. He stopped GnPing the moment Herb gave him a warning about back of the head. Nog shifted to a submission seconds later, and he paid for it.
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It has nothing to do with it.
 
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