2013-14 NBA Discussion Thread, v9: Final Four, by: King of Betas

[wlu29]

Draft lottery in 4 days. Going to determine the landscape of the NBA playoffs completely in 3-4 years. Really hope Wiggins or Parker goes to the 76ers. East needs a beast mode team other than the Heat.

Winter is coming
We the north
Northern uprising
RAPTORS

 

[RetiredWisFighter]

Draft lottery in 4 days. Going to determine the landscape of the NBA playoffs completely in 3-4 years. Really hope Wiggins or Parker goes to the 76ers. East needs a beast mode team other than the Heat.

Bucks with Wiggins would be interesting at the very least. Him, Greek and Sanders

 

[ChillyPalmer]

 

[jrams]

Wiggins LOOMS....

Just for comparison

Perry Jones (41.5" vertical)

Jeremy Evans (43" vertical)

Wiggy looks like he has a couple inches on them

 

[monster zero]

Bucks with Wiggins would be interesting at the very least. Him, Greek and Sanders

Could be pretty athletic and explosive, don't know how the offense would run.

I want him to land in Philly because with MCW's defense at the guard spot, Noel at the C, and Wiggins are the SF you have a team that will eventually be able to guard almost all positions pretty well.

MCW is a pretty good pg and Wiggins seems to like to play off the ball a little, I think with the right coach they could make a pretty good combo. I doubt the NBA will give the Bucks a high pick in this draft considering it's so stacked. Would hate to see Wiggins languish in Milwalk with their horrible culture and disfunctional team. </3

 

[Madmick]

Spoiler

Just for comparison

Perry Jones (41.5" vertical)

Jeremy Evans (43" vertical)

Wiggy looks like he has a couple inches on them

From the angle of the camera that's incredibly difficult to tell. The camera is pointed slightly down with Wiggins, but his feet appear to be aligned with the black line on the wall. Meanwhile, Evans, who also has a downward angle (though it's closer), appears an inch or two above the black line. Meanwhile, Jones' camera shot appears to be level, and he's level with the black line. The optics will twist your perception up.

It definitely looks like Wiggy is somewhere in the 39"-45" area. For a 6'8" kid...that's pretty freakish. He not quite a young and healthy Antonio McDyess, but damn close.

 

[The Day Walker**]

lol allen iverson

 

[The Day Walker**]

From the angle of the camera that's incredibly difficult to tell. The camera is pointed slightly down with Wiggins, but his feet appear to be aligned with the black line on the wall. Meanwhile, Evans, who also has a downward angle (though it's closer), appears an inch or two above the black line. Meanwhile, Jones' camera shot appears to be level, and he's level with the black line. The optics will twist your perception up.

It definitely looks like Wiggy is somewhere in the 39"-45" area. For a 6'8" kid...that's pretty freakish. He not quite a young and healthy Antonio McDyess, but damn close.

What would you say the % is of how much these guys have applied flexibility, plyometric and strength training in relation to genetics? In other words what would you say is the % split here with gym work to genetics? 80% genetics 20% hard work?

 

[Revolver]

I would say 90% to 10%. Wiggins probably hasn't seen the inside of gym until he got to Kansas.

 

[highkicknomore]

Ehh... CP3 actually had a pretty good playoff run, overall better than both DeCandre and Griffcan. DeCandre had games where he wasn't even there, almost Roy Hibbcan like.

CP3 derping game 5 is inexcusable for a star and team leader. Maybe they would have still lost the game but at least hold onto the ball.

This team will be screwed next season with Teh Racist suing NBA and not paying the $2.5 million fine. I hope he drags this lawsuit for a couple of years so the value will go down and lose a shitload of money. Based on his interviews it seems like all he cares is money so he'll probaly get a heart attack if he loses even 10% of the value.

 

[jrams]

From the angle of the camera that's incredibly difficult to tell. The camera is pointed slightly down with Wiggins, but his feet appear to be aligned with the black line on the wall. Meanwhile, Evans, who also has a downward angle (though it's closer), appears an inch or two above the black line. Meanwhile, Jones' camera shot appears to be level, and he's level with the black line. The optics will twist your perception up.

It definitely looks like Wiggy is somewhere in the 39"-45" area. For a 6'8" kid...that's pretty freakish. He not quite a young and healthy Antonio McDyess, but damn close.

Looking at the heels relative to the guy, it looks to me like Wiggy is a couple inches higher.

Doesn't really matter though as
1) Wiggy still gets way the hell up there just like PJ3 and Evans.
2) In game vertical matters than a max attempt. Apparently PJ3 seldom jumped his max during college and from watching Wiggy he didn't dominate vertically when he was driving/attacking the basket.
3) All the athleticism in the world doesn't matter if he doesn't have the skills.

 

[Uptown Swinger]

The New York Knicks are considering allowing Scottie Pippen to join the organization in some capacity. Maybe as a ball boy or if her proves to have basic math skills we may let him sell popcorn to our fans. No way we're letting him near the beer stand.

 

[metal]

The New York Knicks are considering allowing Scottie Pippen to join the organization in some capacity. Maybe as a ball boy or if her proves to have basic math skills we may let him sell popcorn to our fans. No way we're letting him near the beer stand.

Wasn't aware you are a part of the Knicks organization.

 

[jcc3508]

CP3 derping game 5 is inexcusable for a star and team leader. Maybe they would have still lost the game but at least hold onto the ball.

This team will be screwed next season with Teh Racist suing NBA and not paying the $2.5 million fine. I hope he drags this lawsuit for a couple of years so the value will go down and lose a shitload of money. Based on his interviews it seems like all he cares is money so he'll probaly get a heart attack if he loses even 10% of the value.

http://edition.cnn.com/2014/05/15/us/donald-sterling-nba/

Pretty interesting, the guy that is representing him seems to be willing to go the full battle as well. I see this being dragged for a long time

Will not be pretty.

 

[Uptown Swinger]

Wasn't aware you are a part of the Knicks organization.

I am.
I actually have a meeting with Uncle Phil today to discuss Pippen's SAT scores
and to see if we need to revise our Knicks City Dancers' body proportion/measurments standards.

 

[Madmick]

What would you say the % is of how much these guys have applied flexibility, plyometric and strength training in relation to genetics? In other words what would you say is the % split here with gym work to genetics? 80% genetics 20% hard work?

That's impossible to quantify, and it isn't linear. For example, let's say Wiggins is that dude who if he wasn't fat, but just moped around, could legitimately hit a 32" countermovement (don't underestimate how impressive that is). The nature of gains is that he could be a rather casual gymgoer with a solid program, and probably hit 36"-37" without too much time or grueling intensity. Hell, probably in 6 months. That's how quick those initial gains come.

Going from 37" to 42", though? That's insane. That last five inches requires literally several dozen times the effort to make than it does to make the first five. It gets to a point where these physical freaks at the top are separating themselves by a matter of inches, or even centimeters, but 4 centimeters up where they're at represents a greater number of standard deviations than 4" in the bracket 10" below.

You don't get a vertical like that at 6'8" without busting your ass. They aren't common by any measure of the word, but within the context of the global population, I'm sure there's a reservoir of tall guys who can jump 30"+ without lifting a finger. 40"? Extremely unlikely. Someone like that is probably the type of talent who hops onto a D1 track and field program and is medaling at the Olympics 3 years later when everyone else has been training the sport for like 10+ years.

Looking at the heels relative to the guy, it looks to me like Wiggy is a couple inches higher.

Doesn't really matter though as
1) Wiggy still gets way the hell up there just like PJ3 and Evans.
2) In game vertical matters than a max attempt. Apparently PJ3 seldom jumped his max during college and from watching Wiggy he didn't dominate vertically when he was driving/attacking the basket.
3) All the athleticism in the world doesn't matter if he doesn't have the skills.

Certainly. Agreed on points #1 and #3. Keep in mind, though, with #2, that even submaximal repetitions are a function of your 1RM. So a guy with a 40" vert can jump at 90% of his max and still hit 36". Meanwhile, a guy with a 36" vertical is screwed in that equation. Of course, power-endurance isn't necessarily equal, and factors into an athlete's ability to reproduce these efforts at a certain intensity over the course of a game.

 

[Revolver]

Exum has been shooting up draft charts even though he hasn't played a single game in a year. He's being packaged as a pg but no one actually knows who he is.

 

[The Day Walker**]

That's impossible to quantify, and it isn't linear. For example, let's say Wiggins is that dude who if he wasn't fat, but just moped around, could legitimately hit a 32" countermovement (don't underestimate how impressive that is). The nature of gains is that he could be a rather casual gymgoer with a solid program, and probably hit 36"-37" without too much time or grueling intensity. Hell, probably in 6 months. That's how quick those initial gains come.

Going from 37" to 42", though? That's insane. That last five inches requires literally several dozen times the effort to make than it does to make the first five. It gets to a point where these physical freaks at the top are separating themselves by a matter of inches, or even centimeters, but 4 centimeters up where they're at represents a greater number of standard deviations than 4" in the bracket 10" below.

You don't get a vertical like that at 6'8" without busting your ass. They aren't common by any measure of the word, but within the context of the global population, I'm sure there's a reservoir of tall guys who can jump 30"+ without lifting a finger. 40"? Extremely unlikely. Someone like that is probably the type of talent who hops onto a D1 track and field program and is medaling at the Olympics 3 years later when everyone else has been training the sport for like 10+ years.

Certainly. Agreed on points #1 and #3. Keep in mind, though, with #2, that even submaximal repetitions are a function of your 1RM. So a guy with a 40" vert can jump at 90% of his max and still hit 36". Meanwhile, a guy with a 36" vertical is screwed in that equation. Of course, power-endurance isn't necessarily equal, and factors into an athlete's ability to reproduce these efforts at a certain intensity over the course of a game.

Taking in what you're saying, with regards to talent + hard work, it is impossible to quantify. However we can probably all objectively decide that for instance, a regular joe in decent shape at age 18 vs a andrew wiggins type talent at age 18, put into the same training regimen, with the same allotted time, 6 months or a year, the gains from wiggins would probably dwarf that of regular joe due to genetics. However, there are other variables like, with as much bball as wiggins has played in his life, that also has played a roll in his vertical. Repetitive jumping motion just playing can also add in already inherent ability and also increase gains.

I guess what I am trying to say is that I am blown away by Wiggins vertical and other guys around his same realm, it's just stuff you don't see much in life with that size. To me it's gotta be a combination of environment nurturing already gifted individuals to max potential.

 

[monster zero]

Whatever team Wiggins goes to will automatically become my second team, as a Canadian, I feel I am entitled to atleast semi-cheer on this bandwagon.

Anyone want to do an av/sig bet that the Bucks won't get a top 3 pick this year despite 25% chance to the #1?

 

[Uptown Swinger]

I guess what I am trying to say is that I am blown away by Wiggins and other guys around his same realm, it's just stuff you don't see much in life with that size.

This is what women say about me. ^
LOL
Why don't you just wrap a ribbon around your head and jump out of a cake for him.
I'm just kidding but please stop drooling.