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Because they weren't that good.Why did Aldo, Anderson Silva, and Matt Hughes get subbed in their careers early?
Because they weren't that good.Why did Aldo, Anderson Silva, and Matt Hughes get subbed in their careers early?
Brilliant article...these are threads I joined sherdog for. I would never have come across this otherwise.
Thanks for the translation, much appreciated.
This part is awesome -
"He knows how to impose himself as a remarkable fighter - something necessary - in combat sports "
You don't really want a guy this good and this promising to fall to the likes of Siver just so his fans will shut up, do you??
All of these breakdowns don't mean shit until he fights a legitimately elite fighter.
Why did Aldo, Anderson Silva, and Matt Hughes get subbed in their careers early?
This 100x. Look, I get how people don't like his attitude (I personally love his mentality about MA in general) and want him to lose for that, but I think his style and potential is so great that I don't want him to lose; I want him to continue evolving and be breath of fresh air this sport desperately needs right now.
I think a lot of people root/watch MMA just for some forum agenda here, i.e. to laugh at people going crazy at Conor losing. I'd much rather hold out hope that he can be the most diverse MMA striker we've ever seen.
Ain't no shame in losing to a prime Hughes. He's the 2nd or 3rd greatest WW of all time. That's a lot different that tapping to some dude no one's ever heard of.GSP too, in his 8th fight he fought for the WW strap and got subbed by Hughes via armbar with 1 second left in the 1st round. He went on to become the greatest Welterweight fighter of all time and arguably the greatest fighter P4P in history.
Idiots that mention his two submission losses are really reaching. The last one happened over 4 years ago and the one before that happened over 6 1/2 years ago. He's been on the ground since, most notably with Brandao who is a legit BJJ black belt and very active and aggressive with hunting for submissions, and Conor looked knowledgeable and composed. His TDD looked great too against a guy with a high TD accuracy and TDD (and Conor reversed his TD and took him down).
In fight years 4+ years is a very long time. It's like comparing the version of Gustafsson that was a part-time fighter when he lost by sub to Phil Davis back then to the fighter he is now (or the version that fought Jones). It's ignorant and not even slightly accurate since both Gustafsson and Conor have improved so much in these areas since.
This 100x. Look, I get how people don't like his attitude (I personally love his mentality about MA in general) and want him to lose for that, but I think his style and potential is so great that I don't want him to lose; I want him to continue evolving and be breath of fresh air this sport desperately needs right now.
I think a lot of people root/watch MMA just for some forum agenda here, i.e. to laugh at people going crazy at Conor losing. I'd much rather hold out hope that he can be the most diverse MMA striker we've ever seen.
They weren't. They became great, but Conor has yet to fight any greats or even gatekeepers. He's unproven.
This all damn day.
I've always found it absurd that people root against a fighter because of their fans. It's literally hipster MMA fandom. Disliking something purely because it's popular or because you think you're somehow "better" than the other fans.
I can understand Conor's brash personality and confidence putting some people off, but how can you not be a fan of his fighting style? Why on earth would you want such an interesting and exciting fighter to lose? Just so you can marvel at the anonymous "butthurt" on an internet forum?
That's fucking weird, IMO.
Ain't no shame in losing to a prime Hughes. He's the 2nd or 3rd greatest WW of all time. That's a lot different that tapping to some dude no one's ever heard of.
Here is my assesment (from another thread)
MMA fighters are very predictale (even Jon Jones despite all the obnoxious "hes so creative" hype is very predictable - oblique kick, eye rake, oblique kick, some spinning shit. Fighters just arent able to get past his reach or dont know how to deal with Jones' clinch once they do)
MMA fighters always throw the same combos, hardly ever lead with a good jab, and dont even move their heads. Jon Jones in perticular has terrible head movement and terrible offensive and defensive boxing
Conor is so ahead of where everyone else is at right now in MMA striking. Conor knows, "ok, if i move this way or do that, the opponent will likely react or counter this way, and I will counter or respond like this." (Conor is such a student of fighting) Conor will even take it a step further and bait the reaction he wants while hes already thinking ahead to the couner and pouncing on it. Conor is always STEPS ahead of his opponents.Its like its a game of chess and Conor is Bobby Fischer compared to everyone else in MMA striking or on a checkers board Conor is already thinking 3 moves ahead
When you really look at Conor's skill set objectively, hes amazing.
1. Conor's meat and potatoes boxing alone is fantastic
-You see Conor probing his lead hand to distract to get shots through or to bait countering oppurtunties, like a high level boxer would
-You see Conor doing pull away counters like a high level boxer would (pulling back from a punch or slipping it and than countering with a straight)
-You see Conor always coming in behind his jab like a high level boxer would. His two step feint- up jab or rising jab to left straight is killer.
-You see Conor with nice straight punches with his lead shoulder hiding his chin (again another example of Conor maintaining good defensive responsibility)
In boxing, an important saying is, a great offense HAS BUILT in defense, and thats what you see in Conor when he punches with his chin tucked hiding behind his lead shoulder to deflect or when he does a spinning kick with perfect balance and timing amd instanly returns to position to defend
However despite all that, theres still more things Conor can learn from what high level boxers in boxing are doing
Like when an opponent stands tall covering up, the best thing to do is to step to either side and create a flank from an angle. Always gets through. Thats how Conor can use his movement to directly create openings
Also, using feints more. Fient are great to first guage opponents reactions. Once you can see how the opponent reacts, you can start playing him and creating countering oppurtunties off fients etc
As for Conor's kicks, his kicks are so damn beautiful. Recently Conor has even been using flashy kicks as a way to bait opponents to come after him. Conor is literally an MMA striking genuis. He puts it all together so beautifully.
Conor's boxing is leagues above anyone else in the UFC. His kickboxing his leagues above anyone else and he mixes and matches both so beautifully in a full display of MMA striking. Conor IS the evolution of MMA striking
Conor IS the greatest striker ive ever seen in MMA history and its not an exaggeration nor is it even up for debate in my opinion, until some one else comes along and shows more skills/or a well rounded striking skill set
Connor is nothing but pure unadulterated skill. Watching Conor strike is almost like watching striking porn
It's not missing the point. You're assuming because GSP, Hughes, and Silva developed into greats, that Conor will too. How many broken promises have you seen over the years? It seems like every six months, there's a new fighter with "unlimited" potential that ends up falling short. Look at guys like Erick Silva, Stefan Struve, Brendan Schaub, Ryan Bader, Demian Maia; the list goes on and on. You people fall for the UFC hype train over and over again.Nice way to miss the point on purpose. The grappling skill level (or lack thereof) at the time these fighters subbed GSP and Conor doesn't matter. The point is that both improved a ton in that area after several years passed, in Conor's case it's been over 4 years since it happened. Back then he had no sufficient takedown defense or submission defense. You can clearly see this in those fights. Since then he's developed a great sprawl and good TDD in the clinch (both of which he proved against Brandao) and a good ground game (which he also proved against Brandao who is a legit BJJ black belt). He even has a submission win and that was back in his second to last Cage Warriors fight against a BJJ-based fighter.
It's not missing the point. You're assuming because GSP, Hughes, and Silva developed into greats, that Conor will too. How many broken promises have you seen over the years? It seems like every six months, there's a new fighter with "unlimited" potential that ends up falling short. Look at guys like Erick Silva, Stefan Struve, Brendan Schaub, Ryan Bader, Demian Maia; the list goes on and on. You people fall for the UFC hype train over and over again.
Great post my brother: )Great post, you make some very good points. I agree with all of it. When Dustin was standing tallish and covering (shelling) with his guard Conor wasn't happy with that left hook that dropped him. He looks very displeased with it every time he sees the footage. He said he should've went with the uppercut instead, which would've allowed him to cut through his guard from beneath it, as we've seen happen plenty in MMA (due to the smaller gloves particularly). He said "the uppercut would've been a better shot" and is always critiquing his own performances. Behavior like that means he's obsessed with training, fighting and perfection. And guys like that, with his skill and athletic ability, make it to the top more often than not. He's OCD about his performances and definitely a perfectionist if I've ever seen one in MMA.
As good as he is now, I think within the next 2-3 years he's going to be a lot better. One of his most effective combos you mentioned, his lead right upjab/uppercut to left straight is beautiful and he's been using it for a really long time, at least since he fought in Cage Warriors. When his opponents study tape on him they've no doubt seen it but can't do much to stop it, and they know it's coming. They know his left hand is coming and they still get tagged with it because he can disguise it well with setups and utilize proper timing with it. It's a testament to his skill.