Best second place finisher, Cormier or Crocop.

[Taric]

If it wasn't for a guy named Fedor, Great Heavyweight fighter of all time and in most fans' minds Great Fighter of all time period, Crocop would've become the PRIDE HW Champion of the world.

Cool story bro.

 

[Steve08]

Cool story bro.

Cro cop fucked nogueira up standing in the first round, I'd pick him to win a rematch in say early 05 or late 04 after he developed that absurd takedown defense.

That was a beautiful armbar though, man, vintage Nog was the tits.

 

[cyborgassassin]

CC by a mile

 

[Taric]

Cro cop fucked nogueira up standing in the first round, I'd pick him to win a rematch in say early 05 or late 04 after he developed that absurd takedown defense.

That was a beautiful armbar though, man, vintage Nog was the tits.

Nogueira beat everybody, except Fedor, in the HW division. His resume is arguably better than Fedor's. You name a HW champion, Minotauro has probably fought them.

Cro Cop doesn't have that distinction. Not even close.

 

[Steve08]

Nogueira beat everybody, except Fedor, in the HW division. His resume is arguably better than Fedor's. You name a HW champion, Minotauro has probably fought them.

Cro Cop doesn't have that distinction. Not even close.

No question that Noguiera accomplished more throughout his career, but you can't say their first fight was going well for him before he got that takedown in the second. Mirko only had like two years of mma experience at that point too.

 

[anthony stark]

If there were not Fedor, Crocop would still lose to Minotauro.

you mean minotauro would armbar cro cop?

 

[Taric]

but you can't say their first fight was going well for him before he got that takedown in the second.

Sure. But you also can't tell me Nog wouldn't find a way to win the fight. His superior resume is proof Nog was capable of hanging with various styles and come away with the W.

It's lunacy to doubt the guy who won the previous fight, and with the better resume.

 

[Senzo Tanaka]

Why don't we find out and have them fight now that Cro Cop is back?

...please don't.

 

[Oliver Clothesoff]

Well you could make this argument really for anybody who's lost to a champion, am I Right? but I Do agree with you Anderson was Rich's kryptonite.

I was so depressed after that fight. Rich never was the same after that.. THAT'S the Anderson Silva I'd like to see return though. When he was seriously climbing the ladder. Not the clown prince he became later in his career. Does he really think that shit's funny? I always thought it was juvenile and disrespectful to his opponents...

 

[Steve08]

Sure. But you also can't tell me Nog wouldn't find a way to win the fight. His superior resume is proof Nog was capable of hanging with various styles and come away with the W.

It's lunacy to doubt the guy who won the previous fight, and with the better resume.

Well yeah, it would probably be over any time Nog got him on the ground, but Crocop's takedown defense was not what it would later become when they first fought. Like, cro cop went from getting taken down by nog to stuffing the hell out of randleman and coleman within about a year, which is fairly compelling imo but I would still have to favor Nog. He was in effect impossible to finish at that point in his career and of course would never stop trying to look for the submission, plus beating him up for 20 minutes straight not so easy, only ever achieved by the GOAT in Fedor.

 

[HHJ]

Funny you say CC didn't fight HWs at GP 06, when the fact is everybody else was heavier than him that night.

There was also a 1 round before the Finals, where he faced Yoshida and both were at the same weight.

CC was a tiny HW who could've gone to LHW no problem btw.

''Scraps'' he fought between Nogueira and Fedor:

Josh Barnett
Mark Coleman
Alexander Emelianenko
Kevin Randleman x2
Maybe I could also mention the giant Ron Waterman who was 10–1 at the time

randleman,coleman and esp waterman were all seen as guys who couldnt last more than a round with mirko back then. The randleman rematch always seemed fishy to me but ill give him that he avenge the loss. Barnett was a real good matchup on paper for sure but he just was in terrible condition and those fights just werent what they could be. Aleks at least could be seen as a threat in a "well lets throw him in there and see how he does" capacity,for what had he done before he fought mirko,honestly?

they werent throwing mirko in there with nog again,nor kharitonov or schilt or any of the other tougher fighters at the time who could be considered alot closer to a title shot than hammer house guys or a debuting pride fighter in barnett.I dont really care if wanderlei was heavier than mirko,hes no natural hw,he looked slow as molasses in there against mirko at that weight. Look at who else mirko was put up against.This tourney was designed for mirko to win,he got the conor mcgregor treatment all the way.

nogueira always had to fight the toughest guys and up until barnett he never lost against them which you cant say either of those things about mirko,so mirko isnt allowed to have second place in my book

 

[chinarice]

The answer is Faber. Forever 2nd place.

 

[xupacabra]

You can make the same argument for Rich Franklin if it wasn't for Anderson Silva.

Those 2 brutal beatings really Fucked him up and he was never the same after.

What about JDS ?

 

[ARONAbeetFEDOR]

Cormier won a tournament consisting of Fedor, Bigfoot, Arlovski, Barnett, Overeem, Werdum. I think that trumps Cro Cop's OWGP win.

 

[HHJ]

Cormier won a tournament consisting of Fedor, Bigfoot, Arlovski, Barnett, Overeem, Werdum. I think that trumps Cro Cop's OWGP win.

yeah the cards were infinitley stacked against him and he took it all.

 

[ARONAbeetFEDOR]

yeah the cards were infinitley stacked against him and he took it all.

Oddly enough, they both fought Barnett in the final round.

 

[loisestrad]

nogueira always had to fight the toughest guys and up until barnett he never lost against them which you cant say either of those things about mirko,so mirko isnt allowed to have second place in my book

Mirko doesn't have second place. Nog does. I honestly thought that was pretty much concensus.

 

[HHJ]

now dont get me wrong,im a big mirko fan,and was glad to see him win something,even tho it was almost given to him. I was happy he was happy lol

 

[countswagula]

Cro Cop was #3

 

[K1MMA]

randleman,coleman and esp waterman were all seen as guys who couldnt last more than a round with mirko back then. The randleman rematch always seemed fishy to me but ill give him that he avenge the loss. Barnett was a real good matchup on paper for sure but he just was in terrible condition and those fights just werent what they could be. Aleks at least could be seen as a threat in a "well lets throw him in there and see how he does" capacity,for what had he done before he fought mirko,honestly?

they werent throwing mirko in there with nog again,nor kharitonov or schilt or any of the other tougher fighters at the time who could be considered alot closer to a title shot than hammer house guys or a debuting pride fighter in barnett.I dont really care if wanderlei was heavier than mirko,hes no natural hw,he looked slow as molasses in there against mirko at that weight. Look at who else mirko was put up against.This tourney was designed for mirko to win,he got the conor mcgregor treatment all the way.

nogueira always had to fight the toughest guys and up until barnett he never lost against them which you cant say either of those things about mirko,so mirko isnt allowed to have second place in my book

Oh man, the excuses...:icon_lol:

There's no doubt that Nogueira was the 2nd best in PRIDE and still is the 2nd best HW of all time.

I actually thought CC wouldn't win it, as Bonjasky (CC's training partner at the time) said he started to slow down a lot.

And he did kinda look less impressive just before GP.

But my argument was it was CC's night, he was on fire and that's just what usually matters the most.