Biggest UFC title robbery of all time?

Lee Murray would be proudest of?

  • Jones vs Reyes

  • St-Pierre vs Hendricks

  • Rutten vs Randleman

  • Machida vs Rua I

  • Woodley vs Thompson II

  • Jones vs Gustafsson

  • Whittaker vs Romero II

  • Other


Results are only viewable after voting.
Yeah, but neither fighter 100% got three rounds. It was about as close as possible, literally...with the judges, and most people who objectively scored round by round, agreeing on all but round 1. The scoring in that fight is actually an example of damn near perfection/consistency
Not in his examples, no. GSP/Hendricks round 1 could be argued any direction depending on your focus on the criteria, and Shogun had 2 guaranteed rounds and SHOULD have won 1 of any the other 3, but not guaranteed
 
Did anyone else give Rampage the nod over Griffin besides me? I will never be on board with a fighter winning a close decision on leg kicks alone
I don't understand why not. That strategy dictated the entire fight
 
Other than round 1 and 4 what round did you score for Rampage?

Why though? Leg kicks are better than nothing. There was a round in that fight where Rampage landed 0 strikes and took like 50 strikes and got badly outgrappled. I had Griffin winning rounds 2, 3 and 5 and round 2 was a 10-8 IMO.

People really overvalue leg kicks imo.

Round 1-Rampage knockdown of Forrest, easy 10-9 Rampage
Round 2-Forrest dominating with grappling, 10-8 Forrest
Round 3-closest round to evaluate, both fighters landing strikes, 10-9 Forrest
Round 4-Rampage takedown of Forrest, 10-9 Rampage
Round 5-second closest round to evaluate, 10-9 Rampage
 
Henderson /Edgar II is the one that immediately comes to mind followed by Rampage/Forest.

Bas/Randleman is always a solid pick but judging criteria was a lot different then as I recall.
 
Did anyone else give Rampage the nod over Griffin besides me? I will never be on board with a fighter winning a close decision on leg kicks alone

I gave it to Rampage but was biased and thought he went for the finish more. It felt like he could KO Griffin at any time but the same could not be said for Griffin.
 
Did anyone else give Rampage the nod over Griffin besides me? I will never be on board with a fighter winning a close decision on leg kicks alone

Leg kicks alone?

Griffin and Rampage landed similar number of significant head strikes (38 vs 31).
Only that Griffin landed 33 more leg kicks and got the better of grappling exchanges
 
By far Shogun vs Lyoto 1, if you were following MMA at the time, you know. That storyline was a huge roller coaster.

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Glad that Shogun/Machida 1 is the poll winner at the moment.

That might have been the worst I ever felt for a fighter ever after a decision. Shogun went from n°1 LW in the world in 2005/2006, to "bust/was never actually any good" after his knee surgeries & loss to Forrest Griffin + terrible performance in the Mark Coleman rematch despite getting the finish


(but to be fair, the Hammer was on fire that night, great performance by the big underdog Coleman despite only having gas for 1 round!)

Then Shogun defied the odds by beating the Iceman on the feet, something no one here gave him much of a chance to do.
In retrospect it might seem like an easy pick, but the consensus back then was that Chuck would piece Mauricio up on the feet and that Rua needed a takedown to have a chance to win a decision.

Shogun wins via first round KO


and gets a title shot against the undefeated Machida, who was then viewed the same way guys like Khabib or Jon Jones were perceived at their peak, "I just don't see Lyoto lose, he had no weakness!"

The massive favorite Machida (-430) was even criticized a bit for taking such a "gimme fight" against the heavy underdog Rua (+355), and was fully expected to run though him with ease and go on to keep the MACHIDA ERA© strong

Just look at the pros pick for that fight, 21 Picked Machida, and only 2 picked Shogun (some nice predictions by Chris Weidman & Nick "the goat" Thompson )
https://www.sherdog.com/news/articles/Pros-Pick-Machida-vs-Shogun-20493

Then the fight happened, and it was surreal, watching Rua solve the puzzle that is Machida and beat him over 5 rounds, re-taking his place at the number 1 205er in the world was getting me teary-eyed.... <mma1>


then the decision was read and no one looked more surprised than Lyoto himself, who sadly kinda turned the world against him by just saying in his postt fight interview "well the judges said I won, so I won"
(so when he would later complain about judges robbing him against Phil Davis, the MMA world wasn't super sympathetic, with Phil Davis saying "you live by that sword, you die by that sword" in response
“You’re not the first person who wants a rematch.You fight every fight like this. You fight close fights. Name one fight that he didn’t finish where he beat the crap out of somebody. You live by that sword, you die by that sword. When you habitually leave it to the judges, that strategy will fail you. I can’t say it any other way.”
)
and after the fight never entertained the idea that the decision was controversial, despite looking dejected before Bruce Buffer read the results.

He could have won a lot of fans by just saying that it was very close and that he wants a rematch to prove he's still the champion, instead of saying stuff like that =>
“I had the opportunity to see the fight again and I thought I won four rounds and Shogun took the last one. Some people say he won the fourth and fifth round, but for sure I won at least the first three rounds. The American commentators were pretty much biased. If you see the fight without audio, you will probably see a different fight.

“Shogun was a great opponent and had a nice strategy. He deserves all my respect as a fighter, but I was superior. I had three or four chances to finish the fight, and he never put me in danger. I didn’t get (dazed) at any moment of the fight, but I put him in danger three or four times. He kicked my legs a couple of times, but he wouldn’t knock me out with that.”

Machida guaranteed that his disappointed expression immediately after the fight did not stem from a belief that he had lost.

“My leg started to hurt in the fifth round, and I was very upset that I couldn’t knock him out as I had planned,” Machida said. “I had two chances where I felt him really (dazed), but I lost it and I get really upset when I leave the decision in the judges’ hands.”

After confirming that he totally agrees with a rematch, Machida also addressed UFC President Dana White’s statement that he thought Shogun was the winner.

“Anyone who has a mouth can talk. I respect his opinion and I’m ready to fight Shogun or any other challenger UFC decides, but I would like to say that this fight was not judged by myself, my father or Anderson Silva,” Machida said. “This fight was judged by professionals, so I’m pretty much comfortable with the result.”

Then after the fight, Anderson Silva was famously the only high profile fighter to give it to his friend and training partner Lyoto, repeating Cecil People's opinion that leg kicks don't win fights, and that Lyoto won every round =>
“I already said that Shogun did a great fight and I applaud him for the amazing fight he did, but in my opinion the leg kicks were not enough to decide the fight. Lyoto was more efficient, and in my opinion he won every round.”
<BC1>
"Shogun has done well, this fight was a fight that all MMA fans liked to see. In my opinion, Lyoto won all rounds. Shogun drew a good strategy to attack the legs, but it was not enough. There are coaches who have to decide, but the judges ... Lyoto won well, now it's back to training as soon as possible ", concluded Anderson.
<6>

(Demian Maia scored it a draw too, claiming that "to take the belt from the champion, the fighter has to be clearly superior. In that case, they should have decided a draw, so Lyoto could keep the belt" , which is always controversial since to beat the champ you just have to win, you shouldn't have to do anything extra... especially in the eyes of impartial judges.)

Even for the rematch the pros picks were divided, with lots of people believing that Rua put on the performance of a lifetime and beat Machida the first time, but they weren't sure lightning could strike twice =>
https://www.sherdog.com/news/articles/Pros-Pick-Machida-vs-Shogun-2-24333
Pros who picked Shogun: 12
Pros who picked Machida: 11
Pros who could not decide: 2
UFC_113_Machida_vs_Shogun_2_Poster.jpg

I was pretty nervous myself, Machida was a -195 favorite and Rua a +166 underdog even if the consensus was that he won the first fight...
So when this happened, it was glorious

Never before had I seen a UFC title be more deserved


It was such a feel good story, and one of the rare moments when Sherdog was pretty much united by supporting the younger Rua brother in winning the Machida rematch...
Sadly Lyoto was kinda turned into a villain in the whole story, because even if he could have been more tactful after the first Shogun fight, in the end it wasn't his fault at all if the judges gave it to him.

Still, WAR SHOGUN

That first Machida fight is the biggest UFC title robbery IMHO, but it gave us a fantastic storyline to follow, so it wasn't all for naught.
 
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I think the GSP/Hendricks, and Jones/Gus decisions were correct
They were both close fights when scored round by round and came down to how you score rounds that were razor close. So I don't understand why many throw out the "robbery" word. I thought Lawler - Condit was a far more clear cut example of a title fight robbery as I had Condit clearly winning 3 rounds and perhaps winning another round for 3 or 4 out of 5. Condit deserved the belt that night and he was never the same again as an older fighter with no wind in his sail. I think that robbery loss broke him mentally.
 
People really overvalue leg kicks imo.

Round 1-Rampage knockdown of Forrest, easy 10-9 Rampage
Round 2-Forrest dominating with grappling, 10-8 Forrest
Round 3-closest round to evaluate, both fighters landing strikes, 10-9 Forrest
Round 4-Rampage takedown of Forrest, 10-9 Rampage
Round 5-second closest round to evaluate, 10-9 Rampage
"I dont like leg kicks so i dont score them herpa derp"
 
People really overvalue leg kicks imo.

Round 1-Rampage knockdown of Forrest, easy 10-9 Rampage
Round 2-Forrest dominating with grappling, 10-8 Forrest
Round 3-closest round to evaluate, both fighters landing strikes, 10-9 Forrest
Round 4-Rampage takedown of Forrest, 10-9 Rampage
Round 5-second closest round to evaluate, 10-9 Rampage
No, if anything they undervalue them, Rampage was hobbling around late in that fight due to the leg kicks. I thought you said you had it for Rampage though your score is a draw.
 
No, if anything they undervalue them, Rampage was hobbling around late in that fight due to the leg kicks. I thought you said you had it for Rampage though your score is a draw.

Forrest had him hurt in round 2, he gained full mount and did not finish. In the other rounds I thought Rampage landed the harder strikes. I was surprised Forrest did as well as he did but I still did not believe Forrest beat him. What happened after that as a result shows Rampage was emotionally upset, can't say I blame him. I am not sure if there was ever consideration of a rematch to follow, but it never happened.

A draw would have been better than what ensued. The title would have stayed with the champ.
 
Edgar vs Benson

Not sure if the "biggest" robbery but the huge size disparity made it the worst to me
 
Reyes vs Jones was competitive, but Reyes clearly won.

The only thing he lost on was one or maybe two rounds and "Octagon control", which apparently weighs more in judging criteria than strikes landed and damage.

<Neil01>
 
Forrest had him hurt in round 2, he gained full mount and did not finish. In the other rounds I thought Rampage landed the harder strikes. I was surprised Forrest did as well as he did but I still did not believe Forrest beat him. What happened after that as a result shows Rampage was emotionally upset, can't say I blame him. I am not sure if there was ever consideration of a rematch to follow, but it never happened.

A draw would have been better than what ensued. The title would have stayed with the champ.
I think it was the right decision, Rampage was way too inactive in that fight and lost 2, 3 and 5 cause he just wasn't throwing or landing much, in those 3 rounds combined he landed a total of 20 strikes with 0 in round 2 where he got dominated.
 
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