International California's population shrinks by 70,000 people

[BIKES!]

height average slightly went up after rogan moved away

I heard it increased half an inch.

 

[ToxicShocker]

If people are leaving "en masse" right now its due to cheaper rental rates on the bottom end. If you are poor, out of work, and have connections out of state why break your back paying $1500 for a tiny apartment in CA.

 

[tinker_190]

You don't even need that much. Are you in California? You could just wall of San Francisco, Berkeley, Oakland and LA and kill off 90% of the "oh California is CrAzY" type news. Central Valley might as well be Nebraska, but almonds instead of corn. East Washington is cowboy land and East Oregon is 'squatch forest.

Immigration and housing policies are a result of government. Also California has been ridiculously expensive for decades, why only now are people leaving?

Decisions are made on the margin... maybe the last few years have been the straw that broke the camels back? I remember reading about people leaving California at least in the year 1 BC (before Corona)

 

[Scheme]

Economic crisis and pandemic?

Emigration from California has been rising and population growth have been decreasing quite steadily since about 2014 (where it was stable since 2005).

Don't get me wrong though, I am all for a lowering of population in heavily populated areas. However, if the people leaving are the ones paying the bulk of the taxes of a state that relies on that income, this could spell disaster for California unless major spending reform is put in place, which in such a heavily democratically run state would likely not happen. Hopefully California doesn't see tax payers leaving and decide to increase the burden on the remaining, otherwise California is in for a death spiral.

 

[Rational Poster]

Emigration from California has been rising and population growth have been decreasing quite steadily since about 2014 (where it was stable since 2005).

Don't get me wrong though, I am all for a lowering of population in heavily populated areas. However, if the people leaving are the ones paying the bulk of the taxes of a state that relies on that income, this could spell disaster for California unless major spending reform is put in place, which in such a heavily democratically run state would likely not happen. Hopefully California doesn't see tax payers leaving and decide to increase the burden on the remaining, otherwise California is in for a death spiral.

Seems unlikely the 5th largest economy in the entire world is going to death spiral just because their politics hurt your feelings.

I don't think you understand the scale of economic activity in California.

 

[White Whale]

California is too expensive for many people and they could go a lot further with their money living somewhere else.

 

[BIKES!]

Emigration from California has been rising and population growth have been decreasing quite steadily since about 2014 (where it was stable since 2005).

Don't get me wrong though, I am all for a lowering of population in heavily populated areas. However, if the people leaving are the ones paying the bulk of the taxes of a state that relies on that income, this could spell disaster for California unless major spending reform is put in place, which in such a heavily democratically run state would likely not happen. Hopefully California doesn't see tax payers leaving and decide to increase the burden on the remaining, otherwise California is in for a death spiral.

This is exactly what will happen. They will turn to the tax payers that are left to close the gap. CA has already floated around unconstitutional tax plans such as taxing you for life even if you leave. I’m serious these are the ideas they are working on

 

[Ophydian]

Most people live in CA because it’s not Arkansas. Most are ok with being house poor.

Most leave to not pay state taxes as housing prices typically increase significantly in cities these people emigrate to. Austin property value is bananas and has been for a number of years.

 

[brother mouzone]

I really hope california passes that wealth tax for 10 years after residents leave california bill. That shit would be amazing to watch from a distance

 

[lakersfan45]

It’s a bit odd. There’s been a shortage of houses available to buy all year in my area of SoCal so I’m wondering if the people that are leaving are renters or if there is something else I’m missing. I live in a brand new community and all the houses are sold out (to be completed building in the summer). I know people who are trying to buy both from within and out of state and they can’t, nothing is available here. One of my real estate agent friends says he’s never had such a long list of buyers but everything gets sold ASAP and lots of bidding wars.

 

[superpunch]

Seems unlikely the 5th largest economy in the entire world is going to death spiral just because their politics hurt your feelings.

I don't think you understand the scale of economic activity in California.

I follow tech a lot. I know many tech companies are trying to leave. Cisco just left for Austin, Texas. Now that working online is established as normal, lots of mid-size companies are trying to leave. Even before covid, many start-ups, the companies that will one day be the big companies in the future, were actively avoiding being founded in California. You can't see the damage now but it's going to be Detroit levels in Northern California in a decade. Southern California should fare a bit better.

Everyone has their own reasons. But it comes down to California won't stop passing tax after tax, and regulation after regulation. I'm about to start a computer science career. My dream was to start a career in the Bay Area around Silicon Valley. The regulation that scared me out of California was AB5 past a year ago. My dream is to work remotely as a contractor to several companies and travel the world, but that's hanging on a string's edge of being illegal if you have residency in California. That's the same regulation that forced Dave Meltzer to stop covering MMA.

What if they expand AB5 to make my job illegal while I'm across the world in another country? How the fuck would I establish my residency in another state then? I'd be fucked. So, I'm looking at starting my career and future business in another state because of that. I imagine that I'm only 1 of many future tech people in the same position. That damage isn't felt yet because we haven't established our businesses or careers for California to lose out on yet. That damage will be felt when our careers and businesses aren't established in California, but instead elsewhere. That's what that 70,000 net population loss represents.

Another example is I almost got a job teaching English online so I could travel while teaching. Teaching English online is now virtually illegal if you're a California resident. Companies that hire will just toss out your resume and if you were already an employee, they probably fired you. If I were a California resident and in another country at that time, wtf would I have done?? I'd have been so screwed lol.

Here's Dave Meltzer explaining why he had to quit covering MMA because it's now illegal since he's a California resident:

he California State Legislature passed a law, aimed at cracking down on independent contractors in the state.

A lot of people have talked about what affect that will have on pro wrestlers performing in California, and the WWE has put forth a lobbying effort, as have other businesses, to get pro wrestling exempt from the new law. At this point it is unclear but where pro wrestling falls under the radar is that there are so few people working as WWE pro wrestlers, and with the exception of AEW and ROH, due to the nature of some contracts, all over America pro wrestlers really are independent contractors.

But this has affected the journalism field, in that independent contractors in the year 2020 are classified as those who produce less than 35 written submissions over the course of a year. That is a ridiculously low threshold and any written submission, even a blog post, would count against the 35 number.

This will have a major effect on the journalism field. Unfortunately, this looks to end my long association with the MMA Fighting web site. I am very clearly the definition of an independent contractor, I work on topics I like, on my own time, with the general idea of 100 to 150 stories per year.

Obviously with my pro wrestling work and how time consuming it is, there is no way I could work full-time anywhere else, nor would I want to. Vox Media, which owns MMA Fighting, made the decision that if you live in California, you have to be working full-time.

So my long association with MMA Fighting looks to be ending at the end of March. I do want to say that I enjoyed my time there greatly, and in particular the chance to work with people like Guilherme Cruz, who I’ve never met but is a great reporter, Ariel Helwani and Marc Raimondi who now work for ESPN, who have both been longtime friends and Raimondi, his girlfriend, and my family have attended pro wrestling shows together all over the world. The idea of working with Helwani and Dave Doyle was the reasons I came to MMA Fighting in the first place after everything changed at Yahoo, where Doyle, who grew up reading the Observer, recruited me to work at as the first major mainstream site that gave full coverage to MMA after I did brief MMA writing for the Los Angeles Times and Fox Sports. Casey Leydon and Esther Lin, a great videographer and the best combat sports photographer in the world, have become friends and huge pro wrestling fans during that period and have also attended shows with us in the U.S. and Japan. A whole group of us including Shaun Al-Shatti and Jose Youngs have become regulars at the PWG shows. Over the years, from a work standpoint, people have gone their separate ways, whether it’s working for ESPN, Showtime, The Athletic or other sites. It’s a new crew there and they work just as hard and some will be the next generation of reporters following in those big footsteps.

During my time at MMA Fighting, we were voted on by the MMA fan base as the News Site of the Year five times over the last six years. I always considered it like an all-star team there, with Al-Shatti’s ability to do in-depth stories, the writing ability of Mike Chiapetta, the divergent opinions of Luke Thomas, the reporting ability of Raimondi on difficult stories, the experience and sports perspective of Dave Doyle, and Helwani, who during those years became a major and deserved celebrity in that world. Cruz has become the top MMA reporter in Brazil, and Peter Carroll is now doing the same in Europe. My very small contributions were really booking analysis after shows and the business side, which was good because it was a role that kept me thinking about business, and understanding MMA business and learning from it has been essential since 2006 in particular. The UFC’s ability starting in 2006 to have essentially taken over the lead in production of major monthly shows and replacing both boxing and WWE as the PPV king has changed all industries and taught us different methods of what draws money and has allowed us to compare different marketing strategies when you have two monster companies who are the same in some ways, but approach things very differently.

I came to MMA Fighting largely due to the work of Doyle, who had no interest in MMA until reading about it here and then breaking in reporting on it as his line of work. He’s also the reason I started at Yahoo. I’ve enjoyed working with him dating back more than a decade, although he moved on to MMA Junkie. The other reason I came there was Helwani was there, although I’ve never told anyone that before. For whatever reason, working on the same staff as him was a big deal to me at that time. I’ve known him to a degree since college when he asked me to guest on his radio show and he was also a subscriber to this publication as he was growing up learning journalism. He was actually looking at a career in some form regarding pro wrestling, found MMA and fell in love with it. He’s been able to parlay that into working NBA games with ESPN. When you are the most visible media player in a business, it breeds an incredible level of jealousy, but he has earned what he’s gotten through hard work. The fact that people like he and Doyle grew up on this publication and how it shaped them for the success they’ve had is something I take great pride in.

I do also need to thank Bryan Tucker as editor for bringing me aboard. Both he and Doyle, my immediate boss at Yahoo, were always understanding when there have been issues, whether it was family illnesses or a freak accident that kept me from being able to type for a few weeks last year (and it was supposed to be a lot longer) and were always understanding. With both, they understood my time limitations due to this publication and that pro wrestling was always my priority, and in both cases they could have gotten someone who could have produced more and devoted more time for those spots, but I guess felt my expertise in certain aspects of business and history, was worth having me be a part of things even with its limitations. And it is amazing that a law constructed to keep employers from taking advantage of employees will end up, in the journalism field, due to an ignorant threshold rule, costing so many reporters their positions as part-time reporters all over the state. It’s especially worse for those who financially were in a position to really need it in a field that is difficult to make money in, and even more, for smaller web sites who can’t afford full-time employees and now will have to rely on contributors working for free, which the law evidently doesn’t cover.

 

[panamaican]

You can really get a window into how people think by the assumptions they make.

1) We have no idea which people are in this 70,000.
2) We have no idea why they left.
3) We have no idea where they went.

For all we know, the 70,000 could be hardcore conservatives who were on welfare and moved to New York City. For a state the size of CA, 70,000 is a really small number. For a state like CA, with it's top heavy high income industries, losing lower income residents probably helps the state. I don't know, I just think it's interesting that people are assuming that the 70,000 decline represents their personal political fantasies.

 

[CubicleGangster]

What tribe are you?

He was originally from the tribe of Raiders but they migrated from his homeland so now he is a man without a tribe

So USA should just give up all those military bases along the coast and lose out on all of ports that our integral to our imports/exports?

That seems dumb

 

[CubicleGangster]

You can really get a window into how people think by the assumptions they make.

1) We have no idea which people are in this 70,000.
2) We have no idea why they left.
3) We have no idea where they went.

For all we know, the 70,000 could be hardcore conservatives who were on welfare and moved to New York City. For a state the size of CA, 70,000 is a really small number. For a state like CA, with it's top heavy high income industries, losing lower income residents probably helps the state. I don't know, I just think it's interesting that people are assuming that the 70,000 decline represents their personal political fantasies.

As someone who lives in California the only people I know leaving the state are those who can't afford to live here so I wouldn't be surprised if that 70k is mainly comprised of low wage earners looking for areas with lower cost of living
The only person I know who makes a lot of money and is leaving the state is doing so to be closer to family

 

[Whippy McGee]

I am going to check out Prescott, AZ after Christmas. My son graduates from Huntington Beach High School in June. I do have to work out my working remote full time. I run most of the company, but my Programmers, data Specialists, Project Managers, and even my Office Manager etc... also mostly work from home now, so it should be doable.

I also plan on checking out Meridian, ID - Orange Beach, AL - Knoxville, TN - and Ft. Walton Beach, FL

All advice on those places is welcomed.

70,000 + 1 (me)

 

[Scerpi]

Seems unlikely the 5th largest economy in the entire world is going to death spiral just because their politics hurt your feelings.

I don't think you understand the scale of economic activity in California.

lol... California's politics is hurting far more than feelings.

And it's not low income earners leaving the state either...

You're going to have huge city centers with ultra rich and extreme poor... with no middle class

 

[Whippy McGee]

A lot of people are trying to get out of Fucktardistan. It's almost as if those liberal policies are hurting the state.

^^^ Yep!

Besides my best friend these are my family members exits and landing spots over the last 2 years.

My best friend move to Idaho.
My Dad to Florida.
My Cousin to Florida.
Another Cousin to Alabama.
My Sister to Arizona
My Brother to Nevada and now he's looking to move out further

My son's BJJ Gym lost half the kids as the parents' moved. It was kind of weird. The exit is real.

 

[SanchoMF]

This thread is gold for two reasons : people cheering for California's downfall and people denying that the California's politics are pretty fucking retarded.

 

[panamaican]

As someone who lives in California the only people I know leaving the state are those who can't afford to live here so I wouldn't be surprised if that 70k is mainly comprised of low wage earners looking for areas with lower cost of living
The only person I know who makes a lot of money and is leaving the state is doing so to be closer to family

Which would be a net gain for the state if the low wage earners are also getting any government assistance.

 

[djacobox372]

If CA is as bad as so many claim why is it so expensive... is the free market wrong?