If you think Khabib won´t be champ because of his striking, you probably don´t remember this guy.

Khabib can be champ. but you are comparing two different eras of the UFC.
 
I agree that Dennis Hallman would tap khabib out in 30 seconds, twice
 
mkess101 said:
0-2, 1-1, 4-3, 0-0

Unless the info I got is wrong (I don't think it is), those are the records of Khabib's 11-15th opponents (where do you see him fighting someone with 20+ pro fights after his 10th fight?--aside from the 27-22 guy). Then like you said his 16th had 49 pro fights (27-22). The guy with the 4-3 record I can agree that (depending on who he'd fought, how they went, etc) you could POSSIBLY argue was "on Khabib's level". The other 3 guys? C'mon. If you've won 10 straight fights to start your career and then fight a guy who's 0-2 against other regional fighters, you aren't fighting a guy "on your level". Same as if you are 11-0 and he's 1-1. Or esp if you're 14-0 and he hasn't fought yet!

Again, I am NOT saying this was a bad or shady way to bring Khabib along. His camp's focus was to turn him into the best fighter he could be and make his career arc toward being the best in the world. You can't argue it so far, right? But that's a totally different discussion than whether his record is padded. It is, and I don't think there's any denying it, but I also don't really think it matters. He's stepped up and beaten legit top level guys now, so whatever they did with him in bringing him along has worked.

And no, it's not the same as guys who got to the top and THEN padded their records, I totally agree. Khabib won't do that, and the UFC wouldn't let him even if he wanted to (and he wouldn't, it's not how he's wired).

The whole point of my post was not to bash Khabib at all. It was just to give context to his record.

Edit: The guy with 20+ fights you meant Khalibov I think. Yeah that was his 10th or 11th fight. Obviously that's a good fight for him at that point. It's the next 4 guys that probably had no business being in there with him. Again, it's worked, so who am I to say he shouldn't have fought them. But it's padding a record, plain and simple.
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When a guy has been fighting 2 years and even though he's 10-0 and winning each fight after to 15-0 in Khabibs case is not getting drastically better like guys are in the UFC from fight to fight because he's just fighting every 3 months and not in a pro camp. So him being 10-0 and then 15-0, its not really a different fighter. We cant look at Khabibs record and start saying its padded because he's fighting guys 0-2 and 4-3 because he himself is still a developing fighter. Even though he's had 10+ wins half of those came in two nights so him being undefeated doesnt make him some high level guy.....how legit is that 10-0 after two years when 5 wins come in two nights? he's still developing at that point. ....you wanted him to fight more experienced guys, well he did and you saw their records.

ANyways.....call it what you want. Leave it at that.
 
JKS said:
When a guy has been fighting 2 years and even though he's 10-0 and winning each fight after to 15-0 in Khabibs case is not getting drastically better like guys are in the UFC from fight to fight because he's just fighting every 3 months and not in a pro camp. So him being 10-0 and then 15-0, its not really a different fighter. We cant look at Khabibs record and start saying its padded because he's fighting guys 0-2 and 4-3 because he himself is still a developing fighter. Even though he's had 10+ wins half of those came in two nights so him being undefeated doesnt make him some high level guy.....how legit is that 10-0 after two years when 5 wins come in two nights? he's still developing at that point. ....you wanted him to fight more experienced guys, well he did and you saw their records.

ANyways.....call it what you want. Leave it at that.
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But 4-5 fights per year isn't some insanely busy schedule is it? That seems to be what you're saying. And even if he's fighting those fights in a short span and then having a layoff, unless he's hurt (don't think he was back then?) he's still training. Which is where the big gains come.

Anyway, good discussion. We see it a bit differently, but nothing wrong with that.
 
Kung Fu bb said:
Unidimensional fighter like Hughes, Ortiz and others were extremely successful back then.

Unidimensional fighters like Conor, Khabib, Maia and others are still extremely successful nowadays despite your "fighters are better everywhere it´s a new era" thing.

The comparison is good, your argument is a bad one.
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His argument is fine, you're just exaggerating your point.

Maia is the only true exception to the bunch. McGregor is better on the ground than either Hughes or Ortiz were on the feet. And Khabib is better on the feet than either Hughes or Ortiz, and he certainly pairs his striking far better with his grappling than either of those guys did by a LONG SHOT.

So Conor and Khabib are hardly good examples to your cause. And secondly, if you can't tell fighters are better everywhere at LW and WW than they were in the early 2000s, you're blind. You are literally reaching on both topic points to make your opinion. There are glaring holes in your argument that you simply refuse to acknowledge.

I mean, there is a reason the two main people who have backed you up in this thread are Trump supporters.
 
ShreddinMMA said:
His argument is fine, you're just exaggerating your point.

Maia is the only true exception to the bunch. McGregor is better on the ground than either Hughes or Ortiz were on the feet. And Khabib is better on the feet than either Hughes or Ortiz, and he certainly pairs his striking far better with his grappling than either of those guys did by a LONG SHOT.

So Conor and Khabib are hardly good examples to your cause. And secondly, if you can't tell fighters are better everywhere at LW and WW than they were in the early 2000s, you're blind. You are literally reaching on both topic points to make your opinion. There are glaring holes in your argument that you simply refuse to acknowledge.

I mean, there is a reason the two main people who have backed you up in this thread are Trump supporters.
Click to expand...
TLDR... You´re trying too hard kid.
 
ShreddinMMA said:
Man, now you're running too?

This is the most pathetic display I've seen on Sherdog in awhile.
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You really have nothing to add at all, you´re over 20 posts complaining about a simple comparison you failed to understand and you want to impose your view on others... Please show where I said that there´s no evolution with time, or where I said the circumstances and the fighters are identical and exactly the same, show me where I said these, please.... You can´t, right? It´s because I just compared aspects of it, but you´re nitpicking, like an annoying kid.
 
Kung Fu bb said:
You really have nothing to add at all, you´re over 20 posts complaining about a simple comparison you failed to understand and you want to impose your view on others... Please show where I said that there´s no evolution with time, or where I said the circumstances and the fighters are identical and exactly the same, show me where I said these, please.... You can´t, right? It´s because I just compared aspects of it, but you´re nitpicking, like an annoying kid.
Click to expand...

Please show where I said that there´s no evolution with time, or where I said the circumstances and the fighters are identical and exactly the same, show me where I said these, please.... You can´t, right? It´s because I just compared aspects of it, but you´re nitpicking, like an annoying kid.
Click to expand...

Lol. Now you're salty. Calm down, no need to get upset over a bit of critical objection.

I ask you, where did I say any of those things? I said they were in different eras. I said the fighters in those divisions are better everywhere than their former counter parts. I didn't say any of what you're going on about.

I'm hardly nitpicking. I'm directly challenging your careless exaggerations. Matt Hughes in 2004 has literally no relevance to Khabib in 2017, other than that they have a similar style they use effectively. Hell, even their style of grappling is notably different. Their entire style top to bottom are different, other than the fact they are predominantly grapplers.

Basically, you're pulling conclusions from a single, stretched example. And now you're whining because you don't like me calling it out.

If you don't care/ don't like it, then don't reply. You don't get some award for getting the last post. We're on fucking Sherdog.
 
ShreddinMMA said:
Lol. Now you're salty. Calm down, no need to get upset over a bit of critical objection.

I ask you, where did I say any of those things? I said they were in different eras. I said the fighters in those divisions are better everywhere than their former counter parts. I didn't say any of what you're going on about.

I'm hardly nitpicking. I'm directly challenging your careless exaggerations. Matt Hughes in 2004 has literally no relevance to Khabib in 2017, other than that they have a similar style they use effectively. Hell, even their style of grappling is notably different. Their entire style top to bottom are different, other than the fact they are predominantly grapplers.

Basically, you're pulling conclusions from a single, stretched example. And now you're whining because you don't like me calling it out.

If you don't care/ don't like it, then don't reply. You don't get some award for getting the last post. We're on fucking Sherdog.
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No argument = you´re salty, emotional, blah blah blah.... lol
 
Kung Fu bb said:
No argument = you´re salty, emotional, blah blah blah.... lol
Click to expand...

giphy.gif
 
Kung Fu bb said:
All I care about is years, not ufc editions. But carry on with your "multiple eras apart" thing.
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This is a sport. Kinda. I..... guess......


Era moves faster then at a desk job.

Hughes is now a memory of a time long past.
 
MirRocksFedor said:
This is a sport. Kinda. I..... guess......


Era moves faster then at a desk job.

Hughes is now a memory of a time long past.
Click to expand...
That was Hughes, BJ en nem Era
Then there was Alves, Fitch, and those dudes Era
Big Rig Era
Bald Kettlebell Rogan Era...

<Fedor23>
 
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