ABC deceives Americans on Islamic hadith pertaining to 72 virigins.

[Islam Imamate]

It's a question for scholars and it seems to depend on which language the translation came from. You'd have to evaluate the arguments made by the best scholars, and it seems like the virgins beat out the raisins to me, but idk.

But when this first came to my attention, it wasn't at all used in the form of an apology for Islam, but used to mock people- because it's really funny that a person would expect virgins and get raisins and wine. It seems like a strange target for this outrage.

And I'd recommend purging your life of David Wood.

The idea that raisins was mistranslated as virgins comes from Christoph Luxenberg's book The Syro-Aramaic Reading of the Koran in which he argues that the Koran is not written in Arabic but in an Arabic-Syriac hybird. Most academics(including the one in my sig) in the relevant fields rejects this thesis but @MicroBrew mentions that it was Irshad Manji who mentioned this on ABC and that doesn't surprise me.

A lot of Western media look for Muslims like her, maverick Muslims who tell Westerners what they want to hear but who usually provide minority opinions that fall outside the orthodoxy of the religion. In this case Manji might've used the interpretation by Luxenberg, one that isn't accepted by academics and contradicts the Islamic canon, because she finds it a more affable one that would sound nice to her audience(in this case ABC). 72 virgins makes the religion sound a bit crass but raisins makes it sound like more like Quakerism. I haven't seen this clip but I don't think she would be intentionally dishonest as much as she's trying to advance her own so called reformist interpretation of the faith.

 

[Fawlty]

The idea that raisins was mistranslated as virgins comes from Christoph Luxenberg's book The Syro-Aramaic Read of the Koran in which he argues that the Koran is not written in Arabic but in an Arabic-Syriac hybird. Most academics(including the one in my sig) in the relevant fields rejects this thesis but @MicroBrew mentions that it was Irshad Manji who mentioned this on ABC and that doesn't surprise me.

A lot of Western media look for Muslims like her, maverick Muslims who tell Westerners what they want to hear but who usually provide minority opinions that fall outside the orthodoxy of the religion. In this case Manji might've used the interpretation by Luxenberg, one that isn't accepted by academics and contradicts the Islamic canon, because she finds it a more affable one that would sound nice to her audience(in this case ABC). 72 virgins makes the religion sound a bit crass but raisins makes it sound like more like Quakerism. I haven't seen this clip but I don't think she would be intentionally dishonest as much as she's trying to advance her own so called reformist interpretation of the faith.

Of course, people are immediately suspicious of any attempt to reform, because it can be difficult to tell the difference between the sneaky ones and the sincere ones. I don't know which category applies here, but she doesn't seem like a problem, shrug.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Of course, people are immediately suspicious of any attempt to reform, because it can be difficult to tell the difference between the sneaky ones and the sincere ones. I don't know which category applies here, but she doesn't seem like a problem, shrug.

I think Manji is sincere but at the same time I highly doubt any of her ideas will gain serious traction within the Muslim world.

 

[dragonsfly]

You know what is funny. I honestly believe that @MicroBrew believes Islam is the truth because if he o she didn't believe then he or she wouldn't have been so obsessed with the theology part of Islam and what they believe unless he or she 100% believes in this to the point it makes him/her insecure about own belief. The same goes to @Son of Jamin

 

[MicroBrew]

You know what is funny. I honestly believe that @MicroBrew believes Islam is the truth because if he o she didn't believe then he or she wouldn't have been so obsessed with the theology part of Islam and what they believe unless he or she 100% believes in this to the point it makes him/her insecure about own belief. The same goes to @Son of Jamin

I am a non-theist.
All religions are man-made.

You are deluding yourself if you think I entertain the notion that any religion is the truth.

 

[MicroBrew]

I think Manji is sincere but at the same time I highly doubt any of her ideas will gain serious traction within the Muslim world.

How can an adult, especially a person smart enough to be an academic in a well knnown University , sincerely believe it is raisans? 72 Raisans sounds like an amateur joke .

 

[helltoupee]

I just think they're scared of portraying a Muslim as a terrorist or they look """racist""" just like how if you google image search "burglar" all the stock photos are white guys because if you portray a black person as a burglar you're a racist

So you end up with something like

LOL. Do you even understand what you are posting?

Tell me which numbers by race on the following FBI statistical table is more for burglary:

Now reconcile the above, with this statement of yours:

Just like how if you google image search "burglar" all the stock photos are white guys because if you portray a black person as a burglar you're a racist

and your graphic:

PS. I know you won't respond, so I'm happy to expose your idiocy for others to witness.

 

[dragonsfly]

I am a non-theist.
All religions are man-made.

You are deluding yourself if you think I entertain the notion that any religion is the truth.

Well if you don't believe then why are you obsessed with it. I rarely see you talk about anything else. What gives? care to elaborate because I haven't seen so much obsession from someone who don't believe. Why don't you just come out of the closet and tell us why it makes you insecure

 

[Last Samurai]

I bet they show up and find nothing but 72 raisins


and the devil says "oops typo"

 

[MicroBrew]

Well if you don't believe then why are you obsessed with it. I rarely see you talk about anything else. What gives? care to elaborate because I haven't seen so much obsession from someone who don't believe. Why don't you just come out of the closet and tell us why it makes you insecure

I didn't use to talk about Islam soo much, it's only been in the past year or 2.

Islam is a totalitarian ideology cloaked in the guise of religion, and our duplictious elites are deceiving the public ; that is a dam good reason to talk about it a lot.

 

[MicroBrew]

I bet they show up and find nothing but 72 raisins


and the devil says "oops typo"

Allah is such a cheapskate.
He should have promised 72 cashews or 72 roasted salted almonds .

 

[dragonsfly]

I didn't use to talk about Islam soo much, it's only been in the past year or 2.

Islam is a totalitarian ideology cloaked in the guise of religion, and our duplictious elites are deceiving the public ; that is a dam good reason to talk about it a lot.

That dosen't warrant an obsession to the point of going into the theology part. You believe partialy in this but dislike other parts about it but you don't know it and that is why it infuriates you to the point it became an obsession.

I also believe you rejected despite your heart telling you something else for whatever reason it may be. Perhaps you disliked some parts. But I have no doubt you believe in this while you completely rejected and this makes you insecure and leads you to this insecure state and infuriates you..

Normal people don't waste a second on what they don't believe. Time is precious

 

[Islam Imamate]

How can an adult, especially a person smart enough to be an academic in a well knnown University , sincerely believe it is raisans? 72 Raisans sounds like an amateur joke .

Maybe because that's what she wants to believe. People are always more open to ideas when its what they want to hear.

 

[Islam Imamate]

You know what is funny. I honestly believe that @MicroBrew believes Islam is the truth because if he o she didn't believe then he or she wouldn't have been so obsessed with the theology part of Islam and what they believe unless he or she 100% believes in this to the point it makes him/her insecure about own belief. The same goes to @Son of Jamin

That...doesn't really make any sense but okay.

 

[WiolentOne]

I haven't seen this clip but I don't think she would be intentionally dishonest as much as she's trying to advance her own so called reformist interpretation of the faith.

That's exactly what she was doing.

 

[ReAnimator Reagan]

From some years back. Just another example of the MSM blatantly lying/deceiving the public, to defend Islam.

This is the Hadith on Allah promising 72 virgins to Martyrs. ABC 20-20 has on Irshad Manji, who states that "Houris" described in the Hadiths is not 72 virgins but 72 raisans. Irshad Manji is Director of the Moral Project at New York University.

Why would god think raisans are soo important as to promise it to martyrs.
So the US could have stopped a lot of Jihadi attacks if they had promised 72 raisans to would be Jihadis.
-

Wikipedia clearly states that Houris :
are fair ,
have large eyes,
are virgins, are beautiful
and will be reclining on thrones.

Since when do raisans have large beautiful eyes , fair of complexion and able to recline on a throne.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Houri

-
@Zankou

The Hadiths where Allah promises 72 Houris (women)

It was mentioned by Daraj Ibn Abi Hatim, that Abu al-Haytham 'Adullah Ibn Wahb narrated from Abu Sa'id al-Khudhri, who heard Muhammad saying, 'The smallest reward for the people of Heaven is an abode where there are eighty thousand servants and seventy-two houri, over which stands a dome decorated with pearls, aquamarine, and ruby, as wide as the distance from al-Jabiyyah to San'a.[60]

That the Messenger of Allah said: "There are six things with Allah for the martyr. He is forgiven with the first flow of blood (he suffers), he is shown his place in Paradise, he is protected from punishment in the grave, secured from the greatest terror, the crown of dignity is placed upon his head—and its gems are better than the world and what is in it—he is married to seventy two wives among the Hur the `Iyn ["wide-eyed ones", اثْنَتَيْنِ وَسَبْعِينَ زَوْجَةً مِنَ الْحُورِ الْعِينِ] of Paradise, and he may intercede for seventy of his close relatives."[62]

------

David Wood slays shameless lying ABC. ' Course ABC could just be ignorant and Irshad Manji could be fooling ABC...but the program clearly shows ABC as a extremly sympathetic 'interviewer' . And doesn't ABC do their own research? Why did ABC even decide to have Irshad on and talk about the 72 virgins.



-------

There is another point here: The Hadiths are clearly racist because they state the Houris are Fair and have large dark eyes. So this means dark skined women and East Asians/Amerindians are not worthy enough for Allah . And blue eyed,green eyed, hazel eyed women are also not worthy enough.

Wow, posting videos from Apologetics 17? I thought I was the only one.

Man, I feel like I disagreed with you a lot before, but maybe you are changing or maybe I was just wrong, but you are killing it now...

 

[Pwent]

LOL. Do you even understand what you are posting?

Tell me which numbers by race on the following FBI statistical table is more for burglary:

Now reconcile the above, with this statement of yours:



and your graphic:

PS. I know you won't respond, so I'm happy to expose your idiocy for others to witness.

okay so black people commit more than 25% of the burglaries (despite being roughly 13% of the population)

but are 0% of stock photos of "burglars"

thank you for proving my point while trying to "expose me"... again

this is why i dont bother responding to you, youre too dumb to realize how dumb you are

 

[The ScorpioN]

That dosen't warrant an obsession to the point of going into the theology part. You believe partialy in this but dislike other parts about it but you don't know it and that is why it infuriates you to the point it became an obsession.

I also believe you rejected despite your heart telling you something else for whatever reason it may be. Perhaps you disliked some parts. But I have no doubt you believe in this while you completely rejected and this makes you insecure and leads you to this insecure state and infuriates you..

Normal people don't waste a second on what they don't believe. Time is precious

Can't tell if trolling or retarded. Leaning towards the latter.

 

[Fugazy]

Came in to see the California raisins, did not leave disappointed.

 

[original doom]

Australian tv is obsessed muslims. Im starting to think sbs is owned by a muslim.

Its not even news anywhere its all about islam.