Traditional Karate guard vs Boxing guard

[spacetime]

The Katateka explains why a boxing guard leaves the fighter open to midsection kicks (also high kicks above the chin) . However, the Karate guard is loo low against continous punching, also known as boxing!

Some of the Thais use a high guard protecting the top of the head, but leave their body wide open for front kicks and strikes to the body in general.

Which guard do you think is optimal for freestyle stand-up? MMA fighters get tagged no matter which guard but it's hard to hide behind those small gloves.

 

[ctrlaltdelete]

Thai fighters raise their arms to invite attacks to the chest and stomach so they can catch teeps and mid kicks.

 

[rmongler]

If you say boxing guard, you'll have to have to specify which one.

I don't think there are very many benefits to leaving the rear hand low, that would outweigh leaving a window for someone to slot in head kicks on the open side, the most vulnerable side for round kicks.

In my opinion, lead hand low and rear hand high is the best compromise for all around defensive measures.

Tactics for using this guard in boxing are well documented, but it's also analogous to the arm positioning one would use to catch kicks and drag the leg across for a sweep...



...as well as the near hand being in better position to quickly down block, crossface, or guillotine someone shooting in on your hips.



Many thai fighters use both hands in a high guard, but this is fine for them since they will be raising a leg to check body kicks anyways. If takedowns were involved things might be different, but competitors who like winning and not losing will optimize for the ruleset they are competing in.

 

[Jimmy Jazz]

Can any karate guys explain why we slide our feet? first thing they taught me in boxing after years of karate was to stop sliding my feet.

 

[Reyesnuthugr]

I think the original purpose of hands out was for grappling/clinch/throwing. That's why it can work MT but does not bode so well in boxing. Also I read that Karate kata where you pull one arm back as you punch with the other was meant for the pulling arm to be grabbing and pulling clothing. Karate used to teach takedowns and throws in it. That's the main benefit of having your arms extended, is to wrap and control the opponent into a clinch.

 

[j123]

I think the original purpose of hands out was for grappling/clinch/throwing.

That's my thought as well for the very high guard in MT

Can any karate guys explain why we slide our feet? first thing they taught me in boxing after years of karate was to stop sliding my feet.

I'm not a karate guy, but from my exp. with sparring against some, its easier for in and out movement. I use it in some cases.

 

[spacetime]

Can any karate guys explain why we slide our feet? first thing they taught me in boxing after years of karate was to stop sliding my feet.

Slide? I know about step-ins in both boxing and Karate but I don't know what you are referring to.

 

[Jimmy Jazz]

That's my thought as well for the very high guard in MT


I'm not a karate guy, but from my exp. with sparring against some, its easier for in and out movement. I use it in some cases.

I feel like sliding your feet lends itself to traditional kick arts. Personally though I prefer to take little stpes but if I'm doing karate style kicks I sometimes slide my feet for some reason. I dont know why.

 

[spacetime]

If you say boxing guard, you'll have to have to specify which one.

I don't think there are very many benefits to leaving the rear hand low, that would outweigh leaving a window for someone to slot in head kicks on the open side, the most vulnerable side for round kicks.

In my opinion, lead hand low and rear hand high is the best compromise for all around defensive measures.

Tactics for using this guard in boxing are well documented, but it's also analogous to the arm positioning one would use to catch kicks and drag the leg across for a sweep...



...as well as the near hand being in better position to quickly down block, crossface, or guillotine someone shooting in on your hips.



Many thai fighters use both hands in a high guard, but this is fine for them since they will be raising a leg to check body kicks anyways. If takedowns were involved things might be different, but competitors who like winning and not losing will optimize for the ruleset they are competing in.

Watch how Ernesto Hoost punishes the high Thai guard here.

 

[Jimmy Jazz]

Slide? I know about step-ins in both boxing and Karate but I don't know what you are referring to.

in the vid the guy is sliding his feet.

 

[spacetime]

If you say boxing guard, you'll have to have to specify which one.

It is specified in the video.

 

[rmongler]

Watch how Ernesto Hoost punishes the high Thai guard here.

Ernesto is rangy and likely a lot better with his hands than Kiatsongrit, is what you're trying to say?

 

[spacetime]

Ernesto is rangy and likely a lot better with his hands than Kiatsongrit, is what you're trying to say?

Hoost punishes the high guard with front kicks repeatedly. I have talked to a Muay Thai fighter about this and he agrees that they are vulnerable to such kicks but you need more than that to win the fight.

 

[rmongler]

Well i always like to say the teep/front kick is the most important fundamental kick to be good at, so it's all preaching to the choir.

 

[spacetime]

in the vid the guy is sliding his feet.

It is because of their stop-format (first one to strike) in traditional Karate Kumite.

 

[Jimmy Jazz]

It is because of their stop-format (first one to strike) in traditional Karate Kumite.

I've seen it in traditional okinawan karate, not just point fighting. what does sliding your feet have to do with it?

 

[spacetime]

I've seen it in traditional karate, not just point fighting.

Traditional Karate is point fighting. It was their first free fighting format for sparring. And it was based on their fighting philosophy bare knuckled

 

[Jimmy Jazz]

Traditional Karate is point fighting. It was their first free fighting format for sparring. And it was based on their fighting philosophy bare knuckled

not okinawan, they free spar like kyokushin if they spar at all.

 

[MadSquabbles500]

Also MT, and Boxing wear gloves. They affects how they defend. Boxing also cannot clinch and pound, so no need to emphasize that in your guard. MT can clinch, but gloves limit how many holds you have.

 

[spacetime]

not okinawan, they free spar like kyokushin if they spar at all.

I doubt original Okinawan sparring rules were Kyokushin format.