Better combat sport legend: Alex Pereira or Henry Cejudo?

[LEWIS540]

Bro I cuddle bigger stronger men 3 x week and dominate them between my legs while lying on my back. Yeah. Yesterday I even finished off a fully grown guy from behind with no reach around. Come at me bro.

Now that’s a struggle I’d pay to see.

Have you ever taken on multiple men simultaneously to completion before.

Sounds like a sticky situation, if nothing else.

 

[Nova44]

Agree wrestling is a more effective base for MMA and what Pereira has accomplished is f'ing amazing. But that's when it gets subjective. Pereira is still primarily a kickboxer fighting in MMA and hasn't really been tested against elite MMA wrestlers. Kind of like McG before he fought short camp Mendes. But Cejudo became well-rounded and defended against great MMA strikers in TJ and Moraes and even finished them.

But don't get me wrong - this is debatable either way. It's just not as straight forward or obvious as some folks are making it.

That's fair. For me it's still Pereira, but i can absolutely see where you're coming from.

 

[ChickenBrother]

Now that’s a struggle I’d pay to see.

Have you ever taken on multiple men simultaneously to completion before.

Sounds like a sticky situation, if nothing else.

That sounds kind of nasty bro. I think you need to get your mind out of the gutter.

 

[Poatan Power]

sir its dangerous to let olympic wrestlers gnp

so your trying to say is wrestling > striking
but you hate because its boring thats why striking > wrestling?

No. I'm not sure why you're being obtuse. I spend about a 2:1 ratio on grappling to striking in my training. So no, I don't find grappling boring, it's actually my passion. I'm also not sure why we're talking about GnP, lol.

Basically I'm taking Alex who is a 2 division champ in both sports he competed in as well as finishing 80% of his MMA fights and 2/3 of his kickboxing bouts with multiple title defenses. Israel Adesanya is also a more impressive victory in MMA than any win Henry has in context, because Henry's wins over Dom and TJ were not in their primes.

Henry only wrestled at 121lbs (55kg). While he did win gold's in back to back years at places like Pan Am's, that's not exactly defending a title although it's close. But it's still only one division and less violent/combative than kickboxing. My point also tracks because Henry only finished 50% of his MMA wins and had 0 career submissions. I tend to favor finishing fights > decisions for better combat sports legend.

Long winded way of what I already said before. If you're gonna ask me who's better at combatives, I'm taking the more violent guy when accomplishments are relatively equal.

 

[ChickenBrother]

Folks keep dropping Pereira being a "2 division champ" in kickboxing like this somehow shits on Cejudo "only" competing at 55 kg in wrestling. Those folks don't understand how wrestling weight classes work.

Most people gain weight as they get older, and that necessitates going up to a higher weight class. No male UFC double champ has ever gone back down to defend their belt at the lower weight. And likewise for Pereira in kickboxing. After many defenses at MW, he went up to LHW and won the belt. And subsequently lost it to the same guy in his next fight before retiring from kickboxing. The only UFC champ to simultaneously defend two belts is Nunes but... that's WMMA.

Cejudo competed at 55 kg but that's an Olympic weight class. Freestyle wrestling (the deepest and most popular wrestling style worldwide) is contested at 10 weight classes in non-Olympic years but only 6 at the Olympics. So in Olympic years, elite wrestlers at non-Olympic weights have to go up or down to try for that sweet Olympic gold, because there's only 6 male freestyle Olympic golds up for grabs every 4 years. So Olympic wrestling gold is essentially already a "multi-division champ" because you have guys from the weight class above and/or below you coming to your weight to try for dat Olympic bling.

To see how fucking crazy this is, let's look at the rivalry between Kyle Dake and Jordan Burroughs. Dake is the only college wrestler to win 4 D1 titles at 4 different weights: 141, 149, 157 and 165 lbs. He gained weight as he got older and went up in weight each year in college. But then he runs into Jordan Burroughs at 163 lbs (Olympic weight class) and places 2nd at the 2015 U.S. world team trials. So knowing he's out for Olympic gold at 163 lbs this MFing badass goes up NOT ONE BUT TWO weight classes to 190 lbs - the next higher Olympic weight class but falls just short to J'den Cox and places 2nd at the 2016 U.S. Olympic trials at 190 lbs. So the next year he goes back down to 163 and tries again, but falls to Burroughs again, placing 2nd at the 2017 U.S. world team trials. This time he only goes up one weight class to 174 lbs (non-Olympic weight) and wins TWO world championships there before going back down to 163 again and finally de-throning Burroughs at the 2020 U.S. Olympic trials to be the man at 163. So that forces BURROUGHS to go up and then HE wins TWO world championships at 174 lbs before going back down to 163 for the 2024 Olympic trials and finally getting knocked off the podium last April after a legendary career. Of note, Burroughs failed to medal at the 2016 Olympics at 163 and Dake took bronze at the 2020 Olympics at 163 and will try again next month in Paris.

TLDR: Freestyle wrestling gold in an Olympic weight class is impressive as fuck.

 

[checktheknuckles]

There is no combatant that is rated over Poaton. Poaton is the GOAT, regardless of how his career ends. 4 belts in 4 different divisions is GOATness.

 

[RemyR]

Henry. Winning a golds at Olympic wrestling is waaaaaaaaay tougher than a glory belt

 

[arcadeperfect]

Bullishit

There are fewer "Dual Champions," across two divisions, then there are "Olympic Gold Medalists" ...

If Henry was a dual-Gold Medalist, I would agree.

But a gold medal in wrestling is a dime a dozen, compared to a two-weight class World Champion Boxer or Kickboxer.

It is very rare to be able to do this ... especially dual across two platforms, like Alex did.

Alex also has KO'd people, in both divisions, who had never been previously KO'd before.

Cejudo's win over DJ is questionable — and his win over Moraes hasn't aged well. More ice was never Champion.

Alex has beaten/KO'd two CHAMPIONS in MW (Adesanya/Strickland) who had never been KO'd before the UFC.

Alex is beaten/KO'd to CHAMPIONS in LHW (Procházka/Hill) who had never been KO'd before in the UFC.

Henry has done no such thing, not even close to that level of dominance.

You're lumping boxing and kickboxing together which are not the same talent pools. The reason why there are more Olympic Gold Medalist Wrestlers is because it's been around for far longer than kickboxing has. You're also forgetting that the Olympics has a far greater talent pool than kickboxing. Just making the Olympic team is a huge accomplishment.

 

[arcadeperfect]

I would agree Poatan has been more impressive inside the UFC and with MMA. He’s a bad man and I’m a huge fan.

But again—you’re wrong and it’s laughable. I’m not trying to be a dick but you doubling down invites it. The number of people who grow up learning wrestling and training it GREATLY outweighs the number of people who practice kick boxing competitively. It’s not even close.

So while there have been more Olympic gold medalists than multi weigh kick boxing world champions —it does NOT mean that it’s any more difficult. Again, given the number of people who compete in the two sports, you will find you are far more likely to find yourself battling for world titles in a kick boxing ring, than competing for a medal at the Olympic Games. They are genuinely not comparable as it is much much more difficult to win a gold medal.

Just making the Olympic team in any of the sports is a difficult accomplishment.

 

[WoozyFailGuy]

People aren't distinguishing a gold medal and a manlet gold medal

No. I'm not sure why you're being obtuse. I spend about a 2:1 ratio on grappling to striking in my training. So no, I don't find grappling boring, it's actually my passion. I'm also not sure why we're talking about GnP, lol.

Basically I'm taking Alex who is a 2 division champ in both sports he competed in as well as finishing 80% of his MMA fights and 2/3 of his kickboxing bouts with multiple title defenses. Israel Adesanya is also a more impressive victory in MMA than any win Henry has in context, because Henry's wins over Dom and TJ were not in their primes.

Henry only wrestled at 121lbs (55kg). While he did win gold's in back to back years at places like Pan Am's, that's not exactly defending a title although it's close. But it's still only one division and less violent/combative than kickboxing. My point also tracks because Henry only finished 50% of his MMA wins and had 0 career submissions. I tend to favor finishing fights > decisions for better combat sports legend.

Long winded way of what I already said before. If you're gonna ask me who's better at combatives, I'm taking the more violent guy when accomplishments are relatively equal.

Good post but you wasted it on orca lol

 

[BabyBlue_Bomber]

Bro I cuddle bigger stronger men 3 x week and dominate them between my legs while lying on my back. Yeah. Yesterday I even finished off a fully grown guy from behind with no reach around. Come at me bro.

 

[Fedorgasm]

Interesting comparison. Henry went 1-1 with potential goat mighty mouse.

Which is slightly more impressive than Alex going 1-1 with maybe the second to goat. Especially since Henry got the last win and Alex got the last loss.

Outside of that, I think Henry's accomplishments before the UFC are more impressive than Alex's. But he retired too early and returned too late, so Alex could surpass him depending on how his ending plays out.

 

[Lord Pyjamas]

Henry Cejudo went full retard when it came to cringey stuff so my mind is trying to erase his merits. I guess that is his legacy for me even though he was exceptionally skilled.

 

[burningspear]

smaller guys, less competition, less recognition, kinda makes sense

 

[Westbrick]

What Alex did in Kickboxing is way harder than anything Cejudo did in wrestling.

 

[storeybuckle]

Winning the Olympics in wrestling ranks much higher than being a kickboxing champ.

But they've both done great in MMA.

Even if his Olympic gold was won at 55kg/121.25 pounds?

 

[Krimzon]

wrestling in itself is a harder sport than kickboxing, so Cejudo via olympic gold

 

[Dorkman]

Probably alex. If Henry hadn't pissed away the remaining of his prime, maybe he could have been the higher regarded. But he over estimated his own worth.

 

[Vil7]

Gold medal is a huge accomplishment but in MMA I think Periera has been crushing people in a much more dominant fashion than Cejudo ever did.

 

[KBE6EKCTAH_CCP]

Both double champions. Both achieved greatness aside from UFC success. Who would you rank higher?

Pereira is almost half a meter higher than say who doe.