Movies AVENGERS: INFINITY WAR Thread v.10

[Deleted member 110072]

It's hard for me to agree with moniker "naturally camp" when we're talking about two different forces at work: filmmaking technique and audience reception. What I'm saying is that you think it's camp because technology wasn't yet available to make it look legit, plus the adaptation may have diverged from the source material might have been too stylistic to be taken as non-camp (I am purposefully not using the word "seriously" here). You wondered why there weren't more MCU caliber films before the MCU, and technology is why.

Yeah I'm talking very much about audience expectation, prior to Singer's first X-men superhero adaptations on screen had tended to be pretty camp, that's not nesserally a criticism of them, Burtons Batman films and the original Superman are good films but I think they also clearly have a strong campness to them as well(even of Burtons deal of darkness too). There was I think very much the desire to push against that as strongly as possible and show superhero films in as serious a light as possible.

Do you think that might because the MCU comprises now about 85% of the superhero landscape?

Marvel did arguably introduce there basic tone quite early though, I spose you could argue Ironman starts off more down to earth but you clearly have more of a sense of fun in that film. If anything Marvel have benefited from a push back the other direction, there not as camp as the pre millennial superhero adpatations but they aren't as focused on constant overt seriousness as those post millennium films either leaving plenty of room for humour and a setting that's that bit more cartoonish.

 

[Mike]

Minus the Infinity Gauntlet, what exactly is Thanos' powerset? Is he just really strong? I'm guessing he's reasonably vulnerable as Gamora believed she killed him in that illusion.

He has superhuman strength and durability, teleportation, energy projection, and a lot of highly advanced and powerful tech. The reason they were capable of hurting him is Drax, Gamora, and Nebula have super strength (they don't do a good job of showing this), and they have what are essentially magic weapons. In Marvels cosmic setting there are high tech weapons that are capable of piercing people with superhuman durability. Especially when wielded by someone with enhanced strength.

 

[Mike]

I liked it. Thanos isn't a cosmic being. The stones aren't in him, they're on the glove. The stones are powerful but It's like having any other source of power, you have to harness it and access it.

Eeeehhh I'd say he is, at least in the comics. there he has beaten Silver Surfers ass many times, without the stones.

 

[PEB]

Full circle makes a lot of sense. All the last Avenger's left alive where in the first Avengers film.

The original 6 is what they call it.

 

[Magooglie]

Eeeehhh I'd say he is, at least in the comics. there he has beaten Silver Surfers ass many times, without the stones.

In the comics he's on the cosmic level and the gauntlet dynamics are different. In the movies he's like a regular guy from his race. Though it seems like his power level is a step up from the Asgardians like how they're a step up from humans.

 

[MayhemMonkey]

What?

I feel like he's setting up to just answer


"I am groot" lol

 

[minute bull]

Yeah I'm talking very much about audience expectation, prior to Singer's first X-men superhero adaptations on screen had tended to be pretty camp, that's not nesserally a criticism of them, Burtons Batman films and the original Superman are good films but I think they also clearly have a strong campness to them as well(even of Burtons deal of darkness too). There was I think very much the desire to push against that as strongly as possible and show superhero films in as serious a light as possible.

Why do you think that? Using the Burton films as example, you can see that they went the opposite way during the Schumacher regime because they felt Burton's vision was too dark. That's a direct cause and effect, whereas the desire you refer to I think is more an audience perception that bears little relevance to how things actually went down.

Marvel did arguably introduce there basic tone quite early though, I spose you could argue Ironman starts off more down to earth but you clearly have more of a sense of fun in that film. If anything Marvel have benefited from a push back the other direction, there not as camp as the pre millennial superhero adpatations but they aren't as serious as focused on constant overt seriousness as those post millennium films either leaving plenty of room for humour and a setting that's that bit more cartoonish.

What am I asking is don't you think most comic book films have trended back toward that light tone BECAUSE most of the comic book films are controlled by the MCU? That because the DCEU has failed so often out the gate the MCU has usurped major focus as being the successful template? I don't know if you're old enough to recall this, but there was time this was ABSOLUTELY flipped: that any Marvel film was expected to be a JOKE compared to DC. It's because DC was (and still is) backed by Warners, but Marvel hadn't been yet become 100% Disneyfied.

 

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

Minus the Infinity Gauntlet, what exactly is Thanos' powerset? Is he just really strong? I'm guessing he's reasonably vulnerable as Gamora believed she killed him in that illusion.

I’ve seen multiple people in this thread answer this question by listing his powers from the comics. However, in the MCU the simple answer is we don’t know, they haven’t shown what he’s capable of and my guess is the answer is going to be not much.

I’m sure he’s fairly strong but he’s not going to be Hulk or Thor strong, he won’t be able to fly, he won’t be able to project energy, and he won’t have incredible durability. He’ll just be big and strong but mortal.

 

[Deleted member 110072]

They'd be smart to have the Widow film be a continuation of Fury's adventures before Iron Man 1. It's Marvel's strength making all the connections between their properties. I would imagine a Widow 'solo' film would play out like big screen team Agents of Shield but by naming it Black Widow they test to see how much brand recognition she possesses and/or they hope to positively influence her brand recognition. And they can continue to use that name for post-Thanos adventures with other non-solo Avengers.

We saw her character worked well in that kind of film with WInter Solider, I mean she was close to a co lead in that and I could well imagine pushing a bit further and having Hawk instead of Cap as a co lead.

Honestly |'v never watched much of Agents of Shield and I think on the big screen you could argue that its an aspect of the franchise that is still a bit underplayed, especially as I don't think they really hit the ideal tone for it until the Russo's arrived.

 

[Magooglie]

We saw her character worked well in that kind of film with WInter Solider, I mean she was close to a co lead in that and I could well imagine pushing a bit further and having Hawk instead of Cap as a co lead.

Honestly |'v never watched much of Agents of Shield and I think on the big screen you could argue that its an aspect of the franchise that is still a bit underplayed, especially as I don't think they really hit the ideal tone for it until the Russo's arrived.

She's Cap's lieutenant by Civil War. So she can definitely be the New Avengers leader. I'm not sure if they want to bring back big screen Shield to the post-2019 MCU but she'd be the connecting point to pre-2008 Shield and post 2019 New Avengers.

 

[bosox32]

I feel like he's setting up to just answer


"I am groot" lol

Don’t know how to post the tweet but James Gunn came out saying that Groots final “I am Groot” translated in groot talk while looking at Rocket was “Dad!?”

 

[Deleted member 110072]

Why do you think that? Using the Burton films as example, you can see that they went the opposite way during the Schumacher regime because they felt Burton's vision was too dark. That's a direct cause and effect, whereas the desire you refer to I think is more an audience perception that bears little relevance to how things actually went down.

I wouldn't say that campness and darkness are mutually exclusive though, look at the 1980 Flash Gordon for example. Burton's films(especially Returns) were pretty dark but also I'd say camp with a tone elevated well above reality, Schumacher dropped most of the darkness and played up the campiess even more.

I think audience perception had a big factor in how things went down, film makers were reacting against that perception that superheroes were naturally very camp by pushing as far in the other direction as possible.

What am I asking is don't you think most comic book films have trended back toward that light tone BECAUSE most of the comic book films are controlled by the MCU? That because the DCEU has failed so often out the gate the MCU has usurped major focus as being the successful template? I don't know if you're old enough to recall this, but there was time this was ABSOLUTELY flipped: that any Marvel film was expected to be a JOKE compared to DC. It's because DC was (and still is) backed by Warners, but Marvel hadn't been yet become 100% Disneyfied.

The DCEU is I feel also aiming for a style broadly similar to Marvel, I don't think its been nearly as successful but still these are not films aiming for the overt serious edge of Nolans Batman, they are looking to push more of an elevated reality than that, even if in an IMHO rather childish grimdark fashion.

If theres been a reaction I would say its actually more something like Logan that goes back to that Nolan like self consciously serious tone or arguably even beyond it.

 

[MayhemMonkey]

Don’t know how to post the tweet but James Gunn came out saying that Groots final “I am Groot” translated in groot talk while looking at Rocket was “Dad!?”

holy shit

 

[Magooglie]

It would be funny if they grew a 3rd Groot from Stormbreaker's handle.

 

[Limbo Pete]

Don’t know how to post the tweet but James Gunn came out saying that Groots final “I am Groot” translated in groot talk while looking at Rocket was “Dad!?”

Heartbreaking

 

[chrisdiaz]

After watching this 3 more times, It feels like mid way through the movie it takes a big slow down setting up the 3rd act. Then the 3rd act is fucking crazy with 2 huge battles on 2 different planets.

Watching the movie the 1st time, i felt like there was more time in between the titan and earth battles.

 

[bosox32]

After watching this 3 more times, It feels like mid way through the movie it takes a big slow down setting up the 3rd act. Then the 3rd act is fucking crazy with 2 huge battles on 2 different planets.

Watching the movie the 1st time, i felt like there was more time in between the titan and earth battles.

I felt the same way after my second watch. Action is immediate with Thanos v Hulk and NYC battle. We assume the action will slow but then we get the surprise attack on Vision/SW. After that there is quite a lull as the chest pieces are moving IM/Strange traveling To Titan, Thor travels to get Stormbreaker, Thanos getting the Soul gem, and the rest of the Avengers going to Wakanda.

Next battle isn’t until Titan maybe 35-45 minutes later.

 

[MayhemMonkey]

Quit being sad. Groot is a tree ffs who cares

 

[Mike]

In the comics he's on the cosmic level and the gauntlet dynamics are different. In the movies he's like a regular guy from his race. Though it seems like his power level is a step up from the Asgardians like how they're a step up from humans.

Yeah he's not shown doing much before he has two of the stones. not sure how powerful he is without them. I'm guessing movie Thanos only has superhuman strength and durability without the stones.

 

[Mike]

I felt the same way after my second watch. Action is immediate with Thanos v Hulk and NYC battle. We assume the action will slow but then we get the surprise attack on Vision/SW. After that there is quite a lull as the chest pieces are moving IM/Strange traveling To Titan, Thor travels to get Stormbreaker, Thanos getting the Soul gem, and the rest of the Avengers going to Wakanda.

Next battle isn’t until Titan maybe 35-45 minutes later.

What was great to me was their was a lot of suspenseful and interesting stuff going on outside of fight scenes, like Thor crafting the god axe. Because of that I didn't even notice a lull in action. The move had excellent pacing. I was never bored in an almost three hour fllm.