Do you think boxing handled the Fury humiliation well?

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

lol "smashed a surging Vera" that is hilarious to anyone who saw that fight, it was nearly a draw, and Vera was a false prophet, he was never good even at LHW; that should have been a squash match. The point is that when Tim fought him, he was terrible, and his 10 ranking was only a holdover from when he actually had significant wins, he never was ranked again after that, and it was at that time that he sucked, not really any way to argue that.

A 50 year old boxer that had been training heavily could easily beat the bump on the log that was Timmy. He stood there with a fat body that could hardly move. And yes, being medically compromised is a lot worse.

A top college wrestler could have beat Mercer in that fight by doing what Randy did against Toney- go for a low single and get him down where he is helpless, and finish from there.

Correct. Tim beat a surging undefeated Vera. At the time nobody was riding more hype than that guy. He looked sensational up until that point and was coming off of a 1st round knockout of Mir. That was a virtuoso performance.

But those who mostly punch in MMA still have some kind of ground game, which makes it difficult for someone with zero ground game- that gets into the early UFCs. If the MMA fighter played it smart, they would almost always win. Especially if they were someone like Frank- first boxing match and he puts the champ on his ass.

So the MMA fighter just needs to take the helpless boxer down then? After that they'll get full mount and it's over. Seems simple enough in theory.

 

[rottenapple]

Fury's performance might just prove to be as good as it gets vs Ngannou. Lets just see how other HW boxers handle getting hit by ngannou. We know Fury's chin is quite solid after the wilder fights. Noone else ever got back up after taking wilders best shots. So leys see how other boxers deal with his power. In the UFC only stipe could take multiple shots from ngannou, the rest almost all went down the first time he connected. AJ def should not take any shots clean with his chin. Ngannou is just a super freak, has nothing to do with mma vs boxing.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

Fury's performance might just prove to be as good as it gets vs Ngannou. Lets just see how other HW boxers handle getting hit by ngannou. We know Fury's chin is quite solid after the wilder fights. Noone else ever got back up after taking wilders best shots. So leys see how other boxers deal with his power. In the UFC only stipe could take multiple shots from ngannou, the rest almost all went down the first time he connected. AJ def should not take any shots clean with his chin. Ngannou is just a super freak, has nothing to do with mma vs boxing.

Fury's chin itself isn't that solid. He's been dropped by guys that couldn't punch their way out of a wet paper bag. It's his recovery that's special. His ability to constantly get back up to his feet and without showing any ill effects.

Like you mentioned Joshua shouldn't take Ngannou's power on the chin but the same is true for Ngannou. He's never been punched as hard as Joshua will hit him. Ngannou claims that Fury was the hardest hitter he's ever fought and that's including his MMA opponents that were wearing 4 oz gloves. Joshua hits way harder than Fury does. The difference in power between those two is frightening.

 

[borntoloseNOT]

I dont admire fury but I did think he was a sign of hope for the division. And also, I'm tired of guys like you raving about some canelo or Inouye and me seeing them and being unimpressed. You're right that the sport has changed hegemony but it's also taken a serious nosedive in quality. That's the part you guys just can't see a cant be told about.

Nah I see it, I get it, but idk man I cant just watch the replays forever, I gotta see it live and current to feel it and being in the moment. I try and just WATCH THE FIGHTS man, like I mean the undercards and the smaller cards or events that aren’t ppv, and just going into some boxing knowing nothing about either guy. They aren’t all good, but sometimes even journeymen can put on an interesting clash of styles.

 

[borntoloseNOT]

I mean I don’t think boxing was that humiliated. A clearly out of shape Fury got up almost instantly and won the fight. Did exactly what he was supposed to do, and probably will show up better prepared for Usyk though I still doubt he wins…

Hey did YOU EVER HEAR OF THIS GUY RAY MERCER????

 

[mozfonky]

Nah I see it, I get it, but idk man I cant just watch the replays forever, I gotta see it live and current to feel it and being in the moment. I try and just WATCH THE FIGHTS man, like I mean the undercards and the smaller cards or events that aren’t ppv, and just going into some boxing knowing nothing about either guy. They aren’t all good, but sometimes even journeymen can put on an interesting clash of styles.

I understand that, which is why I loved the wilder fights, I knew they weren't great fighters but they were entertaining. Also, frustrating because you're watching what no one would consider real craft a few years ago. At any rate, there are a trillion old fights that I haven't seen. I was just looking at a couple arguello fights and I could see a bunch on the side that I never saw.

 

[PBAC]

Mercer went with a rock paper scissors and threw the best punch a boxer can against a much taller fighter. He chose wisely early. That's all that happened.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

Mercer went with a rock paper scissors and threw the best punch a boxer can against a much taller fighter. He chose wisely early. That's all that happened.

He caught Tim cold because he knew he needed to get him out of there early. Same thing Dillian Whyte did to his MMA opponent. Ended the fight in a matter of seconds.

 

[ferrisjso]

Do you think MMA handled the Sylvia situation well?

That was different for a bunch of reasons.

Mercer had been demolished by Kimbo already.

 

[tomjones]

If Fury loses to Sylvia and Joshua beats Ngannou, then boxing fans will come to terms with it very easily.

 

[TheGreatA]

I think everybody's known that the sport is half a work after May vs Pac.

 

[Doctor Grudge]

Tim lost his UFC title to Randy in 2007. He fought Mercer in 2009. That's only a couple years removed from him being UFC champion. Not three. Those recent losses that Tim took prior to fighting Mercer were also against the era's best heavyweights (Big Nog, Fedor, and an ATG Couture).

I mean...UFC champion does not mean best. Tim Sylvia was not the "Tyson Fury" of MMA. Not even close lol.

Sylvia was probably closer to the Ray Mercer of MMA, ironically enough.

 

[ferrisjso]

Tim lost his UFC title to Randy in 2007. He fought Mercer in 2009. That's only a couple years removed from him being UFC champion. Not three. Those recent losses that Tim took prior to fighting Mercer were also against the era's best heavyweights (Big Nog, Fedor, and an ATG Couture).

First off Kimbo beat Mercer before that fight easily removing any illusion that the Sylvia KO was anything more than a fluke. Mercer did not outfight Sylvia in MMA he landed a swing before Sylvia tried anything.

In MMA the best big fighters go to LHW or MW. HW doesn't have the status in MMA it does in boxing. Quite the contrary it is known as the division where fighters only have the cardio to last 1 round and for having the lowest skills. And Sylvias reign is known as the weakest said weak division ever got.


In 2002 Randy lost his last 2 title fights at HW(which initially was good because most of MMA was transitioning from an OW system). Then in 2006 he lost his last 2 at LHW before retiring. Couture came back at 43 or 44 specifically because he could beat Sylvia.

The UFC HW division was horrible. Ricco and Barnett had left then Mir got an accident. Mir, Arlovski and Randy were not the 3 best HWs of that era. Barnett was the best UFC HW of that period IMO it was probably him Cro Cop and Fedor. Big Nog was the worst of Prides big 3 tbh he was a leftover of the pre weight class days.

 

[Dr Fong]

Correct. Tim beat a surging undefeated Vera. At the time nobody was riding more hype than that guy. He looked sensational up until that point and was coming off of a 1st round knockout of Mir. That was a virtuoso performance.

So the MMA fighter just needs to take the helpless boxer down then? After that they'll get full mount and it's over. Seems simple enough in theory.

You know full well that the guy who embarrassingly got knocked out from mount was a fellow boxer in his MMA debut. Neither is any more or less an 'MMA fighter' than the other.

It's a very strange and disingenuous argument that something incredibly rare and embarrassing happening to a clearly inexperienced boxer in his MMA debut is somehow evidence of a weakness in MMA.

It also shows how inexperienced Glowacki was that he got so quickly mounted by a fellow boxer - suggests he would have been fucked vs a grappler. So also doesn't help whatever point it is you think you are making.

If you think it's generally a great idea to just start throwing shots while being mounted against actual experienced opponents, you're not winning points in a boxing vs MMA internet shitfight, you're just exposing a high level of ignorance about combat sports.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

You know full well that the guy who embarrassingly got knocked out from mount was a fellow boxer in his MMA debut. Neither is any more or less an 'MMA fighter' than the other.

It's a very strange and disingenuous argument that something incredibly rare and embarrassing happening to a clearly inexperienced boxer in his MMA debut is somehow evidence of a weakness in MMA.

It also shows how inexperienced Glowacki was that he got so quickly mounted by a fellow boxer - suggests he would have been fucked vs a grappler. So also doesn't help whatever point it is you think you are making.

If you think it's generally a great idea to just start throwing shots while being mounted against actual experienced opponents, you're not winning points in a boxing vs MMA internet shitfight, you're just exposing a high level of ignorance about combat sports.

Both were training MMA at that point. Full mount is a standard position in the sport. We can just totally ignore the evidence of just how dangerous a boxer can be from bottom mount and dismiss it altogether. Now that'd be disingenuous.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

First off Kimbo beat Mercer before that fight easily removing any illusion that the Sylvia KO was anything more than a fluke. Mercer did not outfight Sylvia in MMA he landed a swing before Sylvia tried anything.

In MMA the best big fighters go to LHW or MW. HW doesn't have the status in MMA it does in boxing. Quite the contrary it is known as the division where fighters only have the cardio to last 1 round and for having the lowest skills. And Sylvias reign is known as the weakest said weak division ever got.


In 2002 Randy lost his last 2 title fights at HW(which initially was good because most of MMA was transitioning from an OW system). Then in 2006 he lost his last 2 at LHW before retiring. Couture came back at 43 or 44 specifically because he could beat Sylvia.

The UFC HW division was horrible. Ricco and Barnett had left then Mir got an accident. Mir, Arlovski and Randy were not the 3 best HWs of that era. Barnett was the best UFC HW of that period IMO it was probably him Cro Cop and Fedor. Big Nog was the worst of Prides big 3 tbh he was a leftover of the pre weight class days.

Mercer's KO over Tim was no fluke. He got hit by a former world champion boxer flush on the chin. Nobody should be surprised that he got knocked out. Kimbo did beat Mercer in an exhibition. The mid 40s version of Mercer. Not that impressive when you look at it objectively.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

I mean...UFC champion does not mean best. Tim Sylvia was not the "Tyson Fury" of MMA. Not even close lol.

Sylvia was probably closer to the Ray Mercer of MMA, ironically enough.

Where did I say that Tim was the Tyson Fury of MMA? That's a straw man. The difference is that Tyson Fury actually beat Ngannou while Mercer beat Tim.

 

[TheGreatA]

Sylvia was like the geek who held a WBO belt and lost the moment he fought someone with a pulse (although Couture wasn't supposed to have a pulse at that point). UFC HW division was trash back then, still is.

Honestly I wasn't surprised in the least bit when he got smoked by Mercer. Say whatever you want about Mercer, the guy fought in an actual legitimate era of heavyweights. Old or not he had more striking ability in his pinky finger than Sylvia in his whole body.

Fury on the other hand is more of a sports entertainer that has barely fought any real, well-trained combat athletes apart from Ngannou and an old Klitschko. Didn't really surprise me that he got roughed up by a guy who didn't subscribe to the "gentleman rules" of celebrity boxing, like accepting clinches and not punching out of a clinch. It was only midway through the contest that Fury realized Ngannou wasn't in there to "work" but to fight.

 

[Deaths Head]

That was different for a bunch of reasons.

Mercer had been demolished by Kimbo already.

Kimbo was a MMA bout .

Sylvia was a striking only match or supposed to be agreed striking only bc originally it was supposed to be a boxing match they couldn’t get sanctioned, I remember Mercer going for the takedown while Tim was going down and he hit him with a second punch on top of him .

 

[TheGreatA]

Kimbo was a MMA bout .

Sylvia was a striking only match or supposed to be agreed striking only bc originally it was supposed to be a boxing match they couldn’t get sanctioned, I remember Mercer going for the takedown while Tim was going down and he hit him with a second punch on top of him .

From what I understand, Sylvia had agreed not to use kicks on the feet. But he started off the fight with a leg kick, which pissed off Mercer, and Ray decided to lay him out.

It was probably supposed to be an exhibition of sorts but Sylvia fucked it up.