Being a well rounded fighter is great until you run into a highly specialized offensive juggernaut who has good defense

[Marko Polo]

That or exiting the pocket with your chin up against a counter puncher with massive power won't pay off. Take your pick, I guess.

See it’s the implication that you know more than Volkanovski about fighting. I’m sure if you said to him “just don’t exit with your chin in the air next time” he’d go “why didn’t I think of that!!?”

 

[fortheo]

His subs before joining the ufc were lethal…..Who has Volk subbed? ….wrestling is tiring ….if Topuria can out box everyone….its the smarter more entertaining rout to victory

I have plenty of good things to say about illia, but his grappling at a high level is just a mystery to me at the moment. The guys he was subbing in the regional scene are pretty bad.I just need to see this mythical "high level grappler since birth!" more against some high level opponents.

I do agree that wrestling is tiring, more for some than others. I'd just like to see ilia tested more in may ways before I say he's super well rounded, but props to him, he puts guys to sleep before they can really test him.

 

[maximus__]

Volk win a close first round … Topuria landed a few big shots himself including a big leg kick ….Topuria didn’t come for a decision…..he was setting traps and took volk out with much effort…..Wouldnt say he was on his way to a decision when then fight wasn’t even half over

I never said Topuria didn't I am crediting them both. Volk looked to be the better technical fighter with the more diverse skillset and Topuria had the clear power advantage, like we all assumed. Topuria did beautifully and got that KO, but Volk was well and truly in that fight until he was out and was having plenty of success. Topuria is really good and adjusted to the kicks well which hae also been an issue for him throughout his career. Volk also fixed some issues with his striking and threw other kicks besides leg kicks for a change. He was fighting exactly like most people thought he should, until he got backed to the cage and finished.

 

[Fedora Millionankles]

That's my takeaway from the Topuria Volk fight. I think Volk is as well rounded as it gets but he faced a guy in Topuria who was just far more dangerous on the feet. Volk has more diverse striking but Topurias boxing was good enough to shut all that down and while volk is probably the better grappler, Topurias defense was good enough to render it a non factor.

So Ilia is a striking specialist with good defense?
Guess what, that makes him well rounded..

 

[Fedora Millionankles]

I have plenty of good things to say about illia, but his grappling at a high level is just a mystery to me at the moment. The guys he was subbing in the regional scene are pretty bad.I just need to see this mythical "high level grappler since birth!" more against some high level opponents.

I do agree that wrestling is tiring, more for some than others. I'd just like to see ilia tested more in may ways before I say he's super well rounded, but props to him, he puts guys to sleep before they can really test him.

Bryce Mitchell is a high level grappler and Ilia ragdolled and submitted him with ease and fended off all of Ryan halls grappling attempts before KO’ing him on the ground.
That at least shows that he’s above average if not better than that.

 

[jk7707]

That's my takeaway from the Topuria Volk fight. I think Volk is as well rounded as it gets but he faced a guy in Topuria who was just far more dangerous on the feet. Volk has more diverse striking but Topurias boxing was good enough to shut all that down and while volk is probably the better grappler, Topurias defense was good enough to render it a non factor.

Na. There are plenty of counter examples to what you're claiming. The undeniable pattern is age. Volk was doing al the right things, but against someone who is that dangerous slowing down, even just a bit, is a death sentence. It's played out, over and over again.

 

[Skarsgard]

See it’s the implication that you know more than Volkanovski about fighting. I’m sure if you said to him “just don’t exit with your chin in the air next time” he’d go “why didn’t I think of that!!?”

This is nonsense. The suggestion that you can't critique a fighter's skillset or acknowledge their flaws is just bullshit.

Volk is a better fighter than I could dream of being. He still leaves his chin up when leaving the pocket.

I'm sure Cigano knew he had a nasty habit of not pivoting at all or using angles when moving back, and instead just walked straight into the cage. He still did it time and time again. He still got knocked out or lit up several times because of it.

 

[Rationality]

Or Volk is just getting old.

 

[Rapa]

volk is probably the better grappler

no.

 

[Rapa]

Not as well rounded as volk. Islam probably would have taken down and subbed Topuria. And I think Volk has better offensive wrestling than Topuria as well

at least search fighter before u talk bs

 

[Rapa]

Nah, seriously though, what topuria has shown us has been good, but he's very clearly going out their with a boxing based approach, so I understand why you made this thread. I gotta see more of his entire game against worthwhile opponents before I can say he's as well rounded as his fans are making him out to be.

why he should use wrestling/grappling if he can win with boxing? why he should show all his weapons early? so people can figure out how to beat him? he is smart he will use wrestling only when he will need it

 

[Rapa]

If you haven't heard, topuria is now the most well rounded fighter ever, despite only fighting one truly notable opponent and using 90 percent boxing in his ufc fights.

The guy is great at what he does, but the hyperbole about how well rounded he is is getting out of control. Topuria still has a lot he needs to prove in my opinion.

everytime you doubt topuria and everytime he proves you wrong i bet if he defends belt 10 times and moves up to LW and wins belt you will still have doubts only reason is you are hater.

 

[Rapa]

The evloev fight will answer some questions if it ever happens.

ilia will outgrapple evloev if u want we can bet

 

[shunyata]

That's my takeaway from the Topuria Volk fight. I think Volk is as well rounded as it gets but he faced a guy in Topuria who was just far more dangerous on the feet. Volk has more diverse striking but Topurias boxing was good enough to shut all that down and while volk is probably the better grappler, Topurias defense was good enough to render it a non factor.

You've basically described Franklin vs Silva.

 

[Eric Silva 2.0]

On the flip, being specialized is good until you run into someone that that specialization doesn't work against (usually when a wrestler finds someone they can't take down, but another example is Cruz's unorthodox boxing/footwork getting laughed at by Cody) and they look like a fish out of water

Cody/Dom was a better example of this. In Volk/Topuria the same was true but the other factors might've been more important. I picked Ilia to win but it wasn't only because of the boxing/power advantage. Volk's KO's,age and his mental state also were factors I considered in order of importance. Fighting can be a game of inches and small slips in an area or two can make the difference between wins and losses.

 

[BisonTyson]

Nah bullshit. Volk is finished sad to say. Confidence destroyed by Islam in that last fight and no bias he lost the first fight too draw at best. His time is up. He'll keep fighting and guess what, he'll keep getting knocked the fuck out unless he fights mediocre opposition.

He's another Rob Whittaker. Never the same after Izzy flogged him.

 

[BisonTyson]

You can win many different ways.

Khabib wasn't an offensive juggernaut. He's a wrestler/submission etc. And he's the fucking best at it.

Although against Conor he chose to stand up and beat him at his own game. There are exceptions.

And there are exceptions in styles too.

 

[TeenageMutantLesnarTurtle]

I dont think its a coincidence that Volk went from not being stopped in a decade to getting knocked out 2 fights in a row...

 

[pankrat]

I have plenty of good things to say about illia, but his grappling at a high level is just a mystery to me at the moment. The guys he was subbing in the regional scene are pretty bad.I just need to see this mythical "high level grappler since birth!" more against some high level opponents.

I do agree that wrestling is tiring, more for some than others. I'd just like to see ilia tested more in may ways before I say he's super well rounded, but props to him, he puts guys to sleep before they can really test him.

I mean, the guy just had his first run to a a tittle shot. He got about as much tested as you can get for a first run:

- The most unorthodox and dangerouss submission artist in Ryan Hall, negated all his tricky entrances and even ended up going to the ground with him and KO him cold.
- A rangey striking specialist a weight class above: KOed him cold
- One of the best grappling specialist at FW in Mitchell, hurt him and subbed him
- A fairly accomplished grappler and probably the only one who could match his punching power in Emmet, and outclassed him
- The most well-rounded opponent you can get in Volk...and put a masterpiece for another cold KO

And if he didnt face Evloev yet, it was only because Movsar pulled out of their fight.

Yeah Ilia has only 7 UFC fights, obviously can't be as tested as a long time veteran in the promotion, but it's hard to not give credit to his all-around game at this point, including how he deals with grappling in MMA

 

[pankrat]

Yes and no. Shields and Askren for instance were absolutely correct to try and grapple Maia, even if they had different results attempting it. They're all 3 master grapplers and shitty strikers. Might as well see who's better on the ground than risk a standup fight none of them really know how to win.

Trying to fight anyway other than your own bread and butter is stupid. Might be a worthless effort as the other guy's just better than you at it, or nullifies it anyways, but trying something else, still using Maia as he's such an obvious example, is what gets you Nate Marquardt'd instead.

Shields tried a standup fight on Akiyama - who has had competitive standup fights with legit strikers as Belcher or Misaki among others - and succeeded. Shields outstriked Akiyama. Looking ugly, clumsy and whatever, but he did beat him in the feet fair and square.