Tech Apple Vision Pro first reviews

[Ruprecht]

Its a real shame that Asgards Wraith 2 is a quest exclusive because it would really highlight what VR games could really do when worn with a better headset like Varjo and Pimax. They really should have used that game to be a flagbearer on what PCVR could do instead of Half Life Alyx.

Demeo also is what should be showcased on what MR can do. I need to really get into that game more often

Meta's focusing on the standalone platform and Meta store. They can't compete with Steam on PCVR, as we saw with the Rift store. Hence using Asgard's Wrath II to show the potential of standalone with sufficient developer effort/money. That's also the reason for emphasis on MR.

As it is, taking on Google with the OS is a bold strategy. They've got a fair lead with their hardware and ecosystem, although the "Metaverse" R&D money doesn't seem to have gotten them much. They've made better OS developments recently by just imitating Apple.
Meanwhile Google/Alphabet are known for just abandoning products and this is a late return. They do have significant advantages with the playstore library and android development for hardware diversity. Maybe they will catch up? At least for general VR computing, if not gaming.

I do like the move to "Horizon OS" as a more open platform though. If Asus manages to make more premium headsets without completely blowing out the price, I could certainly see myself shifting to their hardware. Would have been nice to have an Asus version of the Quest 3. Presumably it'd even include a decent headstrap out of the box. Other things on my wishlist would have been eye tracking, slightly higher clocks/better cooling and upgraded displays using QLED mini-led or micro-led (micro-oled would have blown the price out Apple style). I would have been prepared to pay twice the price of the largest capacity Quest 3.

To me Pimax jank and poor quality control isn't worth the cost, weight and loss of actual standalone (I still don't think they have anything running properly) for the improvements in the resolution and QLED mini-led displays. A lot of their "features" also seem like development gimmicks without much of a use case. Like the swappable lenses and the supposed use of swappable display stacks on the upcoming Crystal Super.
Even with the brightness advantage, I'd need to try their new lenses to see if the aspheric lenses can match the Quest 3s pancake lenses for clarity. The Quest 3's pancake lenses absolutely blow anything with fresnel lenses completely out of the water. I also think the benefits of wireless for active PCVR outweigh any visual loss or lag from encoding versus a native display connection. Assuming you use a decent wifi 6e or wifi 7 setup and AV1 encoding. Of course the weight and cord don't really matter as much for people that only use their headsets for vr sims, but for everyone else it's a major drawback.

 

[PEB]

Its a real shame that Asgards Wraith 2 is a quest exclusive because it would really highlight what VR games could really do when worn with a better headset like Varjo and Pimax. They really should have used that game to be a flagbearer on what PCVR could do instead of Half Life Alyx.

Demeo also is what should be showcased on what MR can do. I need to really get into that game more often

It's a stretch but with Meta licensing the OS now to 3rd parties other could accelerate developing next gen MR headsets.

It would fix the issue not having a large enough library of games an set Qualcomm as the SOC standard. It would also allow for 3rd parties To setup their own game distribution app. It would be a huge help for smaller hardware developers.

Already LG is the first to sign up to use Mata OS Mark Zuckerberg admits to seeking to call it Android for VR/MR.

 

[PEB]

Off topic a little.

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[Ruprecht]

Off topic a little.

37K views · 411 reactions | 💥THE BATTLEFIELD IS OPEN💥 The wait is over. Contractors Showdown is officially released! If you still haven't purchased it, here's your chance 🔗 https://metaque.st/3QgsOUQ Parachute to the pinnacle of battle royale sup

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I might give it a crack once it's available Cross-Buy (developers have said it will be, but there's some delay getting it to the Meta PC store).
I don't mind battle royale games, although I prefer them slower paced and more tactical. Like the larger maps in PUBG. Only one I've played in VR is Population One, but I wasn't a huge fan of the more Fortnite style gameplay.

 

[PEB]

 

[Madmick]

This is the first thing I've seen that looks cool and new, and actually implements something that only VR/AR can do to deliver a unique experience that is woven into the storytelling designs of the world it features.

 

[PEB]

Well Apple has added a 3rd party app that allows you to run Steam VR games such a PC racing games on your Vision Pro. So if it runs on wireless on PC it will run on Vision Pro. Nothing officially from Apple but apparently works great.

It supports various gaming pads an Nintendo game controllers.

 

[Ruprecht]

Looks like Apple are retreading the same old steps of early VR. Although the hardware obviously improves on that pretty significantly.
"Interactive storytelling" was one of the main styles of VR "games" back in 2015-17, which got a lot of criticism (too many tech demos, not enough actual games and apps). It does still have its fans and newer titles (The Pirate Queen with Lucy Liu came out last August).

Even with comic franchises. In terms of PCVR interactive stories, the original Batman Arkham VR that came out in 2017 still looks good, and much better now with the increases in GPU power, headset resolutions and the switch from fresnel lenses to pancake and aspheric in more affordable headsets. Likewise that free Steam experience, Home: A VR Spacewalk. I'm still primarily a PCVR user, because of the increased fidelity and size possible on PC, but the majority of the money goes to standalone developers (just due to Meta's funding and the popularity of the Quest 2 & 3) . I do hope the Vision Pro pushes towards more powerful, laptop grade, standalone headsets becoming available. The Vision Pro's sales, the PSVR2 sales and the recent cancellation of the LG-Meta partnership, suggests otherwise though.

In terms of existing standalone interactive stories, The Quest versions struggle with their hardware limitations, although the heavily stylised animations can still look incredible. Just due to the artistic ability of some of the creators.
Lots of anime "visual novel" titles like Tokyo Chronos of course, but I still enjoy some of the immersive Quill animation series. Even without any gameplay.
The Tales from Soda Island series, Nightmara and Peace of Mind were great. Four Stories is probably still the title that made best use of the ability to move around the animation.

The Under, The Last Light, Invasion! and Zero Days VR being some other earlier "interactive experiences". A lot of the puzzle games like Wanderer and the Retropolis games would also count.

This Marvel version looks visually impressive just on youtube though, so I'd like to see it in the headset. Even if it's not really content to my taste and by all accounts the hand tracking is still shit. Hard to tell from youtube of course, the utter failure of flatscreen videos to capture VR experiences is still one of the biggest hurdles to VR marketing. Obviously the depth of field and scale just won't translate. Plenty of titles that have looked good in youtube trailers, and then the impressive environments turn out to be mostly flat skyboxes.
The Vision Pro is supposed to be available here in Oz from July 12th, and I'll be glad to finally get a hands on and form my own impressions.

 

[Ruprecht]

Well Apple has added a 3rd party app that allows you to run Steam VR games such a PC racing games on your Vision Pro. So if it runs on wireless on PC it will run on Vision Pro. Nothing officially from Apple but apparently works great.

It supports various gaming pads an Nintendo game controllers.

Are you talking about Steam Link or ALVR? That's been out a while. Not great.

 

[Jack Reacheround]

Not sure the Vision Pro is an Arcade topic, since it's not much for gaming. Certainly not VR gaming at any rate.

Wait, what? You can’t game on that thing? Wtf is the point? Is this like Google Glass or something? So I can look at a car driving down the street and see how much it costs?

And just for that I have to walk around looking like a total asshole?










And not to mention wearing goggles too.

 

[PEB]

Are you talking about Steam Link or ALVR? That's been out a while. Not great.

I get it your not a fan of Apple I could not buy one because at 3500 its a lot of money. There is a new headset that is coming out in multiple versions with much higher FOV but lower resolution but still nearly 3000 by 3000 per eye and can hit 120 hz. Likely not dealing with any ghosting or distortion on the edges. The price was announced for the consumer vs at 1970 dollars.

Still high but has inside out tracking just PC based though but Apple must have their own WIFI solution for gaming. Apple did really not want to make a gaming platform the Vision Pro already has a few simple games .

 

[Ruprecht]

I get it your not a fan of Apple I could not buy one because at 3500 its a lot of money. There is a new headset that is coming out in multiple versions with much higher FOV but lower resolution but still nearly 3000 by 3000 per eye and can hit 120 hz. Likely not dealing with any ghosting or distortion on the edges. The price was announced for the consumer vs at 1970 dollars.

Still high but has inside out tracking just PC based though but Apple must have their own WIFI solution for gaming. Apple did really not want to make a gaming platform the Vision Pro already has a few simple games .

Over here they start from $6K AUD, and don't compare well to the $800 Quest 3 for my use cases. Even Apple fans that own all their products still seem to struggle to find enough reasons to keep using it. I use VR daily, but excellent displays and laptop grade processing power aren't enough without any killer apps.
For Steam games the problem is the lack of controllers and the fact that their hand tracking supposedly sucks (I haven't tried one yet, but that seems to be the consensus opinion from people that try every headset. Good eye tracking, crap hand tracking)
Apple left out controllers because it's not a gaming device. So to use Steam VR effectively you either have to buy self tracking controllers like those from the Quest Pro (although apparently getting them to work with a Vision Pro is no easy task, and neither is keeping them working), you have to use lighthouse tracking which completely negates any standalone portability and costs a lot, or you have to map their poor handtracking to emulate controllers with third party apps.
None of which are good options.
Really, Apple's attitude seems to be that if you MUST play games with the Vision Pro, then they seem to want you to use it to play 2D games in MR using the Vision Pro as a large virtual display with a bluetooth gamepad (and Steamlink).
The displays are good, but otherwise it's your typical early generation Apple product. Walled garden, high price, limited use cases and considerable amounts of form over function.
I did hope they would be more successful. Not because I'd ever be likely to buy an Apple product, but for the increase in market size and the inevitable competition from Samsung and LG.

Wait, what? You can’t game on that thing? Wtf is the point? Is this like Google Glass or something? So I can look at a car driving down the street and see how much it costs?

And just for that I have to walk around looking like a total asshole?


And not to mention wearing goggles too.

The main use case they seem to be making is regular web browsing, messaging and content consumption. The idea of wearing one around for MR is more aspirational than factual. You have to literally "hold" a window and "carry" it to keep it in view. No "follow me" mode or pinned windows in relation to the headset. For that matter it doesn't even have some pretty basic OS functionality, like remembering how you've arranged your apps. No "workspaces" equivalent.
Games are bad. Even the games which do exist and should have been knocked out of the park, are worse than the same games on Quest 3, despite the discrepancy in headset performance. Demeo for instance. on Apple Vision Pro versus on Quest 3.
Combine that with the lag in their hand tracking, the lack of native controllers, and it's just not a gaming device at all.

 

[ookii]

Over here they start from $6K AUD, and don't compare well to the $800 Quest 3 for my use cases. Even Apple fans that own all their products still seem to struggle to find enough reasons to keep using it. I use VR daily, but excellent displays and laptop grade processing power aren't enough without any killer apps.
For Steam games the problem is the lack of controllers and the fact that their hand tracking supposedly sucks (I haven't tried one yet, but that seems to be the consensus opinion from people that try every headset. Good eye tracking, crap hand tracking)
Apple left out controllers because it's not a gaming device. So to use Steam VR effectively you either have to buy self tracking controllers like those from the Quest Pro (although apparently getting them to work with a Vision Pro is no easy task, and neither is keeping them working), you have to use lighthouse tracking which completely negates any standalone portability and costs a lot, or you have to map their poor handtracking to emulate controllers with third party apps.
None of which are good options.
Really, Apple's attitude seems to be that if you MUST play games with the Vision Pro, then they seem to want you to use it to play 2D games in MR using the Vision Pro as a large virtual display with a bluetooth gamepad (and Steamlink).
The displays are good, but otherwise it's your typical early generation Apple product. Walled garden, high price, limited use cases and considerable amounts of form over function.
I did hope they would be more successful. Not because I'd ever be likely to buy an Apple product, but for the increase in market size and the inevitable competition from Samsung and LG.



The main use case they seem to be making is regular web browsing, messaging and content consumption. The idea of wearing one around for MR is more aspirational than factual. You have to literally "hold" a window and "carry" it to keep it in view. No "follow me" mode or pinned windows in relation to the headset. For that matter it doesn't even have some pretty basic OS functionality, like remembering how you've arranged your apps. No "workspaces" equivalent.
Games are bad. Even the games which do exist and should have been knocked out of the park, are worse than the same games on Quest 3, despite the discrepancy in headset performance. Demeo for instance. on Apple Vision Pro versus on Quest 3.
Combine that with the lag in their hand tracking, the lack of native controllers, and it's just not a gaming device at all.

Latency seems very very terrible on the AVP for Steam VR games. It's like trying to use the older Rift S for newer VR games. By the time it's fixed Varjo and Pimax would have come out with their 2025 micro led VR headsets that would bypass AVP in terms of resolution by 20 percent and fraction of the price. I think Valve Index 2 would also be on par with AVP but with a far wider range on Fov than any other headset

 

[Ruprecht]

Latency seems very very terrible on the AVP for Steam VR games. It's like trying to use the older Rift S for newer VR games. By the time it's fixed Varjo and Pimax would have come out with their 2025 micro led VR headsets that would bypass AVP in terms of resolution by 20 percent and fraction of the price. I think Valve Index 2 would also be on par with AVP but with a far wider range on Fov than any other headset

Index 2 is a pipe dream at this stage. The rumour mill has been churning stories of "Deckard" for years, but there's nothing in terms of preliminary specs or even whether Valve is sticking with PCVR or heading to standalone.
Varjo XR4 seems like it was sold in beta testing, with everyone that forked out $4k USD for the thing understandably upset. Surprisingly the Pimax Crystal Light (with local dimming) is feature complete (a first for Pimax?), and priced well. Although it's a shame they dropped the eye tracking to hit that price point.
I'm not surprised that the AVP is no good for games, it's an Apple product after all, but despite the great display stack, processing power and sensor array, the AVP just doesn't seem to have created any compelling use cases. Not even for those that have gone all in on the Apple ecosystem.

 

[ookii]

Index 2 is a pipe dream at this stage. The rumour mill has been churning stories of "Deckard" for years, but there's nothing in terms of preliminary specs or even whether Valve is sticking with PCVR or heading to standalone.
Varjo XR4 seems like it was sold in beta testing, with everyone that forked out $4k for the thing understandably upset. Surprisingly the Pimax Crystal Light (with local dimming) is feature complete (a first for Pimax?), and priced well. Although it's a shame they dropped the eye tracking to hit that price point.

I wish they had just gone with just tethering for the original Crystal instead of adding the standalone as an option which no one uses. It would have saved so much on cost and reduced the weight like the crystal light. The super crystal being released this year is micro Led and has a resolution on par with the AVP at a price of around 2k. I wish that there would have been a trade in program to use the original crystal our a 1k credit to use and buy the Super

 

[PEB]

I wish they had just gone with just tethering for the original Crystal instead of adding the standalone as an option which no one uses. It would have saved so much on cost and reduced the weight like the crystal light. The super crystal being released this year is micro Led and has a resolution on par with the AVP at a price of around 2k. I wish that there would have been a trade in program to use the original crystal our a 1k credit to use and buy the Super

This is the problem with smaller players in the VR field they never fix their issues before rushing another product out. Everyone now rushing to develop a military grade AR headset costing way more then most consumers could buy.