How much running should I do?

Discussion in 'Standup Technique' started by Snolla, Sep 8, 2017.

  1. Snolla Purple Belt

    Snolla
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    I have an MMA match in two months. I've never fought MMA. I have fought grappling tournaments and 1 kickboxing match. My gas stayed with me through all of that without running.

    However I want to guarantee my gas tank in this MMA match so it's not even a question in my mind. Is a 10 kilometer run daily or every other day good enough preparation? (on top of regular training sessions of course).

    It's amatuer so it is only three 3min rounds

    I hate running, and I think leaving my comfort zone will do wonders for my cardio and confidence.
     
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  2. Frode Falch Gold Belt

    Frode Falch
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    Do sprints instead
     
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  3. Sinister Doctor of Doom

    Sinister
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    All of it. Do all the running.
     
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  4. Snolla Purple Belt

    Snolla
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    Luckily for me I have a 400 meter track around the block from my place :)
    I can do some sprints there to exhaustion
     
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  5. busybroker Banned

    busybroker
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    About three - fifty
     
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  6. Azam Purple Belt

    Azam
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    Roadwork is a necessity.

    Either do running or cycling.

    Personally I do cycling - it's easier on the knees.
     
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  7. j123 Pro Sherdogger 500-0-1

    j123
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    Do both, you need to work both energy systems, mistakes I made starting out was doing one or the other and gassed in both instances.

    Starting out I did the traditional slow & steady style. 5-8km x 5 days.
    I gassed out in the 2nd round because I was not prepared for the sprint that was 3 x 2min.

    I did the opposite for the next camp, only sprints. Come fight night, I gassed hard on the 3rd, but it was a draw and they gave a 4th which at that point I was like Conor v May in round 10.

    Once I alternated them, things got alot better. Didn't gas out anymore.

    Long distance running helps with the overall cardio for the total volume of rounds. Whereas short bursts like sprints and HIIT will work on the duration for each of the rounds. Can't do one without the other. I've done a mixture but really it didn't do much. When I say mixture, I mean say I'm doing a 6km run, but every other block I'd sprint for 50-100m (or 4-8 parked cars / stop signs -- I run outside)

    Keep in mind, the shorter the round, the more intense and sprint like it will be, even if you're a calm individual, the pacing is extremely fast and intense, and will be more than anything you've done before. With longer rounds, you can pace it more.

    another thing to keep in mind, train your rounds as the same duration as your fight. Don't be training in 5-10min rounds when you're competing in 3 mins, you'll get used to a certain pace, and it's going to throw you off big time come fight night. My issue starting out was when I was doing my first MT event, there wasn't much of us doing it, and I was training alongside the MMA guys who did 5s. It fucked me over big time.

    Fucking is easier on the knees as well... most of the time that is
     
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  8. a guy Black Belt

    a guy
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    This. It's important to train both aerobically and anaerobically. Neglecting either one will give you a different kind of cardio issue.
     
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  9. Uchi Mata Gold Belt

    Uchi Mata
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    This is really good advice. If you're curious on the science of it TS, you can read Joel Jamieson's stuff on the differing training effects of LSD and sprinting. Long story short, you need both, but you'll get much quicker adaptation and gains from the sprinting than the LSD stuff. LSD over time enlarges your heart (in a good way), but that's not an overnight effect.

    Personally, I think the biggest mistake people often make is bifurcating their skills training and conditioning when in camp. It's true that when you don't have a fight coming up you should sacrifice some physical rigor in your training to concentrate on skills development, but if you're in camp your skills training should be very intense conditioning training as well. Your pad rounds and grappling drilling should be high intensity, and you should constantly be pushing yourself as hard as you can there for both physical and mental conditioning. And I agree on the round times. If you're fighting 3s and you're training 5s, you're going to develop a 5 minute pace that's inappropriate for 3 3 minute rounds; that's true not only from a conditioning perspective, but also from an urgency perspective. You have to score in those 3 minutes, you can't afford to take 20 seconds off a few times a round and expect to win a decision.
     
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  10. j123 Pro Sherdogger 500-0-1

    j123
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    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Yeah thats normal, we all pretty much have done an AM (cond) and PM (skillwork) type schedule. Good point on using grinding as S&C, wrestling drills off the fence is one of the most grueling methods out there, and its not even primarily a S&C drill.

    Looking back at the early days, things were pretty unbelievable, the gym small so we didn't have a ring or cage, and all sparring was done on the mats in an open area. Come fight night when I got ring cut into the corner and tried to get out it was: "WTF, wthat's this corner thing doing here?"

    Oh man 20 seconds in 2min rounds is like an eternity. We all hear the joke about stuff like "You'd get KO'd in 10 seconds!" as a bad thing, but looking at it, 10 seconds is hella long. You can fire off a 1,2,3,kick combo in less than 2 seconds.

    I found that being pushed out of your rhythm and hastily trying to catch up is when we gas. We expect to throw something, and step out casually, but once they get in your face, you get a bit shocked, and trying to "catch-up", yeah thats when your breathing pace is thrown off and it gets out of control there. It happens in padwork as well.
     
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  11. Sano Brown Belt

    Sano
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    Running is the best choice for MMA, and especially striking. You get weightbearing cardio, which is not quite the same as a bike or swimming, and more importantly you use your feet and lower body in a way that's a lot more sport specific towards actually using them when moving around in a fight. The issue with running however is bad mechanics and overuse injuries.

    You have to build up to it, you have to learn to run well, with good technique. Using your feet and absorbing the forces in a controlled manner, not just coming crashing down on each step with knees, ankles and hips all over the place. I'd alternate running/walking at first. Run untill your forms starts to faulter, then walk a little bit, then run again and repeat. In time you'd be able to run a long time with good form. If you're already good at running then just do the running.

    Running is #1 in my book, but sometimes it needs to be modified, or used alongside something that is easier on the joints, or worst case scenario replaced with another (non-weightbearing) exercise. Adjust accordingly.
     
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  12. Ilk Orange Belt

    Ilk
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    6 times per week is your goal if you are going professional. 1 hour or more of LISS at least 3 times a week and 2-3 days of the week go on different types sprinting. As for fighters 3-5 mins sprints with 1 min rest. Now that is the optimal goal for pro fighting. As Sano noted rotating with other activities that is not so hard on the joint when possible. I love swimming for example. And I think swimming is very nice on developing shoulder endurance too.

    However you start slow - 3 times a week 30 mins is what you aim at first. This is what I was adviced from numerous posters when I asked about running half an year ago here.

    I would not advice going wild if you fight in 2 months. You will not make a huge progress for 2 months. Perhaps try the 3 times a week 30 mins to add it to your usual routine.
     
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  13. AndyMaBobs Purple Belt

    AndyMaBobs
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    Have you ever tried swimming sprints? Because I found that helped me quite a bit.
     
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  14. j123 Pro Sherdogger 500-0-1

    j123
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    This is a reason why I don't recommend running more than 6km especially if people are doing 5-6 days of it.

    I started feeling knee problems from it hitting 5km x 5 days. Plenty of others I've trained with advocate for the traditional methods of excess cardio: 8-10km and they all came back with knee problems. Until the technique is solid, you should ease up on the duration. It's the same approach like lifting, people trying to hit PRs (time) each session, and sacrificing form.
     
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  15. Snolla Purple Belt

    Snolla
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    Wow, thank you so much everyone. Great advice in here that has helped me re-think my training style
     
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  16. freaky Black Belt

    freaky
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    Run until you're tired. Doesn't matter if it's 10km if you gas after 1km. And doesn't matter if 50km if at the end of it you're barely breaking a sweat. Everyone's cardio is different. Run until you're tired.

    Which would take forever if you're taking your pace. I also suggest sprints. Do 1 or 2 block full speed sprint then 1-2 block of moderate jogging to slow down your heart and sprint again.
     
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  17. ctrlaltdelete Purple Belt

    ctrlaltdelete
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    Do 6 miles 2 - 3 times a week on your non training days.

    or 2 - 3 miles after training.

    Always run with your mouthguard in.
     
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  18. Ilk Orange Belt

    Ilk
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    Hey I am doing this right now. I have a hard time finding time to train but a couple of days a week I can train while on the beach with my fioncee. I found out that I do 100 meters for about 3 mins more or less. So what I do is do 6 rounds of 100 meters with a 1 min rest in between. I do that about 3 times for the days as we hang out a lot on the beach. So works very fine in keeping some fitness levels.
     
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  19. Sano Brown Belt

    Sano
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    Exactly. Also everyone is different. Guys who has been running with great technique since a young age and who are light, might have a much easier time than some lumbering HW getting into boxing with no real running experience. We're not all the same.

    I'd say 10km each day is waaay too much, but that's my take. I'd cut it down a lot, build the technique and add in a few knee stabilising and hamstring exercises. Ultimately it depends on your threshold.

    There's been some talk in recent times about running being bad and it replaced with other forms of cardio. I still feel running is the best option without a doubt, but it just has to be managed right and make sense. I'm talking about long distance running here, which again you CANNOT replace with sprints.
     
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    Last edited: Sep 11, 2017
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  20. j123 Pro Sherdogger 500-0-1

    j123
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    It is way too much, but its how they've been training. to me 10km is essentially starting marathon distance, my thoughts on hearing that is why do that? I'm training for a fight, not a marathon, yeah may help, but 3 x 2min is a completely different ball park than 10km. Everytime you question them, you get back: "but the Thais do it".

    I do well with 5km, once in a blue moon I end up hitting 6. The whole point of S&C is to supplement your skillwork, no point if its pulling you out and injuring you.

    I find running to be the best as well, and outdoors at that. I'm able to work my heart and legs equally, compared to cycling where my legs burn out before I get the same amount of work done on my heartrate. Treadmill for me is too inaccurate, especially my gauge is by distance not speed.

    Unfortunately when winter strolls down the block I have to use other methods, I usually end up skipping. I'm thinking of trying out swimming as its easier on the joints, and fun + a chance to mack Boise dimes at the right pool. I remember one time in Feb 2 years ago when it was -30 Celsius and dumbass me decided it was fine to still run. No problem, I have clothing and gear that'll keep me warm, and I warm up along the way.
    Woke up at 5:30 AM, and literally 5 steps into the run I nearly KO myself slipping on black ice, then it was "NOPE".
     
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