Is it just a coincidence that 170 has been dominated primarily by wrestlers for many years?

Megatronlee said:
He’s a ufc fighter dumb dumb
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Just sprawl LOL
Fitch has only been wrestling his whole life, 6 months takedown defense and you should be able to sprawl on him EASY.
Same goes for anybody trying to stop a wrestler from taking them down.
 
Odoylerules4lyf said:
Just sprawl LOL
Fitch has only been wrestling his whole life, 6 months takedown defense and you should be able to sprawl on him EASY.
Same goes for anybody trying to stop a wrestler from taking them down.
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Cm punk is a ufc fighter man. It don’t matter how much you train if you’re not also in the ufc. Outside of his loss in Mickey have you watched any of his non takedown wrestling fights? He had the WWE belt a long time. Even though their rules are a little different. I knew he’d do well in the striking tho
 
Megatronlee said:
Cm punk is a ufc fighter man. It don’t matter how much you train if you’re not also in the ufc. Outside of his loss in Mickey have you watched any of his non takedown wrestling fights? He had the WWE belt a long time. Even though their rules are a little different. I knew he’d do well in the striking tho
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Alright you got me lol
 
Same reason why 205 division is dead . The big wrestlers like gsp and kosheck were big for their divisions at the time 170 always been 185ers who could cut . Just like guys who would have been at 205 in 09 are now middle weights. Thiago Silva , Matt sera , even nick could have been 155ers, even robbie , Larkin we’re originally middleweights .
 
Hespectfully said:
You could probably name mulitple champs with a wrestling base for most weight classes. Wrestling is a great base, possibly the best. Es normal.

HW: Brock, Randy, Stipe, Coleman
LHW: Tito, Chuck, Cormier.

See?
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This is why data is so important. I dunno if ts is correct. It could simply be availability bias. We would need to collect the data and test for a statistically significant difference
 
LogicalFighting said:
here's the thing.... a wrestler would be nowhere as dominant if they could be punished with knees to the head when their opponent sprawls on their takedowns.

the rules provide wrestlers advantages in which a failed td execution doesn't come with as much danger as it should
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rules are even in my book maybe a slight edge towards striking. you cant say the rules are for grappling when grapplers can get stood up or separated, and each round starts standing.

there is no penalty for non effective "striking". they wont force a clinch or ground position, but they will stand a fight up or separate.
 
I'm kind of shocked at how many people in this thread are trying to argue that wrestling is not dominant in every weight class, against the overwhelming evidence that it is. 170 is not unique at all.
 
Even with stellar tdd guys like Khabib and GSP gonna take you down ANYWAY. So you have to survive off your back,you gotta figure out how to get back to your feet and impose your game to hopefully smother the next td attempt. And not just give up and show a false macho display of bravado as hes getting dominated like paul daley who lets face it,is never going to get to the level he needs to be elite.
 
DeeDubb said:
It's mostly been American wrestlers with a power overhand to set up their takedowns (or GSP who set it up with his great jab).

Hughes, GSP, Hendricks, Woodley, and contenders like Fitch, Koscheck, Colby, Usman, etc, etc, etc... Why is 170 the weight class for wrestlers?
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I'd say the biggest issue is that its a division that never really had serious investment in it from Japan, a lot of the best talent from Brazil and Europe at LHW and HW got brought though in an era were the path to the big time could be very rapid and orgs like Pride, RINGS, etc had close development links with camps like Chute Boxe, Brazilian./Russian Top Team.

That said its not like non US wrestlers haven't made an impact is it? Maia, Palhares, Wonderboy, etc have all at points in the past gone on better runs than expected due to wrestlers not having experience of their skill set.

WW got hyped so much by the UFC that I think people tended to overlook that actually a lot of the striking and sub grappling ability on display wasn't that great.
 
MaulingMyClown said:
Like those purple belts you tapped lol
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Some got it, some don't lol
I personally went in to a gym with no real jiu jitsu training(just a lot of wrestling experience and watching videos on youtube and practicing with friends) and was subbing most of the blue belts I rolled with. And yes it was a legit school. I don't think it would have taken too long to be able to hang with the purple belt I rolled with.
 
Th3Sav4ge said:
rules are even in my book maybe a slight edge towards striking. you cant say the rules are for grappling when grapplers can get stood up or separated, and each round starts standing.

there is no penalty for non effective "striking". they wont force a clinch or ground position, but they will stand a fight up or separate.
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you do have somewhat of a point,
but what do you consider non effective striking? and what would you punishment be for that? in pride, they did a yellow card which the fighter lost % of the purse.

and it doesn't seem to make sense to force a clinch or a ground position because the fight doesn't start in clinch or ground. the fight starts standing which is an equal position for both fighters. if the wrestler is stalling, they have to be stood up.


but it also still doesn't change the fact that a wrestler can spam takedowns and not worry about knees to the head since they're grounded. they essentially have a high-reward, low-risk move.
 
LogicalFighting said:
you do have somewhat of a point,
but what do you consider non effective striking? and what would you punishment be for that? in pride, they did a yellow card which the fighter lost % of the purse.

and it doesn't seem to make sense to force a clinch or a ground position because the fight doesn't start in clinch or ground. the fight starts standing which is an equal position for both fighters. if the wrestler is stalling, they have to be stood up.


but it also still doesn't change the fact that a wrestler can spam takedowns and not worry about knees to the head since they're grounded. they essentially have a high-reward, low-risk move.
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this is why the rounds start standing i get that. but taking away position from the fighter in control, to a "neutral standing position" is unfair to me.

the equivalent to me would be taking to passive fighters not "working" in the stand up and forcing them to do and over/under position in the middle of the cage. honestly this sounds retarded to even me because im so used to they way the rules are. but it would be dead even that way. you cant say its fair to separate maia from wonderboy if there is "no working", but its not fair to force a neutral clinich in the middle of the cage if wonderboy isnt "working".

hypothetical scenario but one i feel fits
 
Well it would be a better sample size if GSP didn' reign for so long.

What about Alves, Condit, Diaz, Lawler, Wonderboy, Till? Or that Woodley has used almost exclusively striking in the last like 5 years or that Kos was a striking threat and people claimed he would KO GSP with his right hand not outwrestle him atleast when talking about their rematch.
 
Th3Sav4ge said:
this is why the rounds start standing i get that. but taking away position from the fighter in control, to a "neutral standing position" is unfair to me.

the equivalent to me would be taking to passive fighters not "working" in the stand up and forcing them to do and over/under position in the middle of the cage. honestly this sounds retarded to even me because im so used to they way the rules are. but it would be dead even that way. you cant say its fair to separate maia from wonderboy if there is "no working", but its not fair to force a neutral clinich in the middle of the cage if wonderboy isnt "working".

hypothetical scenario but one i feel fits
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i get what you're saying but have no idea how something like that would even work ha
but your point i underlined does seem valid.

and i did think last nights separation between usman and maia was unwarranted.

and also, last night the referees wouldn't STFU about fighters "holding" the cage when they weren't even holding.
 
Th3Sav4ge said:
rules are even in my book maybe a slight edge towards striking. you cant say the rules are for grappling when grapplers can get stood up or separated, and each round starts standing.

there is no penalty for non effective "striking". they wont force a clinch or ground position, but they will stand a fight up or separate.
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Stand ups are made only when a fighter is stalling and not doing anything, in the stand up if you stall (aka run) in the cage you will get a warning way faster than a wrestler that is in the top position but not doing anything.
 
Tabarnakos said:
Maybe not but he was still the best wrestler in the division for years and used his wrestling quite often.

So technically he is not a wrestler per se as he has an excellent overall game but it was still one of his best asset and iit helped him win quite a few fights.
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THAT, was my point.......
 
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