To all you saying Ortiz-Sonnen was FIXED, you're giving in too easily...

[Venom]

Nowhere did I say that Coker fixed the fight. I said the fight looked dodgy as hell. Which it did, hence why there's a group of people thinking it was a fix. I don't have enough evidence to say it was or not, so I can't say either way. To my eyes though, it just felt off. Also, just because a fight may be fixed, doesn't mean it's the boss doing it. As I've said earlier in the thread. Just look at Bob Sapp.

I would say if the boss isn't heading it, it's not a fix, it would be number 4; Chael threw the fight. When most of these clowns yell "fixed" 9 times out of 10 they're referring to a conspiracy from the top.

 

[darticus]

I came here hoping to see the famous Rick Flair flop, man I'm sure disappointed

 

[chinarice]

WTF are you talking about?
Chael showed tons of heart against both Jones and Rashad.
He hung in there like a champ and weathered the storm. Almost beat Jones too, a few seconds away from beating Jones.

Almost beat Jones...???.. Lol cmon man wtf... Jones would have lost due to a freak accident from his own doing. Chael did zero to Jones. Nothing.

What heart did he show against Rashad? As soon as Rashad got him down, he turtled and gave up.....

Tito is better than Chael. Their fight just proved it even further.

 

[helltoupee]

Nowhere did I say that Coker fixed the fight. I said the fight looked dodgy as hell. Which it did, hence why there's a group of people thinking it was a fix. I don't have enough evidence to say it was or not, so I can't say either way. To my eyes though, it just felt off. Also, just because a fight may be fixed, doesn't mean it's the boss doing it. As I've said earlier in the thread. Just look at Bob Sapp.

I agree it may look that way to certain people, but we've got to remember - these guys are old and out of shape - "legends" fights are going to look really underwhelming.

For example. Most pro fighters won't tap from jaw pain/neck cranks, but people do it in the gym all the time. The same with guys who just don't have that much to gain anymore - they don't have the will, heart, or desire to fight through that kind of thing anymore.

Chael's face was purple and Tito is a big dude who is strong for his size. I think it comes down to Chael just giving up. I mean, let's say Chael threw it because he told friends to bet on Tito. How much money do you think he could really make off of that? Honestly, how much?

Chael is a smart guy, if that was a work, he would've let Tito take his back and made it look much more convincing. Why would he do something that looks fake, if it is fake - he's not that stupid.

 

[SteelHeems]

I agree it may look that way to certain people, but we've got to remember - these guys are old and out of shape - "legends" fights are going to look really underwhelming.

For example. Most pro fighters won't tap from jaw pain/neck cranks, but people do it in the gym all the time. The same with guys who just don't have that much to gain anymore - they don't have the will, heart, or desire to fight through that kind of thing anymore.

Chael's face was purple and Tito is a big dude who is strong for his size. I think it comes down to Chael just giving up. I mean, let's say Chael threw it because he told friends to bet on Tito. How much money do you think he could really make off of that? Honestly, how much?

Chael is a smart guy, if that was a work, he would've let Tito take his back and made it look much more convincing. Why would he do something that looks fake, if it is fake - he's not that stupid.

You say Chael is a smart guy. Yet he's been busted for steroids and thrown off a reality TV show for cheating. He's not that smart. He's great at building up fights and generally getting MMA media attention.

I don't know how much money he could have made off betting, as I said, I didn't see enough evidence to show that it's a work, the fight was just very very strange looking. Start to finish and I've seen plenty of "legend" fights. I know neck cranks can make you tap, I've suffered them before, they're not nice. It's not difficult to make your own face purple either. again, I can easily accept that the fight wasn't a fix, but it seemed weird enough for me to consider it.

 

[mike_2613]

nope,a legit win,chael isnt at the top of his game these days,also chael is predictable,tito pretty much said they worked on everything chael did,and they countered it.also it was a blood choke,

 

[helltoupee]

You say Chael is a smart guy. Yet he's been busted for steroids and thrown off a reality TV show for cheating. He's not that smart. He's great at building up fights and generally getting MMA media attention.

I don't know how much money he could have made off betting, as I said, I didn't see enough evidence to show that it's a work, the fight was just very very strange looking. Start to finish and I've seen plenty of "legend" fights. I know neck cranks can make you tap, I've suffered them before, they're not nice. It's not difficult to make your own face purple either. again, I can easily accept that the fight wasn't a fix, but it seemed weird enough for me to consider it.

But Chael is smart enough to know that tapping the way he did will look much more suspicious than letting Tito take his back and sinking one in that way. I mean seriously, we are talking about jail time here from gambling collusion...I don't think he's that dumb, but who knows, maybe he is....

I guess we just agree to disagree. Cheers.

 

[MuayThaiBX]

Not fixed. Sonnen is old and rusty and always liable to fall into a submission. Tito is a very strong dude to be cranking on your neck. Tito was much bigger and stronger than Chael coming into that fight. Chael quits when the going gets rough. I am a bit suspicious of Tito's physique in this fight though. He looked a little too lean and shredded for being 42 years old.

 

[filthynumber1]

Tito is just that good.

 

[LMNT]

This shit was more fixed than summer slam

 

[ramair455]

People say Chael just can defend chokes. Here he is defending a better choke for 2 1/2 minutes just over a year ago

 

[Venom]

This shit was more fixed than summer slam

Um....evidence.

 

[sadclown]

At that time, there was no one who could come close. Forget about the hindsight aspect. He crushed people constantly.

Then the phrase should have been "became the most dominant champion ever seen at the time"

It's just a minor thing, but makes a big difference.

 

[Kinger85]

a not great fighter who hasn't fought in 3+ years didn't look good..

shocking.

 

[Transmorphers]

Two things: There's no need for Coker or Bellator to be in on a fix, and some of us watched the fight live, thought it was suspicious as hell, then jumped online to see other people feeling the same way. That's not so much a bandwagon as people separately coming to the same conclusion.

I don't care who won that fight and I never did. I have no emotional investment in Tito or Chael. I see the argument around here that people are just Chael fan boys or Tito haters. I'm not either. I don't care. I just think that fight was very suspicious.

Having said all of that, the best argument against that fight being fixed is that it looked too fixed.

 

[Zefram Cochrane]

It was a terrible fight fixed or not, barely above Shamrock v Kimbo territory. Plus I don't understand why people are so fixated on the final submission. That was literally the least fishy moment of that whole fight.

 

[Transmorphers]

If they were going to fix the fight it should have been a much better fight

That's the conventional wisdom, but think about the fights we know or have strong reason to believe were worked like Takada vs Coleman. It's a lot harder to fake a good fight than a bad one. In MMA, faking a good fight means still getting hit. The ending of Takada vs Tamura comes to mind, which a lot of people think was an accidental KO in a fight which was supposed to be worked (as most/maybe all of Takada's fights were).

 

[shertardinho]

i am all hands for #3 TS
Tito is just a better athlete at this age

 

[Smoking Indoors]

Then the phrase should have been "became the most dominant champion ever seen at the time"

It's just a minor thing, but makes a big difference.

Well 2001-2002ish time frame was when Tito was the most dominant champ mma had ever seen.

 

[Venom]

Two things: There's no need for Coker or Bellator to be in on a fix, and some of us watched the fight live, thought it was suspicious as hell, then jumped online to see other people feeling the same way. That's not so much a bandwagon as people separately coming to the same conclusion.

It's a bandwagon in the sense that people are picking that conclusion from confirmation bias. There is no evidence of it, mind you, no more than the other, and quite frankly, more likely scenarios.

Having said all of that, the best argument against that fight being fixed is that it looked too fixed.

I can think of a dozen or more fights that looked more fixed, some in the opposite direction of what one would suspect too, if looked at purely on how "weird" the fighters fought.