armbar from halfguard

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by randomg1t, Dec 17, 2005.

  1. randomg1t

    randomg1t EVERYTIME CHAMPION

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    last night at training we were doing some halfguard techniques (passing, defense..) and later did some sparring from that position. i'm no ground master and the guy i rolled with isn't exactly rickson either.

    i was in his halfguard, one leg tied inbetween his - i managed to pull my knee out so i got up pretty high on him (but was unable to go to full side control because he still had my leg locked there), so i just grabbed his arm and swung my other leg over his face. so it was really an armbar but my knees weren't together since one of my legs was still entangled in his. i made him tap.

    so here's my question, is this an actual technique or did i just get it because we're both noobs and he didn't know how to defend? if so, please tell me how such an attack can be prevented so i know what to look out for.
     
  2. scorcho

    scorcho Brown Belt

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    Sounds like someone with more experience would have been able to escape, but hey, if it works, why not...just call it a tech.
     
  3. migo**

    migo** Guest

    The way to prevent it is to push his leg that's over your head and turning into him, which is easier if you've got one of his legs wrapped. All you really need for an armbar is to keep him from turning into you so he can bend his elbow out.
     
  4. Dr. BadAss

    Dr. BadAss Guest

    It's possible. My buddy Sean got tapped this way when he was fighting Bill Cooper in the purple belt absolute finals of the Gracie tournament. It is easier to escape, but they were going at it for 25 minutes of the finals, after about 8 fights (with 30 min time limits).
     
  5. Big Red

    Big Red Green Belt

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    I've seen Ricco Rodriguez attempt it in the UFC & it wasn't like the guy pulled h/guard as he went for it, he was just in a position to throw a leg & it got the position, I think the round ended but he had it looking good.
     
  6. Zankou

    Zankou Muscle and Hate Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    That's awesome! I never thought about it. I guess you can do it any time you get your foot sufficiently far up. And your opponent's arm protection will probably be suck, since it is the wrong arm to protect, he thinks you are in half guard, and he's probably trying to push you back with arm extended some. I gotta try this. Sure, it's not pretty, but it's clever.
     
  7. Foolkiller

    Foolkiller You have meddled with the primal forces of nature!

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    I tried this out today, may try post it up along with some other techs over at lockflow.com tomorrow.
     
  8. Sherdog_Mutt

    Sherdog_Mutt Purple Belt

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    Yes, it is an actual technique. You don't really see it that often because most people opt to pass 1/2 guard first.

    It is not nearly as easy to escape as it seems. In order for the guy to sit up and throw off your leg, he needs to release his half-guard. If he does that, and you're waiting for it, you can simply pull out your other leg and place him in a more conventional armbar position.
     
  9. Mark Limbaga

    Mark Limbaga Amateur Fighter

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    as long as one arm is across his face, you'll be able to pull off the armbar if it is tight enough
     
  10. randomg1t

    randomg1t EVERYTIME CHAMPION

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    wow look at all the replies! this forum section is alot cooler than the mma discussion one. :)

    i'll try this on someone better than me next time, just to see if i get pwnt quickly.

    again, thanks for the feedback, you guys rock.
     
  11. ZeMino

    ZeMino Blue Belt

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    I know its possible to get an armbar from the bottom of the half guard.. but from the top.. its possible but it would depend on his knowledge of the half guard and your body sizes.. if anybody's got the technique, please post... be nice to know..
     
  12. randomg1t

    randomg1t EVERYTIME CHAMPION

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    i actually did in the original post, its no rocket science. :)
     
  13. ZeMino

    ZeMino Blue Belt

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    sorry, I missed it.. I think I need to sleep.. Thanks..
     
  14. VanDamme

    VanDamme Green Belt

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    The technique can work, but I would doubt it would be effective against higher level competitors. One of the more important things when applying an armbar is keeping the pressure against your opponents arm when you squeeze your knees together. Natrually since one of your legs in trapped in half guard, you lose this pressure and your opponent has a much greater chance of escaping than you would like.

    The technique works, but its a low percentage technique that in the long term I dont feel its advantages (tapping your opponent) would outweigh its disadvantages (losing your position) in terms of how often they occurred.
     
  15. Shaldag

    Shaldag Orange Belt

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    My judo sensei (oldskool japanese 8th dan) was showing some finishes from halfguard top and ended with this one, he said you wont always get it, but he has seen it succeed in competition.
     
  16. Matt Thornton

    Matt Thornton Amateur Fighter

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    I'm having a little trouble visualizing this. Is your free leg stepped up high as close to his head as possible? (Or just high in general)

    If so, watch out. There is a sweep from here in Eddie Bravo's book, that is used specifically when people try to avoid the "Old School" by stepping up high.

    I'll try to explain the movement. Eddie, if you're reading this, hopefully you don't mind me explaining this technique.

    First off, was this submission grappling or with a gi? If it's with a gi, disregard what I say. I know next to nothing about grappling with a gi (I've never trained with one on, and the most I've ever done is viewed some instructionals on gi with Cesar Gracie).

    If this is sub grappling or MMA sparring, read on.

    First off, after reading Eddie's book, I think the "Lockdown" half guard system is the way to go. Establish the "lockdown" on his leg, and pummel for double underhooks. If you don't know what the lockdown is, sorry, but it's way too early in the morning for me to try to explain it.

    Alright, now, here's what you need to be careful of, or if someone's trying to armbar you, do this. The top man, for whatever reason (usually to block a sweep, but in this case we can say for an armbar), steps his leg up, so that the bottom of the foot of the free leg is now on the ground, while the knee of his trapped leg is still on the mat. He is, in effect, trying to posture up, in a way. For all purposes, let's say the top man stepped up with his left leg, and his right leg is trapped in half guard.

    The bottom man, who should have double underhooks, gets up onto his (in this case) right elbow and right side. Just by doing this, judging by the photos in Eddie's book, this already eliminates the possibility of the top man getting an armbar. Now his weight is high, and he's in a bad spot.

    The bottom man, now on his side, falls back, and reaches his right arm under the thigh of the top man's left leg (almost in the same way you go for X-Guard or a knee bar from open guard). He also traps the top man's right arm to prevent him from posting. From here, the bottom man posts on his right leg and rolls the top man over.

    The sweeping motion is extremely similar to the sweep you use if you want to turn your armbar from guard to an armbar on top. Reach between the legs, and bringing him on top of you, roll him over. Except you're also using your leg to bridge up.

    The name of the sweep is Plan B.

    If this made absolutely no sense, I apologize. Again, I'm having trouble even visualizing this armbar. But I figured, anything involving stepping up in half guard, I should include this.
     
  17. randomg1t

    randomg1t EVERYTIME CHAMPION

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    hey iceman, thanks for a great reply!

    regarding your visualizing trouble, here's an example. im in his halfguard with my left leg caught inbetween his legs and my right free. i manage to somewhat free my entangled leg, but not completely. i try to bring the knee up as high as i can, like i was attempting to free it completely and pass guard. but since this is often impossible and the bottom guy is pushing me down and defending the fuck out of it, i grab his left arm and swing my right leg over his face. so basically i'm armbarring him like i would from the mount, except my left leg doesn't cross his chest but is still entangled in his legs.

    i realise it would be much easier for them to push my right leg off their face and get into my guard than when applying a regular armbar, but fuckit i got it the only time i tried it and i figured i'd ask you guys about it. like someone said above, it aint pretty but it might work.
     
  18. colinm

    colinm Brown Belt

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    i think the problem you'll run into is that good half guard players arent going to give you that near arm to armbar - i.e. if you are passing to your left, you opponent should be on his right side and it will be hard to get deep enough on his right arm. the only way i could see you setting up someone good with this would be countering their escape from the backmount - so you would have them turned away from you with that near arm exposed. ive had this attempted on me, and imo if you don't control the elbow i'll hitchhiker escape all day.
     
  19. Aardvark

    Aardvark White Belt

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    I personally love this sub. It's kinda iffy for someone who knows that they're doing to let you get that much control over the far arm, but it does happen. I think Cameron Earle subbed his first round opponent in ADCC with something like this. Don't recall the exact setup though.

    It is an "actual technique" and I did get taught it during a class.
     
  20. sambosteve

    sambosteve Purple Belt

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    We practice this (with the jacket - it is harder without). Assuming it is your left leg that is trapped in his guard...

    I like it because it keeps the guy on the bottom with his attention split beteween defending and holding your leg. Let him have the leg but bait him by "faking" a pass attempt. One way to help prevent his reverse attempt is to get a tight cross face on him with your right arm. As noted above slide your right knee up deep to get his arm in your right armpit. Don't loosen up the crossface. Control his other arm with your free arm. It does not always work but, it often does - IF used as a baiting technique. You can also choose to transition to a kneebar by going knee on belly with your right leg and spinning to the opposite side.
     

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