North Korea Threatens to Scuddle Talks

PainIsLIfe said:
No, but it means either Kim or SK have to give up power to the other.
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Reconciliation doesn't mean 2 Koreas become 1 Korea... A peace treaty and official end to all hostilities will suffice.

South Korea will never allow NK to rule them. I am positively sure most of the world would be against it and support SK's independence. Now whether Kim will ever give up power... who knows. not now but it could be way down the line once his people realize his government has been feeding them complete lies and see how well SK has been living comparatively to NK.
 
Orgasmo said:
After Iran got screwed on the nuclear agreement, I doubt North Korea will put any faith in what American government promises. If a joint international agreement can't make Trump abide by the terms, his promises are surely worthless. Trump essentially told the world that he'd rip up a deal even if the other side follows it.
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This and the fact that Bolton going around saying "we want a deal similar to what was done in Libya" didn't help. Regardless how successful the "denuclearization of Libya" went for the US, all Kim would see is "Libya gave up nukes and Khadafi ended up dead in a drainage ditch via razor knife to the ass" and I'm sure he's not to keen on that fate.

They still might work out something, and to keep it consistent (despite all the Trumpers jumping all over me for my position and not ready to proclaim Trump the great unifier) let's wait and see, this might be more posturing by Kim to drive a wedge between South Korea and the US, it might be him pushing for more than he can get (the old "start off asking for something crazy, so when you ask for what you really want it seems "reasonable" compared to the original demand) or he is going through motions to make himself look like the good guy and at some point all he needs to do it point to something Trump or one of his people says or even the military drills as the catalyst for derailing the whole peace process trying to make North Korea seem like the reasonable peace loving one and the US and possibly South Korea as the spoilers.
 
VivaRevolution said:
Nope. There is literally nothing that can be offered to NK that is worth them giving up their nukes.

You guys are hilarious. Afghanistan, the closest place in the world to a hunter gatherer, stone age society, has resisted the US military for almost 20 years now. The day we leave, the Afghan government collapses, and the Taliban goes back into power.

You live in a fairy tale. That fat orange con man isn't intimidating or solving shit.
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Do you think we're trying to destroy the Taliban? Stop and think about that really hard.

North Korea will give up their nukes, because China wants them to. If you don't understand all that, you don't understand Asian Culture, you don't understand what generally happens within brutal dictatorships when they show even a little bit of weakness, and you generally don't understand this situation as a whole.
 
SaiWa said:
Nothing has changed. They've always been the weak party posturing and trying to survive inside their own country...
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China isn't backing them up anymore. That's changed, and I'd say that's an incredibly significant change.
 
lfd0311 said:
Do you think we're trying to destroy the Taliban? Stop and think about that really hard.

North Korea will give up their nukes, because China wants them to. If you don't understand all that, you don't understand Asian Culture, you don't understand what generally happens within brutal dictatorships when they show even a little bit of weakness, and you generally don't understand this situation as a whole.
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Lol, North Korea just left a meeting with China, and is now threatening to end talks with the US. What does that tell You?

China is shooting lasers at US jets in Africa, and weaponizing the South China sea.

Like I said, you live in a fairy tale.
 
nostradumbass said:
That's absolutely true. Pretty sure we're all clear that fox leans right and all the others lean left. You might get a few on youtube who call out both equally. None come to mind though.
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The non Fox MSM lean left ..on some issues. But not on foreign policy. In foreign policy they (generally) tow the hawkish US establishment line. They also lean right when the story is about Israel. But lately I have been seeing a slight change in the traditional US media bias towards Israel, where the MSM are now starting to tip-toe into reporting that is less sympathetic of Israel than before. Contrast the US media with Israeli media like Haaretz, and how critical Haaretz is of Israeli policies.
 
lfd0311 said:
China isn't backing them up anymore. That's changed, and I'd say that's an incredibly significant change.
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China is using NK as a bargaining chip against the US. Like how the Pakistanis use the threat of nuclear weapons falling into Islamist hands and support jihadists as bargaining chips against the US and the Afghan government.

Trump was harsh on China several months ago, but toned down his rhetoric and plans after he was made aware that going soft on China would get NK to soften their bellicosity.
 
VivaRevolution said:
Lol, North Korea just left a meeting with China, and is now threatening to end talks with the US. What does that tell You?

China is shooting lasers at US jets in Africa, and weaponizing the South China sea.

Like I said, you live in a fairy tale.
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Er mur gersh, Lazers?!?!?!

Yes. they've been building islands in the South China Sea for the better part of a decade, is this news to you? China can't control Kim Jong Un, and, once again, that's not how things are done in Asian Culture. Hegimony is a very real and very important thing.

Secondly, that food agreement signed last year with the US actually gave the US a smidgeon of power in negotiations with China. Not much, but it's something that China needs and wants to happen. It's not going to allow it's goofball vassal to screw that up for them.
 
well this is what happens when youre in the middle of peace talks with a country, youve got that country to start dismantling its nuke testing facility .......................................................... annnnnnnnnnnnnnnnd then you go and run joint wargame exercises right next to them that are nothing short of training to take over their country.....is that not an act of provocation??

trump for a peace prize lol....would that be for mucking about with NK or bombing some russian soldiers in syria?
 
lfd0311 said:
China isn't backing them up anymore. That's changed, and I'd say that's an incredibly significant change.
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China is still backing them. China's main concern is the humanitarian crisis that could be created if North Korea collapses, the number of refugees that would come streaming across the yalu river is what bothers them. North Korea was a convenient buffer, but make no mistake about it that the Chinese look down on the North Koreans and the North Koreans have a similar feeling about the Chinese.
China treats them like a crazy pit bull chained up in the back yard, it does a good job keeping the neighbors from coming on your property but sometimes it's more of a pain in the ass than it's worth because it tries to attack the neighbor, is always looking for food and likes to dig up the ground and shit all over the place.
 
lfd0311 said:
Er mur gersh, Lazers?!?!?!

Yes. they've been building islands in the South China Sea for the better part of a decade, is this news to you? China can't control Kim Jong Un, and, once again, that's not how things are done in Asian Culture. Hegimony is a very real and very important thing.

Secondly, that food agreement signed last year with the US actually gave the US a smidgeon of power in negotiations with China. Not much, but it's something that China needs and wants to happen. It's not going to allow it's goofball vassal to screw that up for them.
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China has the biggest leverage against the North. The North gets most of its supplies , including food and energy, from China. China is the North's biggest trading partner. China is the Kim regime's only lifeline.
 
JonnyRingo84 said:
spin spin spin

you must watch a lot of cable news. youre well versed in this art.

0 people here are celebrating that NK keeps nukes, and i think you know that. what some people are celebrating, is that maybe it was a bit premature to demand praise of trump for solving the korean peninsula?
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literally what i posted before about thsi topic. so point this assessment elsewhere
 
MicroBrew said:
China is using NK as a bargaining chip against the US.
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Of course they are. In the same way that they're using their support of NK as a barganing chip with Kim Jong Un. I'm not trying to present the US and China as "friends" of any sort on this, but China's inability to control NK is a very real and significant problem for everyone, and China isn't about to get dragged into an actual war because NK can't get it's act together, nor are they about to be made to look weak by an upstart country that is suppoused to be subservient to them refusing to come to heel.
 
SMillard said:
China is still backing them. China's main concern is the humanitarian crisis that could be created if North Korea collapses, the number of refugees that would come streaming across the yalu river is what bothers them. North Korea was a convenient buffer, but make no mistake about it that the Chinese look down on the North Koreans and the North Koreans have a similar feeling about the Chinese.
China treats them like a crazy pit bull chained up in the back yard, it does a good job keeping the neighbors from coming on your property but sometimes it's more of a pain in the ass than it's worth because it tries to attack the neighbor, is always looking for food and likes to dig up the ground and shit all over the place.
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China is less inclined to support them than they've ever been. I understand China's concerns, but those are drastically outweighed by thier inability to control him they way they could his father and grandfather, and with their constant pressing need to feed their people, which is in large parts solved by thier trade agreement with the US.
 
MicroBrew said:
China has the biggest leverage against the North. The North gets most of its supplies , including food and energy, from China. China is the North's biggest trading partner. China is the Kim regime's only lifeline.
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And China supports North Korea for one reason. They don't want 25 million refugees surging across their boarder.

So basically, if they ever exercise that leverage, they will create the very thing they fear.
 
VivaRevolution said:
And China supports North Korea for one reason. They don't want 25 million refugees surging across their boarder.

So basically, if they ever exercise that leverage, they will create the very thing they fear.
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They fear starvation....
 
VivaRevolution said:
I seriously doubt she burned tapes, of water boarding, or Saudi ran black sites.

The really bad stuff is classified. Veteran CIA officers don't break down in tears over water boarding, and stress positions.

"528-page public summary of that report, which itself is quite graphic, describing one interrogation session so brutal that some CIA personnel broke down in tears."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna873941
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no way a cia personnel broke down over this given the shit they read from afghans raping kids daliy
 
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