Boxers who have moved to mma/kickboxing: what have you found?

[ambertch]

Long story short: what type of boxer were you and how did you apply your style, or adapt your style when you trained and fought kickboxing seriously?


As I feared my boxing and kickboxing training's started to diverge. As a boxer my reactions aren't great but my speed is, so I've developed more of a classical boxer stick and move, changing levels and throwing a lot of fakes, punching from angles and doing a lot of dancing in and out of range.

However I'm starting to think brawler types of boxers would be more successful in applying their boxing to kickboxing, since classical boxers fight at range and in kickboxing, rangefighting is done with kicks. I can't be pulling a Mayweather type in-out during my kickboxing training.

On the other hand kickboxing stance most MT and Sanshou people I train with use is really open to body shots. Whereas it's almost impossible to target a shot to the solar plexus against a boxer I'm surprised how many body shots of all types I catch my partners with during kickboxing sparring. Stuff I'd never be able to pull off in boxing sparring. (of course I'm not sparring super good people)

 

[Dogmeat]

Some boxers transition well, especially swarm type fighters (I think Ricky Hatton did some kickboxing before he took up boxing).

The ones who have problems tend to be the ones who use the old school foot out in front stance to measure distance - that leg gets kicked out from underneath you constantly.

Oh, and peek-a-boo boxers tend to eat a few knees to the face at first!

To contribute - I went from American type kickboxing, to boxing and then to Thai. I found the boxing gave me the ability to 'break rythmn' against thai fighters, as a lot of thai tends to be a 'war of attrition' and falls in to a "I kick, you kick" rythmn.

But anyone will tell you that its down to how a fighter uses his tools rather than the tools themselves.

And you're right about body shots - thai fighters tend not to expect a body punch as the thai kick is such a devestating body blow and they're watching for that.

 

[ambertch]

To contribute - I went from American type kickboxing, to boxing and then to Thai. I found the boxing gave me the ability to 'break rythmn' against thai fighters, as a lot of thai tends to be a 'war of attrition' and falls in to a "I kick, you kick" rythmn.

Thanks for your input, what type of boxer were you?

Basically what I'm getting at is - as much as I like boxing I'm doing it to support my overall striking. If what I'm presently doing isn't going to support my kickboxing/mma in the future, I might as well change my boxing training and train a style of boxing I wouldn't normally, naturally do if I was just boxing.

 

[WintersMMA]

Some boxers transition well, especially swarm type fighters (I think Ricky Hatton did some kickboxing before he took up boxing).

The ones who have problems tend to be the ones who use the old school foot out in front stance to measure distance - that leg gets kicked out from underneath you constantly.

Oh, and peek-a-boo boxers tend to eat a few knees to the face at first!

To contribute - I went from American type kickboxing, to boxing and then to Thai. I found the boxing gave me the ability to 'break rythmn' against thai fighters, as a lot of thai tends to be a 'war of attrition' and falls in to a "I kick, you kick" rythmn.

But anyone will tell you that its down to how a fighter uses his tools rather than the tools themselves.

And you're right about body shots - thai fighters tend not to expect a body punch as the thai kick is such a devestating body blow and they're watching for that.

lol i think Hatton had 1 amateur kickboxing fight and that was when he was like 9 years old. his younger brother was his opponent and won by tko. they show the clip on at home with the hattons. not sure if hes had any other kickboxing fights but i havent heard of an.

 

[WintersMMA]

i was at fairtex pattaya over a year ago and was working on my shadow boxing. this short dude comes up to me and starts doin the same. i saw him in more of a western boxing stance but he was still checking kicks and teeping.

i had no idea who it was until after about an hour when he tells me his name is Spencer Fisher! I had seen him around for two days not knowing who he was until he told me his name. I felt like an idiot. But yeah the dude was really nice and gave me some great advice and we talked a bit for his last couple days there. My lil bro also came a week after and got a pic with him and was stoked to meet him.

But back to the subject, He said he is also a boxer who transitioned into kickboxing/mma. His base is still lower than thai fighters and legs still spread further apart like a boxer. but while boxers tend to straighten there knees out to get maximum reach he said thats the most important thing you have to watch out for because 1 leg kick above or behind your knee in that position is devastating.

So I like to have my legs more spread out for maximum leverage when I punch and also reach but always make sure the knee is bent and facing outwards or a bit to the side so you can easily defend a kick.

 

[Dogmeat]

Thanks for your input, what type of boxer were you?

To be honest - not a very good one. I would say I "trained boxing" rather than "I was a boxer". I didn't do it long enough to learn the subtle skills to call myself a real boxer. Like you, I did it to suppliment my hands as the American style kcikboxing I was doing was a little limited. If I had to describe my style though, I was a long range jab, jab cross style fighter (very European). I could fight inside, but I was a bit tall and rangy to do it effectively.

He said he is also a boxer who transitioned into kickboxing/mma. His base is still lower than thai fighters and legs still spread further apart like a boxer. but while boxers tend to straighten there knees out to get maximum reach he said thats the most important thing you have to watch out for because 1 leg kick above or behind your knee in that position is devastating.

Thats the thing, the techniques that enhance your boxing give weakness in other striking sports. Much like a thai stance will leave you open to take downs, etc. Look at Bas Rutten's stance, its not as high as a thai stance, its not as tucked as a boxer, but its an all round stance ready for different ranges.

 

[Dogmeat]

Yay...double post...

 

[ambertch]

i was at fairtex pattaya over a year ago and was working on my shadow boxing. this short dude comes up to me and starts doin the same. i saw him in more of a western boxing stance but he was still checking kicks and teeping.

By western stance how was his upper body? Was it boxer sideways? How do you teep like that lol

If he was sideways - how did he move to go about checking outside kicks? One of the problems I have kickboxing sparring in my boxing stance is that to check ouside kicks I gotta rotate my entire upper body instead of just lifting and rotating that leg


Also, Dogmeat your avatar is friggin' scary lol

 

[Sinister]

Oh, and peek-a-boo boxers tend to eat a few knees to the face at first!

Care to name a few?

 

[WintersMMA]

By western stance how was his upper body? Was it boxer sideways? How do you teep like that lol

If he was sideways - how did he move to go about checking outside kicks? One of the problems I have kickboxing sparring in my boxing stance is that to check ouside kicks I gotta rotate my entire upper body instead of just lifting and rotating that leg


Also, Dogmeat your avatar is friggin' scary lol

His upper body was not sideways probably so he doesnt get caught with headkicks. Having your weight centered makes it more difficult to teep and check kicks, but during the fight you can go back and forth which is what he does. And while you gain a disadvantage (making it difficult to teep/check) you also get an advantage (more reach and better leverage with punches) Like I said its not exactly a traditional boxing stance and its not a muay thai stance its more modified to fit both with just more emphasis on the boxing.

It was just annoying when the thai trainers kept coming up to me and telling me to stick my arms out leaving my chin open and keep my feet close together. This is the only gym in Thailand that made me change my stance. They kept pushing the traditional muay thai stance with the weight on the back leg and the front very close with the arms sticking out...On top of that....One trainer would tell me one thing and five minutes later another trainer would come and tell me it was wrong and to go back to what i was doing. This happened almost everyday. Wasn't my favorite gym out here but it was real nice facilities and was sick to train next to Yod. neuropol and attachai

 

[Yanoush]

I would say that in fighters have an easier time transitioning, Thats what I always do when I spar guys that are good at kicking, keep the pressure on them so I can get good hooks and bodyshots then again I am fucking trashed so continue

 

[BJJ Coffee Drinker]

I guess it would might be because many of the trainers have their own style they like to push? I think Albert Kraus uses a good stance that incorporates his boxing well to defend kicks. I say it is because he had to adjust to fight many kickers as he is usually better with his hands than his opponents. He seems to stand almost like a thai stance with his feet and hips (slightly more square) but his upper body seems more angled to let him turn over on his punches more. he can now check kicks and get more power into his punch

 

[crooked]

peek a boo is just the gloves upto your face. the bobbing and weaving is just compliment to it. the only kickboxer i know that uses peek a boo occasionally is zambidis and i dont think he ate many brutal knees even though hes short.

 

[Dogmeat]

Care to name a few?

I only trained with local level fighters, so names would mean nothing. Besides, any boxer-come-kickboxer that we would all have heard of would have adapted to the game and be able to avoid ducking into knees before getting a fight under kickboxing rules. I didn't say that boxers never learn and always get caught. Actually, former boxers learn bloody fast

peek a boo is just the gloves upto your face. the bobbing and weaving is just compliment to it. the only kickboxer i know that uses peek a boo occasionally is zambidis and i dont think he ate many brutal knees even though hes short.

Ironically, one of the guys I used to train with was a short, bob and weave fighter and when he got used to the danger of knees he ended up with a very similar style to Zambidis (but not in the same class - like I say, I only trained with local level guys).


Kabuki - am I right in thinking that you went the other way? From kickboxing to boxing? How did you find not having to worry about legs, but suddenly having to react to more advanced punches from new angles?

 

[Fedor Fan 189]

lazy eye

 

[Sinister]

I only trained with local level fighters, so names would mean nothing. Besides, any boxer-come-kickboxer that we would all have heard of would have adapted to the game and be able to avoid ducking into knees before getting a fight under kickboxing rules. I didn't say that boxers never learn and always get caught. Actually, former boxers learn bloody fast

It's just that ducking into knees from bobbing/weaving isn't as big a deal as people like to think. Why? Because most Boxers know how to defend or get out of the way of uppercuts, and uppercuts are just as likely to catch a guy from underneath as a knee.

Kabuki - am I right in thinking that you went the other way? From kickboxing to boxing? How did you find not having to worry about legs, but suddenly having to react to more advanced punches from new angles?

Yes and no. I learned how to Box first, but I spent more time in my life doing kickboxing and TMA's. When I dedicated back to Boxing defense wasn't a huge issue, though there were some subtleties I had to re-train my body to do, like slip into punches, roll, and move my head via moving my waist as opposed to my neck.

However the biggest issue was keeping my feet under my shoulders. When you kick a lot, you tend to punch but with your legs either a little too far forward or back from your shoulders (Machida did this in his fight with Tito, where BJ kept his feet in Boxing position with Sherk). So it always looked like I wanted to kick.

 

[ssullivan80]

Care to name a few?

I would agree that peak a boo boxers eat less kness, but to name 1 (the only one i can think of) Terry Martin.

 

[Sinister]

Terry's not very good. He can hit hard, but skillwise there's a lot of holes in his game. He's definitely got potential, but it seems there's a glass ceiling on him.

 

[ssullivan80]

Terry's not very good. He can hit hard, but skillwise there's a lot of holes in his game. He's definitely got potential, but it seems there's a glass ceiling on him.

I agree. Just the only example I could come up with for a reference. (I didnt post the initial comment that you quoted below)

 

[slugger]

Oh, and peek-a-boo boxers tend to eat a few knees to the face at first!

only person who i could kind of think of was Sean Sherk