Elections 2020 Democratic Primary Thread v5: Primary Season Begins

[PolishHeadlock2]

Bloomy is done for. Money can't buy the charisma factor and even though Mr.Sleepy is showing signs of his age, he still has that dog faced pony factor that resonates with people, especially America. I still think the primary is him vs Bernie ultimately.

Biden also does very well in Townhalls

And yeah I think we are back to the original 2 horse race

 

[Sketch]

Biden also does very well in Townhalls

And yeah I think we are back to the original 2 horse race

Same. Pete's become a robot. The Elizabeth one is going in on the dead horse Bloomy too much and the other contestants are irrelevant at this point.

 

[Sano]

She sounds borderline retarded.

 

[Deadwing88]

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Biden also does very well in Townhalls

And yeah I think we are back to the original 2 horse race

3 horse - with "contested convention" being the front runner.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

So a statistical tie across the board

 

[PolishHeadlock2]

3 horse - with "contested convention" being the front runner.

I highly doubt we'll see a compromise candidate under the current political climate. Even if contested it will likely be either Bernie or Biden

 

[Sano]

MSNBC Benches Contributor Who Smeared Bernie Sanders Staffers
"During an interview last week on SiriusXM’s The Karen Hunter Show, Johnson claimed “racist white liberals” support Sanders and that the senator has done “nothing for intersectionality.”

The MSNBC contributor then took aim at the women of color who work for Sanders. “I don’t care how many people from the island of misfit black girls you throw out there to defend you,” Johnson exclaimed."



Johnson’s absence has been noticeable, as he has become a staple of MSNBC’s Democratic primary analysis roster. Prior to his benching, he made nearly 40 appearances on the network in 2020 alone. "
https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc...ers-staffers-are-island-of-misfit-black-girls

Professional wrong person has been benched.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

I highly doubt we'll see a compromise candidate under the current political climate. Even if contested it will likely be either Bernie or Biden

No I'm saying contested convention is the 3rd horse. It's still a 2 candidate race but the parameters heading into it are pretty wonky

 

[Trotsky]

@kpt018 @Fawlty

What say you? Given that you both (and most democratic voters) are not opposed to his policies and polls have consistently showed that he's one of the stronger general candidates, what does that say about the Party?

Democratic Leaders Willing to Risk Party Damage to Stop Bernie Sanders
Interviews with dozens of Democratic Party officials, including 93 superdelegates, found overwhelming opposition to handing Mr. Sanders the nomination if he fell short of a majority of delegates.

WASHINGTON — House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senator Chuck Schumer, the minority leader, hear constant warnings from allies about congressional losses in November if the party nominates Bernie Sanders for president. Democratic House members share their Sanders fears on text-messaging chains. Bill Clinton, in calls with old friends, vents about the party getting wiped out in the general election.

And officials in the national and state parties are increasingly anxious about splintered primaries on Super Tuesday and beyond, where the liberal Mr. Sanders edges out moderate candidates who collectively win more votes.

Dozens of interviews with Democratic establishment leaders this week show that they are not just worried about Mr. Sanders’s candidacy, but are also willing to risk intraparty damage to stop his nomination at the national convention in July if they get the chance. Since Mr. Sanders’s victory in Nevada’s caucuses on Saturday, The Times has interviewed 93 party officials — all of them superdelegates, who could have a say on the nominee at the convention — and found overwhelming opposition to handing the Vermont senator the nomination if he arrived with the most delegates but fell short of a majority.

Such a situation may result in a brokered convention, a messy political battle the likes of which Democrats have not seen since 1952, when the nominee was Adlai Stevenson.

“We’re way, way, way past the day where party leaders can determine an outcome here, but I think there’s a vibrant conversation about whether there is anything that can be done,” said Jim Himes, a Connecticut congressman and superdelegate, who believed the nominee should have a majority of delegates.

From California to the Carolinas, and North Dakota to Ohio, the party leaders say they worry that Mr. Sanders, a democratic socialist with passionate but limited support so far, will lose to President Trump, and drag down moderate House and Senate candidates in swing states with his left-wing agenda of “Medicare for all” and free four-year public college.

Mr. Sanders and his advisers insist that the opposite is true — that his ideas will generate huge excitement among young and working-class voters, and lead to record turnout. Such hopes have yet to be borne out in nominating contests so far.

Jay Jacobs, the New York State Democratic Party chairman and a superdelegate, echoing many others interviewed, said that superdelegates should choose a nominee they believed had the best chance of defeating Mr. Trump if no candidate wins a majority of delegates during the primaries. Mr. Sanders argued that he should become the nominee at the convention with a plurality of delegates, to reflect the will of voters, and that denying him the nomination would enrage his supporters and split the party for years to come.

“Bernie wants to redefine the rules and just say he just needs a plurality,” Mr. Jacobs said. “I don’t think we buy that. I don’t think the mainstream of the Democratic Party buys that. If he doesn’t have a majority, it stands to reason that he may not become the nominee.”

This article is based on interviews with the 93 superdelegates, out of 771 total, as well as party strategists and aides to senior Democrats about the thinking of party leaders. A vast majority of those superdelegates — whose ranks include federal elected officials, former presidents and vice presidents and D.N.C. members — predicted that no candidate would clinch the nomination during the primaries, and that there would be a brokered convention fight in July to choose a nominee.

In a reflection of the establishment’s wariness about Mr. Sanders, only nine of the 93 superdelegates interviewed said that Mr. Sanders should become the nominee purely on the basis of arriving at the convention with a plurality, if he was short of a majority.

“I’ve had 60 years experience with Democratic delegates — I don’t think they will do anything like that,” said former Vice President Walter Mondale, who is a superdelegate. “They will each do what they want to do, and somehow they will work it out. God knows how.”

As for his own vote, Mr. Mondale, the 1984 Democratic presidential nominee, said, “I vote for the person I think should be president.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/27/...6KrNrjbZiCVGhXXNZAFS1HM8Qpp9ik9pEMXMGlpxzQ3WQ

 

[Anung Un Rama]

MSNBC Benches Contributor Who Smeared Bernie Sanders Staffers
"During an interview last week on SiriusXM’s The Karen Hunter Show, Johnson claimed “racist white liberals” support Sanders and that the senator has done “nothing for intersectionality.”

The MSNBC contributor then took aim at the women of color who work for Sanders. “I don’t care how many people from the island of misfit black girls you throw out there to defend you,” Johnson exclaimed."



Johnson’s absence has been noticeable, as he has become a staple of MSNBC’s Democratic primary analysis roster. Prior to his benching, he made nearly 40 appearances on the network in 2020 alone. "
https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc...ers-staffers-are-island-of-misfit-black-girls

Professional wrong person has been benched.

Lol, Chuck Todd and Chris Mathews compare Sanders and his supporters to Nazis on live television, but the black guy gets benched for his radio show tirade. I guess they needed to make an example of somebody. Not defending the guy he was egregiously wrong, but we all see through this right?

 

[Fawlty]

@kpt018 @Fawlty

What say you? Given that you both (and most democratic voters) are not opposed to his policies and polls have consistently showed that he's one of the stronger general candidates, what does that say about the Party?

Democratic Leaders Willing to Risk Party Damage to Stop Bernie Sanders
Interviews with dozens of Democratic Party officials, including 93 superdelegates, found overwhelming opposition to handing Mr. Sanders the nomination if he fell short of a majority of delegates.

WASHINGTON — House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senator Chuck Schumer, the minority leader, hear constant warnings from allies about congressional losses in November if the party nominates Bernie Sanders for president. Democratic House members share their Sanders fears on text-messaging chains. Bill Clinton, in calls with old friends, vents about the party getting wiped out in the general election.

And officials in the national and state parties are increasingly anxious about splintered primaries on Super Tuesday and beyond, where the liberal Mr. Sanders edges out moderate candidates who collectively win more votes.

Dozens of interviews with Democratic establishment leaders this week show that they are not just worried about Mr. Sanders’s candidacy, but are also willing to risk intraparty damage to stop his nomination at the national convention in July if they get the chance. Since Mr. Sanders’s victory in Nevada’s caucuses on Saturday, The Times has interviewed 93 party officials — all of them superdelegates, who could have a say on the nominee at the convention — and found overwhelming opposition to handing the Vermont senator the nomination if he arrived with the most delegates but fell short of a majority.

Such a situation may result in a brokered convention, a messy political battle the likes of which Democrats have not seen since 1952, when the nominee was Adlai Stevenson.

“We’re way, way, way past the day where party leaders can determine an outcome here, but I think there’s a vibrant conversation about whether there is anything that can be done,” said Jim Himes, a Connecticut congressman and superdelegate, who believed the nominee should have a majority of delegates.

From California to the Carolinas, and North Dakota to Ohio, the party leaders say they worry that Mr. Sanders, a democratic socialist with passionate but limited support so far, will lose to President Trump, and drag down moderate House and Senate candidates in swing states with his left-wing agenda of “Medicare for all” and free four-year public college.

Mr. Sanders and his advisers insist that the opposite is true — that his ideas will generate huge excitement among young and working-class voters, and lead to record turnout. Such hopes have yet to be borne out in nominating contests so far.

Jay Jacobs, the New York State Democratic Party chairman and a superdelegate, echoing many others interviewed, said that superdelegates should choose a nominee they believed had the best chance of defeating Mr. Trump if no candidate wins a majority of delegates during the primaries. Mr. Sanders argued that he should become the nominee at the convention with a plurality of delegates, to reflect the will of voters, and that denying him the nomination would enrage his supporters and split the party for years to come.

“Bernie wants to redefine the rules and just say he just needs a plurality,” Mr. Jacobs said. “I don’t think we buy that. I don’t think the mainstream of the Democratic Party buys that. If he doesn’t have a majority, it stands to reason that he may not become the nominee.”

This article is based on interviews with the 93 superdelegates, out of 771 total, as well as party strategists and aides to senior Democrats about the thinking of party leaders. A vast majority of those superdelegates — whose ranks include federal elected officials, former presidents and vice presidents and D.N.C. members — predicted that no candidate would clinch the nomination during the primaries, and that there would be a brokered convention fight in July to choose a nominee.

In a reflection of the establishment’s wariness about Mr. Sanders, only nine of the 93 superdelegates interviewed said that Mr. Sanders should become the nominee purely on the basis of arriving at the convention with a plurality, if he was short of a majority.

“I’ve had 60 years experience with Democratic delegates — I don’t think they will do anything like that,” said former Vice President Walter Mondale, who is a superdelegate. “They will each do what they want to do, and somehow they will work it out. God knows how.”

As for his own vote, Mr. Mondale, the 1984 Democratic presidential nominee, said, “I vote for the person I think should be president.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/27/...6KrNrjbZiCVGhXXNZAFS1HM8Qpp9ik9pEMXMGlpxzQ3WQ

I say they're legitimately worried about the toxicity of socialism, market jitters, senate obstruction until 2024, and the unbelievable propaganda hammering of Sanders that will take place. Instead of hedging by fighting back against the socialism claims, they're gambling on somebody stopping Bernie, because they don't yet see that it's too late to stop Sanders. It's wasted energy and they need to correct after Super Tuesday, when the picture becomes clearer, in order to minimize the harm they might do. Right now they're not hurting the party, but that cushion ends in about a week.

As for me, I'm in bizarro world, where you guys attack me for calling him socialist (even though you're all socialists to a pretty strong degree and Sanders definitely is) when I bring up said legitimate worry, and that it's an untested liability in modern times that is very risky. I'm not risk-averse right now, so it's an acceptable risk to me, but it's quite real.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

@kpt018 @Fawlty

What say you? Given that you both (and most democratic voters) are not opposed to his policies and polls have consistently showed that he's one of the stronger general candidates, what does that say about the Party?

Democratic Leaders Willing to Risk Party Damage to Stop Bernie Sanders
Interviews with dozens of Democratic Party officials, including 93 superdelegates, found overwhelming opposition to handing Mr. Sanders the nomination if he fell short of a majority of delegates.

WASHINGTON — House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Senator Chuck Schumer, the minority leader, hear constant warnings from allies about congressional losses in November if the party nominates Bernie Sanders for president. Democratic House members share their Sanders fears on text-messaging chains. Bill Clinton, in calls with old friends, vents about the party getting wiped out in the general election.

And officials in the national and state parties are increasingly anxious about splintered primaries on Super Tuesday and beyond, where the liberal Mr. Sanders edges out moderate candidates who collectively win more votes.

Dozens of interviews with Democratic establishment leaders this week show that they are not just worried about Mr. Sanders’s candidacy, but are also willing to risk intraparty damage to stop his nomination at the national convention in July if they get the chance. Since Mr. Sanders’s victory in Nevada’s caucuses on Saturday, The Times has interviewed 93 party officials — all of them superdelegates, who could have a say on the nominee at the convention — and found overwhelming opposition to handing the Vermont senator the nomination if he arrived with the most delegates but fell short of a majority.

Such a situation may result in a brokered convention, a messy political battle the likes of which Democrats have not seen since 1952, when the nominee was Adlai Stevenson.

“We’re way, way, way past the day where party leaders can determine an outcome here, but I think there’s a vibrant conversation about whether there is anything that can be done,” said Jim Himes, a Connecticut congressman and superdelegate, who believed the nominee should have a majority of delegates.

From California to the Carolinas, and North Dakota to Ohio, the party leaders say they worry that Mr. Sanders, a democratic socialist with passionate but limited support so far, will lose to President Trump, and drag down moderate House and Senate candidates in swing states with his left-wing agenda of “Medicare for all” and free four-year public college.

Mr. Sanders and his advisers insist that the opposite is true — that his ideas will generate huge excitement among young and working-class voters, and lead to record turnout. Such hopes have yet to be borne out in nominating contests so far.

Jay Jacobs, the New York State Democratic Party chairman and a superdelegate, echoing many others interviewed, said that superdelegates should choose a nominee they believed had the best chance of defeating Mr. Trump if no candidate wins a majority of delegates during the primaries. Mr. Sanders argued that he should become the nominee at the convention with a plurality of delegates, to reflect the will of voters, and that denying him the nomination would enrage his supporters and split the party for years to come.

“Bernie wants to redefine the rules and just say he just needs a plurality,” Mr. Jacobs said. “I don’t think we buy that. I don’t think the mainstream of the Democratic Party buys that. If he doesn’t have a majority, it stands to reason that he may not become the nominee.”

This article is based on interviews with the 93 superdelegates, out of 771 total, as well as party strategists and aides to senior Democrats about the thinking of party leaders. A vast majority of those superdelegates — whose ranks include federal elected officials, former presidents and vice presidents and D.N.C. members — predicted that no candidate would clinch the nomination during the primaries, and that there would be a brokered convention fight in July to choose a nominee.

In a reflection of the establishment’s wariness about Mr. Sanders, only nine of the 93 superdelegates interviewed said that Mr. Sanders should become the nominee purely on the basis of arriving at the convention with a plurality, if he was short of a majority.

“I’ve had 60 years experience with Democratic delegates — I don’t think they will do anything like that,” said former Vice President Walter Mondale, who is a superdelegate. “They will each do what they want to do, and somehow they will work it out. God knows how.”

As for his own vote, Mr. Mondale, the 1984 Democratic presidential nominee, said, “I vote for the person I think should be president.”

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/27/...6KrNrjbZiCVGhXXNZAFS1HM8Qpp9ik9pEMXMGlpxzQ3WQ

I think its fake fear mongering. This won’t affect the down ticket, it will affect their corporate masters donations.
And seeing as the Democrats suck at resining money the last 12 years (and Sanders and AOC have proven to to be monster fund raisers) even that is a shaky at best. What’s is true is that Bernie Bros are meanies, and that is what we should be talking about until Tom Perez says differently.

 

[Deleted member 555403]

I have a feeling this virus is going to make the fear mongering about socialism fall a lot flatter

Also this campaign is going to be unique when public gatherings start to be viewed with hesitation let alone outright getting canceled. The online factor would be ramped up and Bernie's core support has been training for this since AOL chatrooms. Good luck beating that

 

[Trotsky]

I say they're legitimately worried about the toxicity of socialism, market jitters, senate obstruction until 2024, and the unbelievable propaganda hammering of Sanders that will take place. Instead of hedging by fighting back against the socialism claims, they're gambling on somebody stopping Bernie, because they don't yet see that it's too late to stop Sanders. It's wasted energy and they need to correct after Super Tuesday, when the picture becomes clearer, in order to minimize the harm they might do. Right now they're not hurting the party, but that cushion ends in about a week.

As for me, I'm in bizarro world, where you guys attack me for calling him socialist (even though you're all socialists to a pretty strong degree and Sanders definitely is) when I bring up said legitimate worry, and that it's an untested liability in modern times that is very risky. I'm not risk-averse right now, so it's an acceptable risk to me, but it's quite real.

I have no problem with you calling Sanders a socialist. And he is one.

And the "not a socialist, a social democrat" stuff, whether from Sanders supporters or Paul Krugman, is not only a waste of breath - it's outright incorrect. Social democrats are socialists. If a social democrat disavows the policy remnants of the socialist movement - a strong labor movement, a cooperative approach to owning and managing the economy, etc. - in their politics in favor of pure technocratic reformism, then they're not really social democrats. They're compassionate capitalists, and their policies of compassion can be reversed by capital even more quickly than those of the social democrats.

I gathered that the crux of the criticism by other posters was the recklessness of terminology: knowing that "socialist" carries the connotation of command economy in the United States, and feeling that you should acknowledge that sort of dual-meaning. I personally think that sooner or later that nonsense needs to be bulldozed, so I don't really care.

 

[Joe]

Looks like a blowout in south Carolina

 

[Deadwing88]

 

[Deleted member 555403]

Virus is also going to make Bernie's case for him on healthcare

It's going to expose tons of fault lines within our system

 

[Trotsky]

Looks like a blowout in south Carolina

Damn.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

smh @ S.C.