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Crime Biden was in possession of classified documents while not in office

Dude. It addressed this in my comment. How the fuck should i have known you were talking about Clinton.
The president can’t declare declassified records his own and keep it from the public and nara. Its ridiculous.

you’re actually asking for a source that Clinton’s tapes were never classified??? Jesus. How about you source that they were?

Post a source that they were classified. That’s how this works.

again you ignored the links that prove my point. You’re blatantly wrong. Declassified records cannot be personal. That’s a fact that you can’t avoid. And it was source and linked for you.

Whew! Alrighty then…

So, now we know:
1. Despite declaring it again and again, you have no fucking idea what was in the Clinton tapes.
2. You do not understand the definition of “sole authority”.
3. You still think that NARA has authority over the President.
4. You believe that there is some magic classifying authority, other than the president.
5. When you say “public” or “the people” you actually mean the federal government.

I hate to say it because I like to give people the benefit of doubt, but @Saye_mc seems to be right about you.
I try and read all of the current posts in a thread when I engage and although you try and buffer it, you have a sick obsession with Trump.
I’m not going to try and convince you of anything, or try and change your mind, get any concession or even find common ground because you’ve made clear that it is not possible.
The media is lucky they are afforded the protections they have under the first amendment, because you could easily win a suit for psychological and emotional damage.
Sometimes healing can be a slow process, brother.. I’ll send good energy your way.:)
 
Whew! Alrighty then…

So, now we know:
1. Despite declaring it again and again, you have no fucking idea what was in the Clinton tapes.
2. You do not understand the definition of “sole authority”.
3. You still think that NARA has authority over the President.
4. You believe that there is some magic classifying authority, other than the president.
5. When you say “public” or “the people” you actually mean the federal government.

I hate to say it because I like to give people the benefit of doubt, but @Saye_mc seems to be right about you.
I try and read all of the current posts in a thread when I engage and although you try and buffer it, you have a sick obsession with Trump.
I’m not going to try and convince you of anything, or try and change your mind, get any concession or even find common ground because you’ve made clear that it is not possible.
The media is lucky they are afforded the protections they have under the first amendment, because you could easily win a suit for psychological and emotional damage.
Sometimes healing can be a slow process, brother.. I’ll send good energy your way.:)
You and him both have an incredible ability to avoid dealing with facts. And then reemerging later with the same nonsense.

Here again you are avoiding the facts that clearly demonstrate that classified records are presidential by definition and cannot be personal. You’re avoiding the fact that Clinton’s tapes were never classified (instead trying to ask me what evidence there was that they weren’t classified, or what evidence there was that they didn’t include aliens…). It’s an amazing quality you both share.

Why was the PRA put in effect? What is the intent of the PRA?

You literally believe the president can designate whatever the fuck he wants to be personal. Anything. And it’s his. Not subject to FOIA, not required to be turned over to NARA. He can keep anything he wants. The language in the PRA on what is presidential is meaningless. The president has unlimited power to deem whatever he wants to be personal. So he can take TS records, declassify them, designate them personal, and wala, they are his. To do whatever he wants with.. share with enemies? Sure! Destroy? Why not? They’re his!

NARA doesn’t have “authority over the president”. I never suggested they did. But the president doesn’t have unlimited authority to simply do whatever the fuck he wants, which you seem to believe. He has laws he himself need to follow, which includes the PRA and EO 13526, and the FOIA.

I am the one who linked to the rules on classifying authority, you should read them. It’s the one titled Presidential Documents.

It’s hilarious that you are suggesting I have no idea what is on the Clinton tapes while at the same time stating they were classified and presidential, with zero evidence, links, anything.

So, you go ahead believe the president can give the finger to the PRA, basically make it irrelevant to it’s intent, because of your belief that the president can literally designate anything he wants to just be personal. And then it’s his. Only his. To do whatever he wants with. No transparency needed for anything. If that’s what he (or she) wants. That’s your claim, and you’re in here acting indignant.

The president has authority to declassify records. He doesn’t have the authority to designate anything he wants to be personal, his, and free to do whatever he wants with because it’s now exempt from PRA. But that’s what you’re peddling here.
 
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You and him both have an incredible ability to avoid dealing with facts. And then reemerging later with the same nonsense.

Here again you are avoiding the facts that clearly demonstrate that classified records are presidential by definition and cannot be personal. You’re avoiding the fact that Clinton’s tapes were never classified (instead trying to ask me what evidence there was that they weren’t classified, or what evidence there was that they didn’t include aliens…). It’s an amazing quality you both share.

Why was the PRA put in effect? What is the intent of the PRA?

You literally believe the president can designate whatever the fuck he wants to be personal. Anything. And it’s his. Not subject to FOIA, not required to be turned over to NARA. He can keep anything he wants. The language in the PRA on what is presidential is meaningless. The president has unlimited power to deem whatever he wants to be personal. So he can take TS records, declassify them, designate them personal, and wala, they are his. To do whatever he wants with.. share with enemies? Sure! Destroy? Why not? They’re his!

NARA doesn’t have “authority over the president”. I never suggested they did. But the president doesn’t have unlimited authority to simply do whatever the fuck he wants, which you seem to believe. He has laws he himself need to follow, which includes the PRA and EO 13526, and the FOIA.

I am the one who linked to the rules on classifying authority, you should read them. It’s the one titled Presidential Documents.

It’s hilarious that you are suggesting I have no idea what is on the Clinton tapes while at the same time stating they were classified and presidential, with zero evidence, links, anything.

So, you go ahead believe the president can give the finger to the PRA, basically make it irrelevant to it’s intent, because of your belief that the president can literally designate anything he wants to just be personal. And then it’s his. Only his. To do whatever he wants with. No transparency needed for anything. If that’s what he (or she) wants. That’s your claim, and you’re in here acting indignant.

The president has authority to declassify records. He doesn’t have the authority to designate anything he wants to be personal, his, and free to do whatever he wants with because it’s now exempt from PRA. But that’s what you’re peddling here.
"Under the statutory scheme established by the PRA, the decision to segregate personal materials from Presidential records is made by the President, during the President's term and in his sole discretion," Jackson wrote in her March 2012 decision, which was never appealed.

"Since the President is completely entrusted with the management and even the disposal of Presidential records during his time in office, it would be difficult for this Court to conclude that Congress intended that he would have less authority to do what he pleases with what he considers to be his personal records," she added.

Please, just stop..
 
"Under the statutory scheme established by the PRA, the decision to segregate personal materials from Presidential records is made by the President, during the President's term and in his sole discretion," Jackson wrote in her March 2012 decision, which was never appealed.

"Since the President is completely entrusted with the management and even the disposal of Presidential records during his time in office, it would be difficult for this Court to conclude that Congress intended that he would have less authority to do what he pleases with what he considers to be his personal records," she added.

Please, just stop..
so to be clear, you believe this is saying the president can declare anything he wants to be personal and do with it as he pleases? He can take TS records, declassify, designate personal and give it to enemies and not disclose. Basically make the PRA null.

Certain records are presidential by definition. It’s not discretionary. It’s comical you believe the above means he can make anything he wants personal, even when it’s presidential by definition.

I asked you, why we have the PRA and what’s the intent?

What is on the top of every page of EO 13526 on classified record?

Again you can’t believe this.
 
so to be clear, you believe this is saying the president can declare anything he wants to be personal and do with it as he pleases? He can take TS records, declassify, designate personal and give it to enemies and not disclose. Basically make the PRA null.

Certain records are presidential by definition. It’s not discretionary. It’s comical you believe the above means he can make anything he wants personal, even when it’s presidential by definition.

I asked you, why we have the PRA and what’s the intent?

What is on the top of every page of EO 13526 on classified record?

Again you can’t believe this.
"Since the President is completely entrusted with the management and even the disposal of Presidential records during his time in office, it would be difficult for this Court to conclude that Congress intended that he would have less authority to do what he pleases with what he considers to be his personal records," she added.
 
"Since the President is completely entrusted with the management and even the disposal of Presidential records during his time in office, it would be difficult for this Court to conclude that Congress intended that he would have less authority to do what he pleases with what he considers to be his personal records," she added.
Again, I asked you some questions. Your continued refusal to answer says alot.

He can’t “consider” records that are presidential by definition to be “personal”.
 
"Since the President is completely entrusted with the management and even the disposal of Presidential records during his time in office, it would be difficult for this Court to conclude that Congress intended that he would have less authority to do what he pleases with what he considers to be his personal records," she added.
just forget about it, dudes a typical spineless liberal, too chicken shit to admit that he wants to hold trump to a diffrent standard so he makes up a whole bunch of regurgitated shit, some smelly mothball infested white socialists professor said and then holds onto that like a life raft in the Atlantic, all to disguise his true nature which is "conservative presidents are inherently evil but instead of saying that I'll throw out bs theories about the law"
 
Again, I asked you some questions. Your continued refusal to answer says alot.

He can’t “consider” records that are presidential by definition to be “personal”.
"Since the President is completely entrusted with the management and even the disposal of Presidential records"
 
just forget about it, dudes a typical spineless liberal, too chicken shit to admit that he wants to hold trump to a diffrent standard so he makes up a whole bunch of regurgitated shit, some smelly mothball infested white socialists professor said and then holds onto that like a life raft in the Atlantic, all to disguise his true nature which is "conservative presidents are inherently evil but instead of saying that I'll throw out bs theories about the law"

Lol. I source with links. You lie and disappear and pop back up when emboldened for whatever reason.

You are also the straw man king.

Do you believe Nixon could have just designated all his records personal when he left office? Do you think the next “Nixon” could just do that? Do you have any shame?
 
just forget about it, dudes a typical spineless liberal, too chicken shit to admit that he wants to hold trump to a diffrent standard so he makes up a whole bunch of regurgitated shit, some smelly mothball infested white socialists professor said and then holds onto that like a life raft in the Atlantic, all to disguise his true nature which is "conservative presidents are inherently evil but instead of saying that I'll throw out bs theories about the law"
I really should stop, out of pity, if nothing else..
 
Lol. I source with links. You lie and disappear and pop back up when emboldened for whatever reason.

You are also the straw man king.

Do you believe Nixon could have just designated all his records personal when he left office? Do you think the next “Nixon” could just do that? Do you have any shame?
Straw man, you say.. Nixon was prior to the PRA and all of the issued EO's that the THE PRESIDENT enforces today.
 
"Since the President is completely entrusted with the management and even the disposal of Presidential records"
You’d be better served quoting the law:

(c) During the President's term of office, the President may dispose of those Presidential records of such President that no longer have administrative, historical, informational, or evidentiary value if-

(1) the President obtains the views, in writing, of the Archivist concerning the proposed disposal of such Presidential records; and

(2) the Archivist states that the Archivist does not intend to take any action under subsection (e) of this section.
Again, you keep choosing to ignore every relevant question.

Do you believe Nixon could have just declared his presidential records as private?
 
Straw man, you say.. Nixon was prior to the PRA and all of the issued EO's that the THE PRESIDENT enforces today.
The PRA was the law that put Nixon’s presidential records into federal custody.

Again, do you think the law was set so that future presidents could destroy presidential records by designating them private? You think that makes sense? The law set up so that future “nixon’s” couldn’t destroy records has this minor loophole that lets presidents designate presidential records as private……

Again, you continue to duck every question.
 
I really should stop, out of pity, if nothing else..
I mean his one cheerleader in this thread @jefferz has already proven my point. In this thread he is shouting "obstruction of justice that the feds needed a search warrant to obtain the documents" yet in the antifa burning Atlanta thread he screamed "noooo what about the fourth article, they can't just open investigation to anyone they want without a warrant" when a poster jokingly suggested that the feds raid the antifa members mother's homd
 
I mean his one cheerleader in this thread @jefferz has already proven my point. In this thread he is shouting "obstruction of justice that the feds needed a search warrant to obtain the documents" yet in the antifa burning Atlanta thread he screamed "noooo what about the fourth article, they can't just open investigation to anyone they want without a warrant" when a poster jokingly suggested that the feds raid the antifa members mother's homd
I factually stated that they got a warrant on probable cause of crimes including obstruction. You want to act as if none of this exists. And you’re opinion negates judges and the AG. Lol.


Like I said you 2 deserve each other (although you’re worse…..no offense).
 
You’d be better served quoting the law:

(c) During the President's term of office, the President may dispose of those Presidential records of such President that no longer have administrative, historical, informational, or evidentiary value if-

(1) the President obtains the views, in writing, of the Archivist concerning the proposed disposal of such Presidential records; and

(2) the Archivist states that the Archivist does not intend to take any action under subsection (e) of this section.
Again, you keep choosing to ignore every relevant question.

Do you believe Nixon could have just declared his presidential records as private?
What you or I "believe" is not relevant.. You keep letting your belief get in the way of constitutional authority and judicial precedent. Your refusal to acknowledge the plane English of a federal judge is really disturbing. I think you should appeal her decision in the court. Show 'em how it's done.
Then, once you get that pesky and unchallenged ruling out of the way, you can set the Supreme Court and legal and constitutional analysts straight, too.
The majority ruling in the 1988 Supreme Court case Department of Navy vs. Egan — which addressed the legal recourse of a Navy employee who had been denied a security clearance — addresses this line of authority.

"The President, after all, is the ‘Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States’" according to Article II of the Constitution, the court’s majority wrote. "His authority to classify and control access to information bearing on national security ... flows primarily from this constitutional investment of power in the President, and exists quite apart from any explicit congressional grant."

Steven Aftergood, director of the Federation of American Scientists Project on Government Secrecy, said that such authority gives the president the authority to "classify and declassify at will."

In fact, Robert F. Turner, associate director of the University of Virginia's Center for National Security Law, said that "if Congress were to enact a statute seeking to limit the president’s authority to classify or declassify national security information, or to prohibit him from sharing certain kinds of information with Russia, it would raise serious separation of powers constitutional issues."

The official documents governing classification and declassification stem from executive orders. But even these executive orders aren’t necessarily binding on the president. The president is not "obliged to follow any procedures other than those that he himself has prescribed," Aftergood said. "And he can change those."

Indeed, the controlling executive order has been rewritten by multiple presidents. The current version of the order was issued by President Barack Obama in 2009.

The national-security experts at the blog Lawfare wrote in the wake of the Post’s revelation that the "infamous comment" by President Richard Nixon — that "when the president does it, that means that it is not illegal" — "is actually true about some things. Classified information is one of them. The nature of the system is that the president gets to disclose what he wants."

This isn't a L v R thing for me, my thing is people v Federal Government. The President has that SOLE discretion and power and he will soon be gone, either by vote or term limit. The Bureaucracy is on and on, and on. It is important that the people keep control of the executive branch by voting and redelegating that authority.
Why do you have so much trust in NARA and appointed Bureaucrats? We don't even know who these people truly are.
Again, look beyond your hate for Trump, try to understand why the President has such unlimited authority over the executive branch.

ps. your refusal to acknowledge legal precedents that I post does not qualify as my "not answering" your questions.
 
What you or I "believe" is not relevant.. You keep letting your belief get in the way of constitutional authority and judicial precedent. Your refusal to acknowledge the plane English of a federal judge is really disturbing. I think you should appeal her decision in the court. Show 'em how it's done.
Then, once you get that pesky and unchallenged ruling out of the way, you can set the Supreme Court and legal and constitutional analysts straight, too.
The majority ruling in the 1988 Supreme Court case Department of Navy vs. Egan — which addressed the legal recourse of a Navy employee who had been denied a security clearance — addresses this line of authority.

"The President, after all, is the ‘Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States’" according to Article II of the Constitution, the court’s majority wrote. "His authority to classify and control access to information bearing on national security ... flows primarily from this constitutional investment of power in the President, and exists quite apart from any explicit congressional grant."

Steven Aftergood, director of the Federation of American Scientists Project on Government Secrecy, said that such authority gives the president the authority to "classify and declassify at will."

In fact, Robert F. Turner, associate director of the University of Virginia's Center for National Security Law, said that "if Congress were to enact a statute seeking to limit the president’s authority to classify or declassify national security information, or to prohibit him from sharing certain kinds of information with Russia, it would raise serious separation of powers constitutional issues."

The official documents governing classification and declassification stem from executive orders. But even these executive orders aren’t necessarily binding on the president. The president is not "obliged to follow any procedures other than those that he himself has prescribed," Aftergood said. "And he can change those."

Indeed, the controlling executive order has been rewritten by multiple presidents. The current version of the order was issued by President Barack Obama in 2009.

The national-security experts at the blog Lawfare wrote in the wake of the Post’s revelation that the "infamous comment" by President Richard Nixon — that "when the president does it, that means that it is not illegal" — "is actually true about some things. Classified information is one of them. The nature of the system is that the president gets to disclose what he wants."

This isn't a L v R thing for me, my thing is people v Federal Government. The President has that SOLE discretion and power and he will soon be gone, either by vote or term limit. The Bureaucracy is on and on, and on. It is important that the people keep control of the executive branch by voting and redelegating that authority.
Why do you have so much trust in NARA and appointed Bureaucrats? We don't even know who these people truly are.
Again, look beyond your hate for Trump, try to understand why the President has such unlimited authority over the executive branch.

ps. your refusal to acknowledge legal precedents that I post does not qualify as my "not answering" your questions.
Lol. Why do you keep conflating classification / declassification with presidential / personal?


Again literally nowhere will you find anything suggesting he can designate presidential records as personal. It’s almost absurd to write it out since presidential records are obviously, by definition….presidential.

again I ask you…..do you think the PRA, instituted to ensure presidential records were kept under custodian of nara and fed government, has a loophole to allow presidents to simply designate any record as personal? Type it out and you’ll see how absurd it sounds.


The PRA ensures that presidents can’t destroy or keep private or secretly share with enemies presidential records.
 
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Does anyone really think anything will really happen to Biden? I feel like this will get swept under the rug after sometime unfortunately
 
Does anyone really think anything will really happen to Biden? I feel like this will get swept under the rug after sometime unfortunately
In all likelihood no. The best one can hope for is that it will stop him running for re-election.
 
Does anyone really think anything will really happen to Biden? I feel like this will get swept under the rug after sometime unfortunately

It depends on Garland.

I'd love to see him go after Trump and ignore this with Biden.

Likely scenario is both investigations go away and the Left loses their shit.

And Democrats face palm because Biden fucked them up again.
 
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