Media Bisping: If Charles wins he surpasses Khabib and becomes LW GOAT

[Joshuaace]

At this moment in time Oliveira has 2 LW titles to his name... there's like 5 guys that have had 4 LW titles.

How many of those guys have snapped a double digit ufc win streak? I believe the longest win streak Beeb faced was 5.

The winner of this fight will have that on his resume, and it is impressive. If Charles snaps off 2 ten+ fight win streaks in a row(Mak, Volk) in the next couple months, he will vault past Beeb in to the overall GOAT discussion.

 

[560ti]

Prior to his UFC run, Gil Melendez was 21-2 at LW, and his 2nd LW title reign began with a run where he was 7-0 in title fights. And against some pretty good names, too.
I’d have to pull some old rankings to see where they were ranked at the time.

They had Kawajiri and Aoki both in the top 10 when Gil beat them. Masvidal and both Thompson bouts where ranging in the #11-25 range. Damm and Ishida where both coming off losses where they got finished so both of them weren't ranked high.

 

[Poatan Power]

It’s be hard to argue against it, unless you want to count early career losses pretty high on the scale

It's amazing that Charles can have 8 losses and be in the convo. But, there are great reasons:

1. Since he started in 2008, only once (2013 vs. Edgar) has he only fought once in a year.
2. Longest time off: 10 months
3. 12-0 outside of the UFC (similar to Khabib), 21-8-1 in the UFC over 12 years
4. 19 of those 21 wins are finishes

The dude's strength of schedule is insane. Looking at the names he's fought and the fact that he's fought 30 times in 12 years in the UFC is pretty amazing.

 

[Poatan Power]

Oliveira tapped to punches.

So did the GOAT (GSP) and one of the LHW GOAT's, especially if we disqualify based on PED's, maybe the GOAT LHW in Shogun.

Maybe they're onto something.

 

[NationWideNinja]

Technicalities? Lol wtf man. The fight was a title fight at a contracted weight, and Oliveira missed weight, was stripped of the belt, and not eligible to win it in that fight.

It cannot count as a title defense if the “champ” didn’t make champ weight and didn’t have the belt. Period. Full stop. The end.

At the end of the day he whooped Gaethjes ass with a completely negligible "advantage". Thats what happened in reality and to anyone whos not borderline autistic it counts as a title defense regardless of what official records say.

 

[BFoe]

At the end of the day he whooped Gaethjes ass with a completely negligible "advantage". Thats what happened in reality and to anyone whos not borderline autistic it counts as a title defense regardless of what official records say.

Then I guess every official record book in MMA is “borderline autistic” <45>
Champions. Make. Weight. BJ Penn made weight for his defenses, Khabib made weight for his. So did Bendo, Frankie, Gilbert Melendez, and all kinds of other guys. If Oliveira wants to surpass them, he needs to make weight like a champion, and leave the arena with the belt like a champion does when they defend their titles. Simple.

 

[akproplayer]

People always want to think they're watching the best ever fighters and players in all sports.

 

[Dana's Moonface]

It would only be his second title defence and that's all that matters according to sherbros, so no, he would need another 2 wins before he is declared LW goat

 

[kellier]

He only has 1 loss at Lightweight on his current run


3 in total

2 of which were when he was green against prime Miller and prime Cerrone, and he had only 2 UFC wins. He was too young to face that quality opposition.

 

[Voodoo Dahl]

A goat that was stripped?

Click bait

 

[NationWideNinja]

Then I guess every official record book in MMA is “borderline autistic” <45>
Champions. Make. Weight. BJ Penn made weight for his defenses, Khabib made weight for his. So did Bendo, Frankie, Gilbert Melendez, and all kinds of other guys. If Oliveira wants to surpass them, he needs to make weight like a champion, and leave the arena with the belt like a champion does when they defend their titles. Simple.

Yeah and DC getting his dome clinged with Jones' shin also didnt actually happen because it was ruled a NC afterwards.

They are actually 1-0



I guess reality is written in the data software they use to enter official records, not what actually happened lmao

 

[BFoe]

Yeah and DC getting his dome clinged with Jones' shin also didnt actually happen because it was ruled a NC afterwards.

They are actually 1-0



I guess reality is written in the data software they use to enter official records, not what actually happened lmao

That’s a weird fight to bring up, these are totally different situations.
Personally, I don’t hold that “loss” against DC in any way. Fuck that, against a juiced opponent? A fighter “losing,” even by stoppage, to an opponent who is on PEDs doesn’t really mean much to me.

Oliveira-Gaethje is different. If it was any other non-title fight it’d be fine. Oliveira weighing 155.5 is perfectly acceptable in non-title fights. So his win over Gaethje is a legit win, it’s a good win, it’s a ranked win, it’s a top 5 win even.

What it absolutely fucking isn’t, is a title defense, or a “title fight win.” That’s what I’m pushing back against, because some posters around here seem to want to anoint Oliveira with LW GOAT status using that fight in one of those categories.
It’s a ranked win. Nothing more, nothing less.

 

[NationWideNinja]

That’s a weird fight to bring up, these are totally different situations.
Personally, I don’t hold that “loss” against DC in any way. Fuck that, against a juiced opponent? A fighter “losing,” even by stoppage, to an opponent who is on PEDs doesn’t really mean much to me.

Oliveira-Gaethje is different. If it was any other non-title fight it’d be fine. Oliveira weighing 155.5 is perfectly acceptable in non-title fights. So his win over Gaethje is a legit win, it’s a good win, it’s a ranked win, it’s a top 5 win even.

What it absolutely fucking isn’t, is a title defense, or a “title fight win.” That’s what I’m pushing back against, because some posters around here seem to want to anoint Oliveira with LW GOAT status using that fight in one of those categories.
It’s a ranked win. Nothing more, nothing less.

Ok lets agree to disagree then

 

[BFoe]

Ok lets agree to disagree then

Sounds good.
Enjoy the fights, Sherbro!

 

[par6597]

nah, can't look at w/l records only to determine who is the goat without considering the how

khabib & gsp (for the most part) absolutely dominated their opponents and made them look like they did not belong there, you can't ignore sonning their opponents like this

 

[NationWideNinja]

Sounds good.
Enjoy the fights, Sherbro!

Likewise Sherbrethren

 

[TheBulge]

Yes he will become LW GOAT if he wins. It will be quality over quantity(and actually Charles has both over Khabib). Nobody considers Rocky Marciano the best ever because he had no blemishes on his record.

 

[Dana's Moonface]

Yes he will become LW GOAT if he wins. It will be quality over quantity(and actually Charles has both over Khabib). Nobody considers Rocky Marciano the best ever because he had no blemishes on his record.

Does he definitely have the better quality though? Islam admittedly will be something Khabib doesn't have
Although charles beat Dustin and Justin, Khabib got there first and took zero damage bar a few leg kicks

Conor was a much better win than chandler, who Charlies went life and death with and was very nearly stopped. Conor didn't put a scratch on Khabib

Tony is a great name on Charles resume, but he is a shell and took a hellacious beating off justin previous. Personally, I rate Khabib's ragdolling of RDA just before RDA became champ as muche better win

Rocky Marciano is a silly comparison, because it isn't just the undefeated record, but the level of dominance during the fights that also catapult Khabib. Rocky went life and death many times in his career

Anyway none of this will matter if Islam runs over Charles like I expect. He will be the guy to surpass Khabib

 

[fizzlehiss]

Charles fought tougher competition and tougher stylistic matches. He's better than Khabib in GOAT status.

 

[TheBulge]

Does he definitely have the better quality though? Islam admittedly will be something Khabib doesn't have
Although charles beat Dustin and Justin, Khabib got there first and took zero damage bar a few leg kicks

Conor was a much better win than chandler, who Charlies went life and death with and was very nearly stopped. Conor didn't put a scratch on Khabib

Tony is a great name on Charles resume, but he is a shell and took a hellacious beating off justin previous. Personally, I rate Khabib's ragdolling of RDA just before RDA became champ as muche better win

Rocky Marciano is a silly comparison, because it isn't just the undefeated record, but the level of dominance during the fights that also catapult Khabib. Rocky went life and death many times in his career

Anyway none of this will matter if Islam runs over Charles like I expect. He will be the guy to surpass Khabib

Compare their resumes and longevity. Charles' wins are better because those guys were still in their primes too and he beat them at their own games and finished them quicker. You can make a big deal out of the flash knockdowns which never truly endangered Charles, but a big deal can be made out of Khabib almost getting choked by a grappler and having his legs kicked to shit. In truth, these opponents were never close to winning. Question is, who won better? Charles beat them at their own games and finished them quicker.

It's really close right now. If Charles wins over Islam especially by finish you won't have a case as a Khabib fanboy.