Why is Fedor Emelianenko considered the GOAT?

[mjfan23]

Jones and even GSP have a chance to dethrone him

 

[special_k]

Question: Did Fedor have more trouble with Light heavyweights and middleweights than Heavyweights?

Seems that way.

 

[StraightleftKO]

Fun fact: Most of Fedor's can fights happened on December 31st New Years Eve cards in outside organizations like Inoki Bom-Ba-Ye or Yarennoka. This stuff barely classifies as MMA. The fights on these cards were intentionally goofy for the spectacle.

This something a lot of Fedor haters don't realize.

 

[Crimson Fury]

Bravo.

Ogawa has beaten like one guy with a SINGLE win (Goodridge) in his career.

But damn, you say he beat Stefan Leko huh.

He had another fight at UFO - Legend that looked weird too IIRC. Or his opponent, Matt Ghaffari, was just that bad since he had no experience in MMA.

 

[Taric]

Question: Did Fedor have more trouble with Light heavyweights and middleweights than Heavyweights?

Even in the fights he won he had the most trouble against agile grapplers like Arona and Randleman.
Speed was always Fedor's major advantage at HW, makes sense he'd struggle more when that is mostly neutralized.

 

[norsuu]

choi and zulu has this record now, not 8 years ago...but you take the worst examples. Fedor was invencible from debut until 2010. Nobody thought he was going to be beaten by nobody......and he is a 180cm hw, not like 195 cm lhws i know...

 

[Stan]

Fedor fought guys that had awful records ..some more losses than wins...
ZULU 9 wins 8 losses,
JAIDEEP SINGH 2 wins 3 losses,
CHRIS HASEMAN 20 wins 17 losses,
NAOYA OGAWA 7 wins 2 losses,
MARTIN LAZAROV 0 wins 2 losses
LEVON LAGVILAVA 1 win 3 losses
HIROYA TAKADA 1 win 3 losses,
MIHAIL APOSTOLOV 0 wins 1 loss,
HONG MAN CHOI 4 wins 5 losses,
LEE HASDELL 9 wins 14 losses


I get his reign as champion was great, I get he DID defeat some legends....but what makes him superior compared to Silva or Jones? These are just random guys i looked at on his record, Im sure there are others....Others he beat were middleweight fighters.

OK you have a 1 sided view first of all Jones and Silva has to cut weight to make the limit. Both Jones and Silva walk around weight is above 215lbs. Fedor never cut weight and fought mostly against bigger opponents. What you should be asking is can Jones and Silva be undefeated for as many years as Fedor and remain on top of the HW division for as many years as he? We already know the answer to that 1 and its a resounding "NO" and that's the reason why Fedor is MMA's GOAT.

 

[Joker Jiujitsu]

While in his prime, Fedor beat the best fighters available to him during his run as Champion, while those fighters were still competitive or looked great at the time. He also beat some odd ball opponents during freakshow bouts in between, but it never deterred him from defending his belt or fighting top competition. When you destroy Nogueira twice, smash Cro Cop, beat Coleman twice, and crush Arlovski and Sylvia in a combined time of less than 5 minutes, those fights against Randleman or Hunt or whoever may pale in comparison, but you have to examine those bouts in context. Fedor would have fought better opponents at the time if they were available, but they weren't. Barnett couldn't or wouldn't fight him. Same with Overeem, who was still a light heavyweight at the time and Fedor would have been criticized. Cain, JDS, Brock, etc. were novices when Fedor started to decline.

You have to wait and see how history views Jones' career after he hangs it up. How will they put his victories over Shogun, Rampage, Machida, Rashad, Teixeira, etc. when none of them have had much success after losing to Jones? Or how would they view the fact he had close, tough fights with Gustafson, Machida, Belfort, OSP, and Cormier, or that he fought Chael Sonnen in a title defense, or that he never fought Rumble or Davis? You can do this with anybody. Same could apply to Anderson, who struggled with Maia, Litter, Leites, etc. Fedor never had those types of embarrassing or underwhelming performances. He always came to fight, even in his losses.

 

[Venom]

OK you have a 1 sided view first of all Jones and Silva has to cut weight to make the limit. Both Jones and Silva walk around weight is above 215lbs. Fedor never cut weight and fought mostly against bigger opponents. What you should be asking is can Jones and Silva be undefeated for as many years as Fedor and remain on top of the HW division for as many years as he? We already know the answer to that 1 and its a resounding "NO" and that's the reason why Fedor is MMA's GOAT.

To be fair, besides taking into account the quality of middle and lhw opponents,
Look at the top UFC heavyweights, Miocic, Werdum, Overeem, Velasquez, JDS, etc...this is a dangerous area for anybody smaller than heavyweight to be in for very long at the top.

As someone else stated in a similar thread about Jon Jones, HW overall is shallow, but the upper echelon is very strong.

Fedor is one of the GOATs, but I on one hand hesistate to just give it to him.

 

[Fullmount Triangle]

Bravo.

Ogawa has beaten like one guy with a SINGLE win (Goodridge) in his career.

But damn, you say he beat Stefan Leko huh.

Total Elimination 2004. I remember it being a knockout but apparently it was an arm triangle, but he did knock him down. Ogawa wasn't committed to MMA for shit, he'd fight once a year MAYBE, which is a shame, because he was actually good.

 

[DannyNL]

- 10 fights in his 42 fight career is pretty good, show me a career of 40+ fights where it's all killers, it doesn't exist, there aren't 42 people in a weight class that are good

Jon Jones' run blows Fedor's run out of the water.

 

[VIPERdude]

While in his prime, Fedor beat the best fighters available to him during his run as Champion, while those fighters were still competitive or looked great at the time. He also beat some odd ball opponents during freakshow bouts in between, but it never deterred him from defending his belt or fighting top competition. When you destroy Nogueira twice, smash Cro Cop, beat Coleman twice, and crush Arlovski and Sylvia in a combined time of less than 5 minutes, those fights against Randleman or Hunt or whoever may pale in comparison, but you have to examine those bouts in context. Fedor would have fought better opponents at the time if they were available, but they weren't. Barnett couldn't or wouldn't fight him. Same with Overeem, who was still a light heavyweight at the time and Fedor would have been criticized. Cain, JDS, Brock, etc. were novices when Fedor started to decline.

You have to wait and see how history views Jones' career after he hangs it up. How will they put his victories over Shogun, Rampage, Machida, Rashad, Teixeira, etc. when none of them have had much success after losing to Jones? Or how would they view the fact he had close, tough fights with Gustafson, Machida, Belfort, OSP, and Cormier, or that he fought Chael Sonnen in a title defense, or that he never fought Rumble or Davis? You can do this with anybody. Same could apply to Anderson, who struggled with Maia, Litter, Leites, etc. Fedor never had those types of embarrassing or underwhelming performances. He always came to fight, even in his losses.

To all the posters that cant have a discussion and have to use insults to get a point across. Here is a poster who knows what we are talking about this for. I asked a question and he had a great explanation. Thank you sir for being one of the last of the irrelevant posters on Sherdog

 

[VIPERdude]

Except Brock Lesnar.



Well he did beat Schilt, Cro Cop, Heath Herring, Big Nog 2x, Mark Coleman 2x, Mark Hunt, Lindland, Rogers, Arlovski, Sylvia, Maldando lol, Rizzo, Monson, and a few others.

Yes. However other HW's have those names on their resume as well, minus the cans. Lindland and Maldanado were middleweights/LHW's as well. Monson lost to Tim Sylvia he wasnt on Fedors level. Rizzo was out of his prime in 1995.. Rogers worked at Sams club before MMA. Im not saying Fedor doesnt deserve to be in the greats discussion I just dont see that being a reason to be considered the greatest ever. Thats my opinion and many dont like it. Thats ok. Its Sherdog

 

[samoajoe]

OK you have a 1 sided view first of all Jones and Silva has to cut weight to make the limit. Both Jones and Silva walk around weight is above 215lbs. Fedor never cut weight and fought mostly against bigger opponents. What you should be asking is can Jones and Silva be undefeated for as many years as Fedor and remain on top of the HW division for as many years as he? We already know the answer to that 1 and its a resounding "NO" and that's the reason why Fedor is MMA's GOAT.

Of course the answer is NO Fedor wouldnt be able to do that now either as a matter of fact by the time he was 33 which is young for a HW he started getting beat once the comp became more well rounded.

HW was comically weak for most of those years Fedor was on top.

 

[synyster]

he beat the best of his era, he reigned over the toughest div at the time... heavy has always carried the most prestige and even if you dont have him as you all time goat, he is pretty undisputed as the goat of heavy which like I said is kinda the king div "baddest man on the planet"... He never point fought, and he showed amazing character in and out of the ring. He simply is the perfect role model and example of what an MMA fighter should aspire to be.

 

[InfantGoose6565]

no. Its a discussion. I been here 10 years. Is that the best you have or do you have something to contribute like some smart posters here have. I asked a question, if you cant answer or participate why are you here? Whos the Troll my friend.

Btw i dont know why im even entertaining somebody who just joined AGAIN after likely getting booted for being a cocksucker elsewhere lol

You are seriously a pathetic human being, I just made this account and I haven't been "Booted off" anywhere and it's not my fault you don't have any friends in real life to discuss this with, not to mention your post is irrelevant because Fedor is one of the greatest fighters of all time

 

[skylolow]

Jones has 7 guys on his record you've never heard of either.
... In fact everybody does.

I'm sure his point is Jones isn't fighting cans in his prime.

Fedor is for sure right up there as one of the GOAT if not. The only thing anyone can knock on Fedor's record is these one off fights Pride lined up for him in his prime. Literally, most didn't belong in the same building as Fedor let alone the ring. People could argue those "breaks" is what allowed him to go 10 years undefeated. Going out and fighting the best every time out is hard to maintain fight after fight. One off night and it all comes crashing down.

 

[VIPERdude]

You are seriously a pathetic human being, I just made this account and I haven't been "Booted off" anywhere and it's not my fault you don't have any friends in real life to discuss this with, not to mention your post is irrelevant because Fedor is one of the greatest fighters of all time

LMAO...you are on a forum... going out of your way to insult me, over a discussion about Fedor? Glad I could be the highlight of your day. You must feel real accomplished. Anyone who reads what you wrote is going to look at you and see how sad you must be in "your real life" LOL smh

 

[GAR]

Fedor is a class act, a Fedor in his 20s was a killer of a fighter, sniper, fast accurate, amazing wrestling, its a shame people have to post a why is Fedor the greatest every day, go on youtube and do your research, look at some of his old fights. He carries himself like a true gentleman, and he was an amazing fighter in his 20s and early 30s, we get old, everyone does, jordan got old, ali got old, tyson got old, roy jones got old, lennox lewis got old, its life and its nature, still does not take away from what he did in his prime, does not take away what jordan did in his prime, does not take away what a young tyson used to do to people. Dont judge him based on his recent fights, but judge the man in his prime, like all athletes, only barry bonds got better as he aged, and we all know why.....

 

[Magnum1978]

This is a list of his opponents in it's entirety, with records at time of their fight and where they were in the rankings:

Martin Lazarov (0-0) NR
Levon Lagvilava (1-2) NR
Hiroya Takada (0-0) NR
Ricardo Arona (2-0) #13
Tsuyoshi Kosaka (22-10-2) #13
Mihail Apostolov (0-0) NR
Kerry Schall (5-2) #67
Renato Sobral (19-2) #8
Ryushi Yanigasawa (24-21-9) #44
Lee Hasdell (11-13-3) #104
Chris Haseman (18-11) NR
Semmy Schilt (22-10-1) #7
Heath Herring (20-7) #9
Antonio Rodrigo Nougeria (19-1-1) #1
Egidijus Valavicius (5-2) #105
Kazuyuki Fujita (8-3) #35
Gary Goodridge (17-13-1) #11
Yuji Nagata (0-1) NR
Mark Coleman (13-5) #9
Kevin Randleman (14-7) #22 (Ranked as LHW)
Naoya Ogawa (7-0) #65
Antonio Rodrigo Nougeria (23-2-1) #2
Tsuyoshi Kosaka (24-15-2) #12
Mirko Filipovic (16-2-2) #4
Zuluzinho (4-0) #115
Mark Coleman (15-7) #4
Mark Hunt (5-2) #7
Matt Lindland (20-4) #8 (Ranked as MW)
Choi Hong-man (1-0) NR
Tim Sylvia (24-4) #8
Andre Arlovski (15-5) #6
Brett Rogers (10-0) #7
Fabricio Werdum (13-4-1) #10
Antonio Silva (15-2) #11
Dan Henderson (27-8) #7 (Ranked as LHW)
Jeff Monson (42-12) #31
Satoshi Ishii (4-1-1) #46 (Ranked as LHW)
Pedro Rizzo (19-9) NR
Singh Jaideep (2-0) NR
Fabio Maldonado (22-9) #35 (Ranked as LHW)

Out of 40 matches, 15 of them against top 10 ranked opponents, 21 were in the top 25. 25 were in the top 50. Fedor was 13-2 against top 10 opponents. He faced against 13 former champions in from different organizations, going 11-2 against them. 9 were former/current kick-boxers, 13 were wrestlers and 11 Jiu Jitsu submission fighters. 7 Miscellaneous. He faced a top ten opponent every 1.5 years from 2001 to 2011.

Nice, but even those rankings some I question?

Sylvia at #8? Who where the 7 better HW's at that point? Couture/AA/Nog? Gonzaga?

AA at #4? He was off a 5 fight win streak from his loss to Tim, but had beaten Werdum, Nelson, Rothwell... Randy was basically inactive at that point? 2-1 Lesnar?

Anyway, Fedor fought lots of great competition, was so far ahead of the curve during his peak run, and although he fought many sub-par fighters (even while being at his best), it was usually at NYE or some other spectacle, common in Japan at the time.

Also, plenty of other great fighters have many 'cans' on their records. Look at Anderson Silva, Matt Hughes, Wanderlei, Rich Franklin, Nog, etc.