All Time GOAT poll

VVarhead said:
Anderson offered Catchweight to GSP 2 times.
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He also offered to fight GSP at 170 (which Anderson's coaches admitted GSP wanted). How serious do you think Anderson was about offering any of those?

The problem with catch weight is it loses casual PPV's (99% of North America is casual at best, given PPV numbers of 1 million out of about 100 million households, so there's way more money in casuals than hardcore MMA fans), and Anderson and GSP both got a nice share of PPV buys.

Anderson likes to troll (its part of his charm, he doesn't take things seriously). Offering to change weight (170 or catchweight) is part of his trolling -- if he was serious about his offers to change weight he would have fought GSP at 170 like he offered (GSP wanted that). But weight change was a troll.

Ultimately, in no business do you give your competition a free advantage, and changing weight would be accepting a disadvantage for whoever changed weight. Anderson could have made 170 but would have been at a disadvantage. GSP could have made 185, but would have been at a disadvantage. The normal way of handling that is to guarantee more money for whoever agrees to the disadvantage, and both GSP and Anderson are smart guys and would know that, and would have wanted a guaranteed bonus) in the millions for changing weight. The UFC was too cheap to do the normal business thing and give extra for the one taking a disadvantage, neither GSP or Anderson were idiots, and so the fight didn't happen.
 
glavinator said:
It was years later, he put on a bunch more size since he wasn't planning to drop back down right away to keep competing at his weight class, and he was more mentally stable at that point in his life. Ulcerative colitis.

I'll save you the reply
"BUT HE FAKED IT SO HE WOULDNT HAVE TO DEFEND CUZ HE WAS SCARED!!!"
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He was scared any other of the top 5 mw would raped him. Lol. Dude refused to defend the mw belt. But is considering fighting a way smaller fighter in kahbib. But let gsp fans tell it lol
 
Saying he was overshadowed is an opinion and not fact, and you are asking ppl to explain why you have that opinion.

GSP broke live gate records, attendance records, title defense records, had super fights, and was plenty hyped.
 
Claude said:
Roids or not, I can't think of another sport where a GOAT wasn't clearly the most dominant of his era, and was instead overshadowed by others. In fact, GOAT's often overshadow proven steroid users, which makes them even greater.
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Um baseball? Barry Bonds might not even make it to the baseball hall of fame (a much bigger deal than the UFC hall of fame) because of steroids. Same for Roger Clemens.

Or track and field (the most popular event in the Olympics). Sprinter Ben Johnson was, unit Usain Bolt broke his record, the fastest 100m sprinter ever, but he's not even mentioned in the top sprinter list (and his records and medals taken away from him).

How about Lance Armstrong in cycling - he was one of the Tour de France GOAT's, now because of steroid use he's completely off the list.

And Bonds was a lot more dominant in baseball, and Johnson in the 100m, than anyone has ever been in MMA.

Me, I have the top four (in alphabetical order) as Anderson, Fedor, GSP and Jones, because I think they were all using. But in most sports, steroid use is a disqualifier from GOAT (or even from being champ -- Johnson had to give back medals he'd won a year before he'd tested positive).
 
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I dont think GSP was over shadowed by anyone.

Anyone who knows anything about MMA brings him up as one of the s. They may not like his style but its undeniable.

If someone says he sucked I basically take everything else they say MMA related with a grain of salt
 
They might have had more exciting fights, but based on ppv numbers, they definitely didn't overshadow him
 
scorpiorising said:
I dont think GSP was over shadowed by anyone.

Anyone who knows anything about MMA brings him up as one of the s. They may not like his style but its undeniable.

If someone says he sucked I basically take everything else they say MMA related with a grain of salt
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These threads always suck lol. But it's like a train wreck you just cannot not look.
GSP haters say one thing
GSP fans counter it

Than the haters move the goal posts and on and on it goes
 
ryan3434 said:
These threads always suck lol. But it's like a train wreck you just cannot not look.
GSP haters say one thing
GSP fans counter it

Than the haters move the goal posts and on and on it goes
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I think half the time they're just trolling or something.

Anderson JJ GSP were all top of the food chain for a long time.

They got old and JJ went off (or on) the rails.
 
To me it feels like people in North America care way more about numbers in sports than people outside of North America do. They see things like GSP won x amount of rounds or some formula that says his opponents were better than Anderson's or Jones' opponents and they put a lot of value into that.

I feel like people in Europe are more likely to see a front kick to Vitor's face and some other sick KO's and think "this is some GOAT shit".

The roids is just an excuse by a small group of haters to try and discredit other GOAT candidates. Which is pretty sad actually because all GOAT candidates are legends in their own right. No need to shit on the "competition".
 
Dbreiden83080 said:
And how do you support this argument other than NOT being a GSP fan? The Cash Register certainly disagrees as GSP was, and still would be today a bigger star than both. And Silva's legacy has taken a hit because of hanging so damn long more than steroids. That is one thing GSP has over other GOAT candidates. We did NOT see GSP hang around for years on end, taking 1 bad beating after another..
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Yea he didnt need to hang around to get beat since he was getting KOed in his prime instead.
 
Gsp was not overshadowed by Anderson Silva or Jon Jones. Yeah, these guys had more impressive finishes while Gsp was racking up decisions but in terms of ppvs and fame no fucking way they were more famous or made better numbers than GSP.

Now, that said. Anderson and Jones are both cheaters who looked like shit once usada arrived. And I was a huge Anderson fan.
 
Claude said:
Do you think the main reason most people who consider GSP the UFC GOAT is that Anderson and Jones roided?

GSP's title reign was from 2007 to 2013, and yet he was overshadowed almost every year by Anderson Silva and later by Jon Jones. GSP was only clearly the best UFC fighter in 2009. That's only 1 year out of 6 years.

Kinda reminds me of DC being the LHW champion. Everybody knew he wasn't the best fighter, but since Jones failed his drug test, he got the LHW belt. The way I see it, people went like: "OK, Anderson and Jones were clearly the best, but they got busted. Lets see who's further down the list".
"Oh it's GSP".

Such reasoning seems a bit weird since GSP only had 1 fight under USADA, in which he didn't exactly look like a world beater. History has proven that roiders can test clean for at least 1 fight. Both Anderson and Jones have tested clean under USADA before, so 1 fight hardly proves anything.

Furthermore, being fair and honest seems like a weird argument to favor GSP, since he has a history of greasing with vaseline, which, just like steroids, could have been a factor to win fights. And despite being very vocal about fighters getting drug tested, he was acting very shady when WADA was about test him for his fight vs. Hendricks; asking all kinds of weird questions, like whether they would test him for HGH and other banned substances. Something which even the NSAC director found odd.

Roids or not, I can't think of another sport where a GOAT wasn't clearly the most dominant of his era, and was instead overshadowed by others. In fact, GOAT's often overshadow proven steroid users, which makes them even greater.

Is GSP the consolation UFC GOAT?
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GSP was a bigger draw than Silva or Jones. Silva couldn't draw a dime until Chael came along. Jones was a pretty good draw but never as consistent as GSP. As far as in cage accomplishments both Silva and Jones failed drug tests. GSP never did so up to this point in the history of the UFC he's had the best career.
 
ShreddinMMA said:
That statement helps GSP if anything.

GSP has 3 WW title wins post ACL tear. And in those fights, GSP didn't look nearly as physically capable than previous.

And then he won the MW belt after a second ACL tear on his other leg, against a fighter who beat Silva less than 2 years earlier.

Silva had no comparable injuries during his title reign that he needed to come back from. Since coming back from his leg injury, he is 1-6-1.
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Credit to him. ALC tears are no joke.

Most great fighters can keep winning being past prime though. I think Anderson's wins in 2009 and onwards were all being past prime.
 
krelianx said:
Anderson was in his prime when he got beat by Takase and Ryo Chonan, for that matter.

If your criterion for being "in your prime" is age then Silva was in his prime then. GSP changed a great deal in the way he fought after the Serra loss, so if you're going by skill, then no, GSP did not lose in his prime against Serra.
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Both Anderson and GSP lost in their primes.

GSP simply fought safer after Serra. That's why he became a decision machine.
 
Post 2 Decision said:
It's always the same shit with these threads, and it's always the same people sucking the cocks of their favourite GOAT

Just a pointless discussion, no use arguing over it

There is a stickied thread anyway
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po_thead said:
See the goat thread
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ch1584 said:
There’s a thread with thousands of votes stickied here. Thousands of votes.
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I'm not asking who's the GOAT.

I'm asking whether GSP is considered the UFC GOAT because of what others did outside the cage and not because of his own merits.

It's different.
 
Hungry Joe said:
GSP is the GOAT because the peds make a differnce.
Jones Silva and GSP all ruled their division and consitantly beat all the top contenders.
I would say without peds Jones is top because he only "lost" to Hammil. GSP next because he avenged his only losses.
Silva next due to some losses but still one of the greatest.
Finishes or excitment mean nothing. There are lots of guys more exciting than Jones and Silva if we wanted to discuss most exciting fighter.
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I think greasing makes a difference too, specially when you fight grapplers.

And I'm not sure GSP didn't use PEDs. He didn't fail, but hardly anybody failed back then. And he only had 1 fight under USADA.

Not even Jones failed his first USADA fight.
 
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