International Canada's spending on defence falls well short of NATO target of 2% of GDP

[Andy Capp]

Like the title says, there's no doot aboot it; even with new spending recently announced, we're still not hitting that target--although they claim future spending not yet approved (or announced) will bring them up to the target in future months. Trudeau seems intent on moving like a snail when it comes to increases in our spending. According to some sources, the new spending the Liberals have announced will still only bring us up to 1.6% from 1.3% in 2023. Trudeau has been in office since 2014 so this must be solely his fault, right? Useless motherfucker.


Oh wait,

DeepDive: Just how bad is Canada’s defence spending problem? Downright disastrous—with little hope in sight

thehub.ca

Historically, Canada was a relatively large spender on national defence. After the end of the Korean War in the early 1950s, Canadian military expenditures peaked at over 7 percent of Gross Domestic Product (GDP) before steadily falling to roughly 2 percent in the 1980s.

Things, however, began to change with two episodes of fiscal consolidation, first under the Chrétien government in the 1990s and then under the Harper government in the 2000s. As a result, defence expenditures fell from 2.11 percent in 1986 to roughly 1 percent of GDP by 2014. At the same time, the size of the Canadian Armed Forces (CAF) was cut by 30 percent from 90,000 active troops in 1990 to 62,000 in 2005. The force size has remained mostly unchanged ever since.

It must be noted that 2014 wasn’t just an important year for being a low point in post-Second World War defence spending. It’s also the year when NATO implemented its much-discussed 2 percent of GDP defence spending target.

The origin of the 2-percent target actually dates back to 2006 when the notion of such a minimum national spending goal was first mentioned in a NATO document. Yet, a spending pledge would not be formalized until the 2014 NATO summit in Wales, which came on the heels of Russia’s invasion of Crimea in the same year.

So, prior to the current budget, we were up to 1.3% from 1% under Stephen Harper. Wadda ya know about that?

Now, it's fair to say, and the article above details, there's been a lot of time for the Liberals to do better but for how long have they been in office under a minority government? Let's say they suddenly announced 4 years ago, during a global pandemic, no less, that to meet NATO targets they were going to enact massive deficit spending to raise the percent of GDP* defence spending right to 2% immediately. How would Canadians react to that when the healthcare system is overwhelmed?

tl;dr The Liberals may not have done great with this issue over the last several years, they nevertheless did better than their Conservative predecessors.


*Edit: I must be tired; I kept wanting to type GSP here

 

[west42]

That’s ok, the US will take up the difference so canadians can brag about free healthcare

 

[Cajun]

Like the title says, there's no doot aboot it; even with new spending recently announced, we're still not hitting that target--although they claim future spending not yet approved (or announced) will bring them up to the target in future months. Trudeau seems intent on moving like a snail when it comes to increases in our spending. According to some sources, the new spending the Liberals have announced will still only bring us up to 1.6% from 1.3% in 2023. Trudeau has been in office since 2014 so this must be solely his fault, right? Useless motherfucker.


Oh wait,

DeepDive: Just how bad is Canada’s defence spending problem? Downright disastrous—with little hope in sight

thehub.ca

So, prior to the current budget, we were up to 1.3% from 1% under Stephen Harper. Wadda ya know about that?

Now, it's fair to say, and the article above details, there's been a lot of time for the Liberals to do better but for how long have they been in office under a minority government? Let's say they suddenly announced 4 years ago, during a global pandemic, no less, that to meet NATO targets they were going to enact massive deficit spending to raise the percent of GDP* defence spending right to 2% immediately. How would Canadians react to that when the healthcare system is overwhelmed?

tl;dr The Liberals may not have done great with this issue over the last several years, they nevertheless did better than their Conservative predecessors.

Don't know how Canada has been able to meet it in the past. Also what other countries missed the mark post pandemic

 

[LeonardoBjj]

That’s ok, the US will take up the difference so canadians can brag about free healthcare

- The fact that USA the world richest contry, doesnt has "free" care is a slap on the face of their own citizens.

 

[HereticBD]

Must be getting close to election time. @Andy Capp, the guy who supposedly doesn't like Trudeau(in between elections of course), is on the defense.

He's done, bro. The Liberal party itself, will be lucky to maintain relevancy come the election. The majority of Canadians don't even want Trudeau leading the Liberal Party, let alone the fucking country. But of course, that must be music to your ears because you don't like him, right?

 

[Deorum]

That’s ok, the US will take up the difference so canadians can brag about free healthcare

Canada is literally tied into the US defense industrial base; it hardly even needs a military and seems to know it. That doesn't mean it shouldn't, though.

- The fact that USA the world richest contry, doesnt has "free" care is a slap on the face of their own citizens.

It does have "free" healthcare (Medicaid), it's just not universal. Medicaid actually covers over 80 million of the poorest Americans, it's a full scale government funded health care program and people don't pay a dime out of pocket. In addition to that, SNAP covers the bulk of a lower class family's grocery food expenses on a month to month basis.

In addition to that, poor people and needy families can also apply for and receive direct government cash assistance. The Americans getting squeezed on health care costs or rolling the dice without it and struggling to feed their families living paycheck to paycheck is actually the technical 'middle class' that earns a household income higher than the eligibility cutoff for those programs.

 

[Fluffernutter]

So, are they getting kicked out of NATO or not?

 

[Andy Capp]

Don't know how Canada has been able to meet it in the past. Also what other countries missed the mark post pandemic

Many other countries are failing to reach the 2% target; in fact, the article details that only 11 nations meet that standard as it is, but it also points out most of the rest have done a lot better than us in progress toward 2%.

 

[Andy Capp]

Must be getting close to election time. @Andy Capp, the guy who supposedly doesn't like Trudeau(in between elections of course), is on the defense.

He's done, bro. The Liberal party itself, will be lucky to maintain relevancy come the election. The majority of Canadians don't even want Trudeau leading the Liberal Party, let alone the fucking country. But of course, that must be music to your ears because you don't like him, right?

LOL Whatever you say. Got anything to say on the thread topic, bitch tits?

 

[Cajun]

Many other countries are failing to reach the 2% target; in fact, the article details that only 11 nations meet that standard as it is, but it also points out most of the rest have done a lot better than us in progress toward 2%.

Yeah... if the majority aren't hitting the mark then NATO leadership needs to reevaluate on the heels of covid. Unless things have always looked this way then they will have to accommodate. They won't lose the majority of the members over it.

 

[Andy Capp]

Canada is literally tied into the US defense industrial base; it hardly even needs a military and seems to know it. That doesn't mean it shouldn't, though.



It does have "free" healthcare (Medicaid), it's just not universal. Medicaid actually covers over 80 million of the poorest Americans, it's a full scale government funded health care program and people don't pay a dime out of pocket. In addition to that, SNAP covers the bulk of a lower class family's grocery food expenses on a month to month basis.

In addition to that, poor people and needy families can also apply for and receive direct government cash assistance. The Americans getting squeezed on health care costs or rolling the dice without it and struggling to feed their families living paycheck to paycheck is actually the technical 'middle class' that earns a household income higher than the eligibility cutoff for those programs.

That sort of cutoff is always the issue, innit? There's always going to be some people who are just over the line and can only go on struggling. The only way to prevent that is to raise the bar far beyond what is necessary and most tax payers will never stand for that. A different system is necessary.

 

[Andy Capp]

Canada is literally tied into the US defense industrial base; it hardly even needs a military and seems to know it. That doesn't mean it shouldn't, though.



It does have "free" healthcare (Medicaid), it's just not universal. Medicaid actually covers over 80 million of the poorest Americans, it's a full scale government funded health care program and people don't pay a dime out of pocket. In addition to that, SNAP covers the bulk of a lower class family's grocery food expenses on a month to month basis.

In addition to that, poor people and needy families can also apply for and receive direct government cash assistance. The Americans getting squeezed on health care costs or rolling the dice without it and struggling to feed their families living paycheck to paycheck is actually the technical 'middle class' that earns a household income higher than the eligibility cutoff for those programs.

Thanks for the well thought out reply, by the way, unlike... well, you know.

 

[HereticBD]

LOL Whatever you say. Got anything to say on the thread topic, bitch tits?

I said my piece. Nobody gives a fuck about any of this. This is just "Another Trudeau Defense Thread" by you, because you see what's coming.

I'm just here to point that out and laugh at your flailing and dishonesty. It's hilarious.

 

[Andy Capp]

I said my piece. Nobody gives a fuck about any of this. This is just "Another Trudeau Defense Thread" by you, because you see what's coming.

I'm just here to point that out and laugh at your flailing and dishonesty. It's hilarious.

Concession noted, bitch tits.

 

[HereticBD]

Concession noted, bitch tits.

Of what? We're one of many nations who are NATO by proxy, who don't throw in their "fair share". Doesn't matter who is in office. Guess what? We're also not meeting our emissions goals either, and never will, because it's all lip service to morons like yourself. Quick, hit Google and find some hack articles that blames that on Conservatives too.

Again, this is just a "Trudeau Defense Thread", because you know he's absolutely fucked.

 

[Rational Poster]

Canada is literally tied into the US defense industrial base; it hardly even needs a military and seems to know it. That doesn't mean it shouldn't, though.



It does have "free" healthcare (Medicaid), it's just not universal. Medicaid actually covers over 80 million of the poorest Americans, it's a full scale government funded health care program and people don't pay a dime out of pocket. In addition to that, SNAP covers the bulk of a lower class family's grocery food expenses on a month to month basis.

In addition to that, poor people and needy families can also apply for and receive direct government cash assistance. The Americans getting squeezed on health care costs or rolling the dice without it and struggling to feed their families living paycheck to paycheck is actually the technical 'middle class' that earns a household income higher than the eligibility cutoff for those programs.

Canada's military is small but some units are quite good at least. Some very good Canadian snipers are volunteering in Ukraine.

 

[Andy Capp]

Canada's military is small but some units are quite good at least. Some very good Canadian snipers are volunteering in Ukraine.

Indeed, Canadians have been training Ukrainian troops in the UK since the Crimea invasion in 2014. There's a reason for that. The issue is lack of materiel and very weak recruitment.

 

[RemyR]

Many other countries are failing to reach the 2% target; in fact, the article details that only 11 nations meet that standard as it is, but it also points out most of the rest have done a lot better than us in progress toward 2%.

Damn, Poland is not fucking around lol. I've heard they were big on building up their defense because of well documented history but wasn't expecting that

 

[Deorum]

Of what? We're one of many nations who are NATO by proxy, who don't throw in their "fair share". Doesn't matter who is in office. Guess what? We're also not meeting our emissions goals either, and never will, because it's all lip service to morons like yourself. Quick, hit Google and find some hack articles that blames that on Conservatives too.

Again, this is just a "Trudeau Defense Thread", because you know he's absolutely fucked.

Why does Andy think you have man boobs?

 

[Andy Capp]

Damn, Poland is not fucking around lol. I've heard they were big on building up their defense because of well documented history but wasn't expecting that

Well, the Russians have been indicating if they're successful in Ukraine they aren't stopping there so I don't blame the Polish one bit.