Economy Chinese EV producer BYD overtakes rival Tesla with over $100 billion USD in annual sales

Tesla isn't the one as far as EVs go.

It's already dead because it's "head of state"-equivalent decided to go premium because he's a rich asshole with no understanding of international competition. He wanted toys, the world wanted affordability.

Musk is at turns a genius and a dunce. He's going to cripple Tesla, but I wouldn't worry about it too much, the west will just get another "General Motors" to back before too long and fail with that too because rich assholes can't prioritize value.
you are wrong here, the value systems of consumers isnt even value based, and a good reason why prices are out of control everywhere, people want good stuff, and in china, they appreciate the tech more than americans. for a chinese person to buy a luxury vehicle, you gotta be the top 5-10 percent, that car is impossibly expensive for for the chinese where the average income is $7000 a year, yet the luxury segment in china is littered with tesla.

people's value system has changed over time, if it stayed the same, the toyota corolla would be america's top seller, but it's not..... americans love their trucks, gas flavor, EV's just dont work as well due to the hauling requirements, and the reason for Trumpian strategies, we sell like 2M trucks a year in america, it'll be a long time before that segment goes electric, most of the electrics dont have the range truck buyers want or they're too expensive in that heavily price sensitive market. In some texas areas, it's so darn truck infested that the majority of men you meet, you simply assume they own a truck and you'd be right.
 
you are wrong here, the value systems of consumers isnt even value based, and a good reason why prices are out of control everywhere, people want good stuff, and in china, they appreciate the tech more than americans. for a chinese person to buy a luxury vehicle, you gotta be the top 5-10 percent, that car is impossibly expensive for for the chinese where the average income is $7000 a year, yet the luxury segment in china is littered with tesla.

people's value system has changed over time, if it stayed the same, the toyota corolla would be america's top seller, but it's not..... americans love their trucks, gas flavor, EV's just dont work as well due to the hauling requirements, and the reason for Trumpian strategies, we sell like 2M trucks a year in america, it'll be a long time before that segment goes electric, most of the electrics dont have the range truck buyers want or they're too expensive in that heavily price sensitive market. In some texas areas, it's so darn truck infested that the majority of men you meet, you simply assume they own a truck and you'd be right.

I wasn't talking about trucks, I was talking about EVs and the international market. US companies already lost to Japan, now it's China.

Big ugly trucks dont make any sense from a frugality standpoint, I get that, and it's definitely part of the American consciousness, I'm not denying that, but it's not a thing anywhere else.

My opinion is, globally, Toyota and BYD will win out.
 
So the CCP brand is the top selling brand in China now? Shocking

I suppose the left thinks they had something to do with this?
What does your dream world version of left vs. right wingers have to do with this?

Oh right, you're one of those clowns that pretend criticsm of Musk or Trump is rooted in ideology and can't have anything to do with them being shitty people who do shitty things to make life harder for anyone who isn't rich like them.

If you weren't focused on just being an asshole whose only goal in the WR is to "trigger the libs", you might have just commented that BYDs sales are driven in large part by anti-competitive price subsidies handed to them by the Chinese government, and consequently, sales volume does not necessarily reflect accurately how competitve they'd be with a level playing field.

Not saying I disgree with @Sweater of AV's posts immediately above, but at least that's a legit observation and not patheic mewling about an imagined partisan grievance.

Edit: I didn't realize this was a necro or I wouldn't have bothered. The point stands nevertheless.
 
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Meanwhile our government is killing innocent people for oil. How long is it going to be until the rest of the world looks to China for leadership? They clearly are more focused on the long term future by investing in this technology instead of looking backwards like the USA
 
What does your dream world version of left vs. right wingers have to do with this?

Oh right, you're one of those clowns that pretend criticsm of Musk or Trump is rooted in ideology and can't have anything to do with them being shitty people who do shitty things to make life harder for anyone who isn't rich like them.

If you weren't focused on just being an asshole whose only goal in the WR is to "trigger the libs", you might have just commented that BYDs sales are driven in large part by anti-competitive price subsidies handed to them by the Chinese government, and consequently, sales volume does not necessarily reflect accurately how competitve they'd be with a level playing field.

Not saying I disgree with @Sweater of AV's posts immediately above, but at least that's a legit observation and not patheic mewling about an imagined partisan grievance.

Edit: I didn't realize this was a necro or I wouldn't have bothered. The point stands nevertheless.

To be honest, I don't really have a dog in this fight. I'm mainly just amused to see how this unfolds, especially within the context of Musk's antics.

Also, I think it's pretty clear both sides are benefitting from various forms of protectionist policies. It's humorous when each side accuses the other of things that are basically happening on home soil. The excuses and mental gymnastics being made are great. Overall, I'd actually be surprised if BYD retains their spot at the top for very long. The competition in China seems to be pretty fierce and there are quite a few solid options these days. Tesla could also come back strong.
 
Tesla is having their iRobot moment.
Not quite as bad, because there's no (Amazon) buy out being blocked by antitrust legislation, but their brand value has tanked and their development has still stalled, while the competition has gone from strength to strength.
 
Tbf from what I understand the tech in these Chinese vehicles is overtaking Tesla.

I wouldn't buy either personally though.
Their Subcompact sedan entry in South Eas Asia is a deal breaker as it is much cheaper than the Teslas and it is a plugin HeV.

Seal 5 Dmi or Seal destroyer.
 
Their Subcompact sedan entry in South Eas Asia is a deal breaker as it is much cheaper than the Teslas and it is a plugin HeV.

Seal 5 Dmi or Seal destroyer.

The number of people that I know that have gone electric in the last 5 years is crazy.
Including petrol heads. Although they haven't given up the petrol guzzlers as their "toys", the electrics are now their daily suburban runabouts.
One of them drove from Brisbane to Adelaide (2000kms) after buying a dual motor, long range Polestar 3. That would barely have been possible due to the lack of infrastructure pre covid.
Since Tesla cut prices, I see them everywhere as well. Definitely more BYDs and MGs though. Electrics were rare in traffic a decade ago, now they're everywhere.

Quality on the Chinese cars has also come along nicely. Faster than we saw with Korean cars. I'd say my friend's BYD feels cheaper than it's actual price, but all the electric cars I've been in have.
The apps and interfaces didn't seem as polished as the Teslas I've been in, but the finish was better. Materials are about the same. In terms of styling and materials, they remind me of cars like a Toyota Camry or Nissan X-Trail, but with the highest spec trim level. Have a touch of weird flare, like with some weirdly elaborate internal lighting and tail lights. The Chinese brands seem to have an odd idea of conspicuous consumption.

I'm two wheels only, and even I've gone Chinese electric. Sort of.
Not the motorcycles, but I converted one of my deadly treadlies to an electric runabout with a Bafang BBS02 750W motor (although limited with a switchable "250W" "onroad" mode and stickers to comply with local laws) and 20AH 48v (Samsung cell) Hailong battery.
Just made sense as a cheap runabout to cut through congested traffic on my daily commute (I'm further from work than I used to be, and it's getting harder to split lanes on the motorcycle with all the tradies in fat arse yank tanks these days). Mostly using the battery on the way in and working up a sweat on the way home.
 
The number of people that I know that have gone electric in the last 5 years is crazy.
Including petrol heads. Although they haven't given up the petrol guzzlers as their "toys", the electrics are now their daily suburban runabouts.
One of them drove from Brisbane to Adelaide (2000kms) after buying a dual motor, long range Polestar 3. That would barely have been possible due to the lack of infrastructure pre covid.
Since Tesla cut prices, I see them everywhere as well. Definitely more BYDs and MGs though. Electrics were rare in traffic a decade ago, now they're everywhere.

Quality on the Chinese cars has also come along nicely. Faster than we saw with Korean cars. I'd say my friend's BYD feels cheaper than it's actual price, but all the electric cars I've been in have.
The apps and interfaces didn't seem as polished as the Teslas I've been in, but the finish was better. Materials are about the same. In terms of styling and materials, they remind me of cars like a Toyota Camry or Nissan X-Trail, but with the highest spec trim level. Have a touch of weird flare, like with some weirdly elaborate internal lighting and tail lights. The Chinese brands seem to have an odd idea of conspicuous consumption.

I'm two wheels only, and even I've gone Chinese electric. Sort of.
Not the motorcycles, but I converted one of my deadly treadlies to an electric runabout with a Bafang BBS02 750W motor (although limited with a switchable "250W" "onroad" mode and stickers to comply with local laws) and 20AH 48v (Samsung cell) Hailong battery.
Just made sense as a cheap runabout to cut through congested traffic on my daily commute (I'm further from work than I used to be, and it's getting harder to split lanes on the motorcycle with all the tradies in fat arse yank tanks these days). Mostly using the battery on the way in and working up a sweat on the way home.

Even here in Manila there are now electric taxis by Vinfast and BYD.


The BYD Seal 5 is priced here at 1,000,000 pesos and it is direct competition price wise to Toyotas best seller here the Vios which is practically the subcompact version of the corolla. The seal 5 dmi feels more premium than the Vios with sift touch pannels and overall better tech the Vios to trim selling at 1million php does not even have a rear climate vent and just a regular 4 cylinder 1.5 litre engine no hybrid.

I am a sort of a petrolhead my self but with price of gas these days I see why it would be practical to daily an EV.
 
Even here in Manila there are now electric taxis by Vinfast and BYD.


The BYD Seal 5 is priced here at 1,000,000 pesos and it is direct competition price wise to Toyotas best seller here the Vios which is practically the subcompact version of the corolla. The seal 5 dmi feels more premium than the Vios with sift touch pannels and overall better tech the Vios to trim selling at 1million php does not even have a rear climate vent and just a regular 4 cylinder 1.5 litre engine no hybrid.

I am a sort of a petrolhead my self but with price of gas these days I see why it would be practical to daily an EV.

We mostly get the hatchback version of the Vios I think. The Yaris. Cheapest is a 1.5L 3-cyl Hybrid (85kW combined power) for just over $33K AUD. Top spec is a 1.6L turbo 3-cyl AWD putting out 221 KW and costing @$70K AUD.
Cheapest BYD is the ATTO 1 at $26-27K AUD. 65KW 175Nm electric motor and 30kWh battery.
Price and running costs, it's no competition. Not sure how it'll work out with depreciation and total cost of ownership though.
 
We mostly get the hatchback version of the Vios I think. The Yaris. Cheapest is a 1.5L 3-cyl Hybrid (85kW combined power) for just over $33K AUD. Top spec is a 1.6L turbo 3-cyl AWD putting out 221 KW and costing @$70K AUD.
Cheapest BYD is the ATTO 1 at $26-27K AUD. 65KW 175Nm electric motor and 30kWh battery.
Price and running costs, it's no competition. Not sure how it'll work out with depreciation and total cost of ownership though.
With a 30kwh battery, that must be a major downside, might be a sour taste for first time buyers
 
We mostly get the hatchback version of the Vios I think. The Yaris. Cheapest is a 1.5L 3-cyl Hybrid (85kW combined power) for just over $33K AUD. Top spec is a 1.6L turbo 3-cyl AWD putting out 221 KW and costing @$70K AUD.
Cheapest BYD is the ATTO 1 at $26-27K AUD. 65KW 175Nm electric motor and 30kWh battery.
Price and running costs, it's no competition. Not sure how it'll work out with depreciation and total cost of ownership though.
Australia must not impose the high tarriffs Canada and the US do to counter subsidization by the Chinese government.
The Canadian government, instead of relaxing duties and other trade barriers on Chinese EVs, lowered its target for EV car adoption. People are buying fewer new cars to begin with (cars tend to last longer here than they did in decades past) and EVs are said to be too expensive relative to gasmobiles.


"Even after recent price cuts, the Model Y runs for about $64,000, while the Model 3 is about $68,000. The next most popular EV models in Canada, Volkswagen's ID.4 and the Ford Mustang Mach-E, run for $49,000 and $55,690, respectively."



"Price has been one of the reasons Canadians haven't embraced EVs as enthusiastically as Europeans. When you consider that popular internal combustion engine (ICE) vehicles like the Honda Civic, Ford Escape and Nissan Rogue go for about $30,000, the cost of switching to an EV can be prohibitive.

Rachel Doran, executive director of Clean Energy Canada, says her organization did a survey last fall that brought this into stark relief.

"In a jurisdiction like the EU, you could choose from no less than 11 different options for a purchase price of $45,000 Cdn," she told CBC News. That includes models like the Smart EQ Fortwo, Citroën ë-C3 and Dacia Spring. "In Canada, it was just two — the Chevy Bolt, which was discontinued in 2023 and only just reannounced for return to Canada for the 2027 model year, and the Fiat 500 E.""


"One of the big stories in recent years is the ascendance of Chinese-made EVs, particularly from the company BYD, which has overtaken Tesla as the world's biggest EV manufacturer.

Not only that, but BYD offers vehicles as low as $10,000 US (around $13,800 Cdn). However, last year, the Canadian government followed the U.S.'s lead in placing 100 per cent tariffs on Chinese EVs, saying they were unfairly subsidized.

Some drivers might say that even with such a hefty tariff, a vehicle that cheap could be worth pursuing. But Doran cautions that anyone trying to acquire a BYD or any other Chinese brand in Canada would have to contend with the additional costs of safety certification and shipping.

"It doesn't appear that Chinese EVs are a viable product here under current conditions," she said.

Adams says it's legitimate for Canadians to question the government's strategy.

"It's always a balancing act between what might be good for consumers and what's good for the economy," he said, noting the federal government has spent $50 billion attracting foreign direct investment, primarily to Ontario, for the manufacture of electric vehicles, batteries and battery components.

"That is the future of automotive, and they're trying to ensure that has some chance of succeeding here," said Adams. "If we allowed the Chinese vehicles into the Canadian marketplace, that would sort of be the end of our automotive industry as we transition to EVs, because the Chinese are about 15 to 20 years ahead of us.""


It's pretty wild to me that they're coming right out and effectively saying, screw the environment, protectionism is the way to go.
 
With a 30kwh battery, that must be a major downside, might be a sour taste for first time buyers
Can't say I know anyone that owns one. Plenty of people that have vehicles strictly as (sub)urban run abouts and shopping trolleys though, and given the depreciation of electric cars I assume they'll be popular used with the next generation of "L" platers. Provided they aren't completely useless once the 6yr/150,000km warranty expires. It's marketed as a "City Car", targeted at kids, and if that's all people expect from it then they probably won't keep headbutting it's limitations.
There is also a "Premium" upgrade uption with a 43kWh battery and 115kW motor for about $30K AUD drive away.

"Kids" skateboarding.

collage-1.jpg
 
Australia must not impose the high tarriffs Canada and the US do to counter subsidization by the Chinese government.
The Canadian government, instead of relaxing duties and other trade barriers on Chinese EVs, lowered its target for EV car adoption. People are buying fewer new cars to begin with (cars tend to last longer here than they did in decades past) and EVs are said to be too expensive relative to gasmobiles.


"Even after recent price cuts, the Model Y runs for about $64,000, while the Model 3 is about $68,000. The next most popular EV models in Canada, Volkswagen's ID.4 and the Ford Mustang Mach-E, run for $49,000 and $55,690, respectively."



"Price has been one of the reasons Canadians haven't embraced EVs as enthusiastically as Europeans. When you consider that popular internal combustion engine (ICE) vehicles like the Honda Civic, Ford Escape and Nissan Rogue go for about $30,000, the cost of switching to an EV can be prohibitive.

Rachel Doran, executive director of Clean Energy Canada, says her organization did a survey last fall that brought this into stark relief.

"In a jurisdiction like the EU, you could choose from no less than 11 different options for a purchase price of $45,000 Cdn," she told CBC News. That includes models like the Smart EQ Fortwo, Citroën ë-C3 and Dacia Spring. "In Canada, it was just two — the Chevy Bolt, which was discontinued in 2023 and only just reannounced for return to Canada for the 2027 model year, and the Fiat 500 E.""


"One of the big stories in recent years is the ascendance of Chinese-made EVs, particularly from the company BYD, which has overtaken Tesla as the world's biggest EV manufacturer.

Not only that, but BYD offers vehicles as low as $10,000 US (around $13,800 Cdn). However, last year, the Canadian government followed the U.S.'s lead in placing 100 per cent tariffs on Chinese EVs, saying they were unfairly subsidized.

Some drivers might say that even with such a hefty tariff, a vehicle that cheap could be worth pursuing. But Doran cautions that anyone trying to acquire a BYD or any other Chinese brand in Canada would have to contend with the additional costs of safety certification and shipping.

"It doesn't appear that Chinese EVs are a viable product here under current conditions," she said.

Adams says it's legitimate for Canadians to question the government's strategy.

"It's always a balancing act between what might be good for consumers and what's good for the economy," he said, noting the federal government has spent $50 billion attracting foreign direct investment, primarily to Ontario, for the manufacture of electric vehicles, batteries and battery components.

"That is the future of automotive, and they're trying to ensure that has some chance of succeeding here," said Adams. "If we allowed the Chinese vehicles into the Canadian marketplace, that would sort of be the end of our automotive industry as we transition to EVs, because the Chinese are about 15 to 20 years ahead of us.""


It's pretty wild to me that they're coming right out and effectively saying, screw the environment, protectionism is the way to go.

Most of our tariffs are on luxury cars and sports cars. The other end of the market.
 
I wasn't talking about trucks, I was talking about EVs and the international market. US companies already lost to Japan, now it's China.

Big ugly trucks dont make any sense from a frugality standpoint, I get that, and it's definitely part of the American consciousness, I'm not denying that, but it's not a thing anywhere else.

My opinion is, globally, Toyota and BYD will win out.
From a car makers perspective, trucks are easier and cheaper to make than a sedan and returns a higher profit. So they market and pimp out the trucks as much as they can.

I hear you can walk across the border to Mexico and buy a BYD snf drive mack. Not sure if this is true or not.
 
Even more competition for Tesla, who, unlike Waymo, still haven't released 1 fully autonomous vehicle.


  • Nvidia on Monday unveiled plans to launch a robotaxi service with a partner as soon as 2027, highlighting the chipmaker’s ambition to become a major player in the world of self-driving cars.
  • The service would be offered with a partner and would employ cars with “Level 4” driving, meaning they’d be capable of driving without human intervention in pre-defined regions.
  • Nvidia CEO Jensen Huang has said that robotics — including self-driving cars — is the company’s second most important growth category after AI.

 
They are investing heavily in green technologies as a whole, not just EVs. Meanwhile, the US is ruled by warmonger psychopaths and dumbasses who don't believe in climate change.
 
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