Discussion in 'The War Room' started by KBE6EKCTAH_CCP, Aug 12, 2017.
TS wants us to believe based on what??
fuck sakes man... links to a source or fuck off.
You are not a rookie at this. Get your shit together.
Yeah but you do see the difference between Obama saying that about Syria and not doing anything when it happens.
To Trump tweeting stuff and being called out on it a few hours later.
I mean Obama was aware he was drawing a red line. Trump didn't even realize it. That is the danger.
The criticism is not about Trump taking a harder stance or upset NK. The criticism is about that he didn't fully understand what he was actually doing.
His own generals and advisers didn't know he would tweet that stuff out. And Trump didn't know he just draw a red line.
The US can threaten whoever they want if they think that is the best strategy.
The issue is that Trump doesn't have a strategy or he doesn't understand it. It's the level of incompetence that gets criticized.
Not the harder stance on NK.
I don't really see it tbh. My point wasn't that previous presidents drew red lines as well, my point was that they drew red lines which were crossed and didn't act.
Yes, and they should be criticized for that.
But Trump drew a red line and didn't act after it was crossed so he should get the same criticism for that other presidents did.
And in addition, he should be criticized for not knowing he drew a red line. Having it crossed within a few hours. Because it was such a stupidly red line.
Not having discussed it with any of his generals or adviser at all just decided to tweet it out.
(assuming this isn't another 4D Trump chess move, but I don't get the feeling).
That is why he gets so harshly criticized here. It's the level of incompetence.
Trump will absolutely have the last laugh with regard to Europe.
They've gone full potato.
At first I thought it was just hypocrisy. These guys were OK when Bill Clinton was speaking against illegals from Mexico, or when Obama wanted a travel ban.
The more and more I talk to these people in the real world, the more I realize it's not hypocrisy. Most of them are very unaware of what the previous administrations have said or done. Their political awareness prior to this circus of an election was non-existent, and they just jumped on the bandwagon because it dominated all media.
trump is being reckless.
even if you intend to use military action against NK, its F'ing universally stupid to verbally provoke such a country. to paint yourself in such a diplomatic corner.
Its not just the Euro media, it's pretty much anyone leaning left. I don't really approve of Trump or his rhetoric, but the left is acting like that is the problem in this situation and not the monsters that run NK and their enablers in China. Once again we see them heaping blame on a Republican president but ignoring the fact that the Norks have been acting this way for decades. Obama and Clinton did nothing to improve the situation and they arguably did things to extend the duration of the problem. I'm not saying there are any easy answers here but pretending that Trump is the problem is very dishonest.
No, Kim and NK are predictable lunatics. @snakedafunky was correct on this, you don't tweet out challenges to dictators unless you're willing to back your language with action. If you're not willing to act, the tweet makes you look like an empty suit and will provoke more action from them because they don't believe you'll do anything. If you are willing to act then you'd better be prepared for the actual real fall out of those actions.
No one is excusing NK from being, well, NK. But Trump shouldn't play their game, it makes him look weak.
Extremely hot take: maybe NK is bad and Trump is also a pants shitting retard who isn't helping things
It will be funny if Kim becomes a hero in the media.
Wtf are we (USA) going to do with China backing them up? NK is all about posturing and little infractions that are not enough to warrant anything but another round of sanctions.
And then Trump draws this stupid line by threatening "fire and fury" over threats which NK has been doing for decades. Now we look like tools because they immediately crossed it and now we like "DO IT AGAIN! I dare u!!". Trump is an amateur and it makes us look amateurish..
The world has been laughing at us. The world doesn't respect Trump and therefore they don't respect USA...
No source for MSM in Europe saying Trump is a lunatic and villian?
Kim has not made concrete threats to use WMD's on US soil. You read something wrong, somewhere. He said he'd dump 4 missiles into the ocean 30-40km from Guam.
Lol. World politics is a big power struggle, you don't earn respect by handling situations in a passive manner (most cultures take that as a sign of weakness); that was evident with Obama when other countries would not even roll out the red carpet, the stairs on the tarmac, or bother sending government officials to greet him at the airport... he was treated like a joke because you don't earn respect handling your affairs in an impotent way. They may not have been laughing out through public media since they were benefiting from his actions, but I guarantee it was being done in private.
The way diplomacy is conducted in Europe is not the same as it is in East Asia with regards to acts of aggression. That is being overlooked, as if there's a one-size-fit-all solution for everything. The European style has been implemented on North Korea and China for decades now... and their response has been to take advantage of it; it doesn't work basically.
Because East Asian politics can be more primal in nature, the two sides will usually size each other up, make threatening gestures, with neither being expected to back down. Similar to how in the animal kingdom, animals try to show they're bigger, badder, exchange warning roars, do a few fake charges... all that posturing works to avoid a fatal battle, with both ultimately retiring having not fought out their differences.
North Korea is testing Trump. If he were to use Obama's method: issue a few vague statements, 'we call for calm', 'we will defend our allies', etc., and ultimately do nothing... that's how you get disrespect, they will take that as a sign that you have no balls. Trump is using the correct strategy to deal with them for once. When you have power, and show you are not afraid to use it, people are forced to respect you, even the most crazy ones.
The diplomatic corner is North Korea having nukes and ICBMs. Doing the opposite of what Trump is doing is what led to that diplomatic corner.
Why don't we just do the same things China's doing? Why don't we just start building artificial islands in the seas there? Why don't we start arming third world countries with nukes?
I think that's the way to get China to reverse their course of action.
After all, if they can do these things and get away with it.. why wouldn't they? I would too.
I don't see how people don't get this.
China's building artificial islands to expand territory in contested waters.. Arming Stalinist third world states with nukes -- and allowing them to have chemical, biological weapons. Meanwhile we have very responsible allies in SK and Japan and won't even allow them to build conventional explosives over 1000 lbs or field an offensive military...
Why aren't we building artificial islands? Why don't we remove the caps on Japan's and SK's militaries and give them nukes, biological, and chemical weapons? Why aren't we arming 3rd world countries with nukes like China is doing?
Trump was right: we have the entire deck of cards in our favor but we're losing because we don't play any of them.
ok fine I ll find links tomorrow. But they ll be in German and French so nobody here will fuckin read them.
If you go right now on
you will find them. Because they are there.
I could ask you to just take my word for it, to which you would respond "fuck you", which is fair game, so I ll link the damn articles which you won t read.
Separate names with a comma.