Another Reason to Hate Millennials - Rated Worst Tippers

[Rygu]

It would appear central to your argument that the tip isn't really optional, no? If it truly were, then it wouldn't harm wait staff when they didn't get one.

That's not true. I've eaten out in Europe. They don't tip there, and the cost is factored into the meal and through other charges. In Italy, they charge you to have a white tablecloth (which are on all their tables at nice restaurants), you are charged for restrooms, for water, and other things that we might view as complimentary here in the States. I wouldn't mind if they just charged more for the food and called it a day.

Your logic appears to be circular. If you eat out, then tip. If you don't tip, you're taking money away from the wait staff. The tip is how we keep costs down, but it's not really how we keep costs down because it's not really optional.

I tip because those are social norms, but they aren't very good norms. It's an inherently flawed process that leads to people getting stiffed out of a few bucks arbitrarily (some people are cheap, regardless of quality of the service), and it relies on the customer to determine the real cost of the good versus the advertised cost of the good.

They charge for bathroom usage in Italy?

 

[xcvbn]

Guaranteed 90% of the people bitching itt about millennials are millennials themselves.

Years 1981-1999
Ages 19-37

Fuck the baby boomers for giving millennials the worst economy is a century. Gen X dodged a bullet so you guys shouldn't be saying shit.

 

[sub_thug]

These tipping threads have been going on forever in here. What's funny is that morons didn't think the average restaurant would raise prices 20% or more back then. Well now there are a ton of restaurants that abolished tipping, and guess what, it's 20% or more increase.

Now the new thing to do is say "I don't care if I pay more, I just like it better without tipping". It's one of the strangest arguments. You'd rather pay 20% or more even with bad service? It's similar to the idiots who prefer tax refunds because they prefer the government to save their money for them rather than handling it themselves.

Agreed on restaurants charging more these days. But that's why I don't go out to eat much, as I don't want to pay $20 for something I could easily make myself for $3 (plus, I don't use ingredients that have adverse health effects, but that's a separate matter). Eating out all the time ends up being a foolish waste of money.

Meh, it's just a matter of perspective. If you look at from the point of view of the consumer, you are correct with your argument that tipping allows us to pay the appropriate amount for the level of service rendered. When you view it from the perspective of the waiter, then you may argue for a standardized wage because tipping can be arbitrary (some people are cheap, others generous, without a reflection on quality of service).

 

[sub_thug]

They charge for bathroom usage in Italy?

I've paid to use the bathroom before in Europe. You definitely pay at roadside stops (like gas stations) where I was a paying customer, and I've been charged at places where I wasn't a paying customer. I don't remember if I have been charged at a restaurant where I was a paying customer, so I may have misspoke. But the point is that they charge you for a lot of things that we don't pay for here in North America.

 

[CrimsonFan]

It would appear central to your argument that the tip isn't really optional, no? If it truly were, then it wouldn't harm wait staff when they didn't get one.

That's not true. I've eaten out in Europe. They don't tip there, and the cost is factored into the meal and through other charges. In Italy, they charge you to have a white tablecloth (which are on all their tables at nice restaurants), you are charged for restrooms, for water, and other things that we might view as complimentary here in the States. I wouldn't mind if they just charged more for the food and called it a day.

Your logic appears to be circular. If you eat out, then tip. If you don't tip, you're taking money away from the wait staff. The tip is how we keep costs down, but it's not really how we keep costs down because it's not really optional.

I tip because those are social norms, but they aren't very good norms. It's an inherently flawed process that leads to people getting stiffed out of a few bucks arbitrarily (some people are cheap, regardless of quality of the service), and it relies on the customer to determine the real cost of the good versus the advertised cost of the good.

But why? If the waiters are happy, the restaunt is happy..

Just because its that uncomfortable to tip?

Its great that it works in Italy

Have you even stopped to think and compare? Theres sooo many more restaunts in America. Theres dine in restaurants on every corner. Its not comperable.

Its not changing. And i really see zero reason why anyone would want it to. Just dont tip and risk the throat cutting

 

[Scerpi]

It would appear central to your argument that the tip isn't really optional, no? If it truly were, then it wouldn't harm wait staff when they didn't get one.

That's not true. I've eaten out in Europe. They don't tip there, and the cost is factored into the meal and through other charges. In Italy, they charge you to have a white tablecloth (which are on all their tables at nice restaurants), you are charged for restrooms, for water, and other things that we might view as complimentary here in the States. I wouldn't mind if they just charged more for the food and called it a day.

Your logic appears to be circular. If you eat out, then tip. If you don't tip, you're taking money away from the wait staff. The tip is how we keep costs down, but it's not really how we keep costs down because it's not really optional.

I tip because those are social norms, but they aren't very good norms. It's an inherently flawed process that leads to people getting stiffed out of a few bucks arbitrarily (some people are cheap, regardless of quality of the service), and it relies on the customer to determine the real cost of the good versus the advertised cost of the good.

Yes, it's optional.

If the service was so bad that I felt the need to leave no tip (or a minimal) tip, I would do so. However, I wouldn't leave until I talked to a manager first so it's completely understood why I did. They need to know that their employee is fucking over a paying customer.

My old boss, who was amazing to us, had a saying about providing good service... every time.

- If you provide a good experience, maybe 1 in 5 customers will go out tell someone else about it.
- If you provide a shitty experience, that customer will immediately go out and tell 10 other people about it

People love to complain and tell other people about terrible experiences.

 

[Oblivian]

Agreed on restaurants charging more these days. But that's why I don't go out to eat much, as I don't want to pay $20 for something I could easily make myself for $3 (plus, I don't use ingredients that have adverse health effects, but that's a separate matter). Eating out all the time ends up being a foolish waste of money.

Meh, it's just a matter of perspective. If you look at from the point of view of the consumer, you are correct with your argument that tipping allows us to pay the appropriate amount for the level of service rendered. When you view it from the perspective of the waiter, then you may argue for a standardized wage because tipping can be arbitrary (some people are cheap, others generous, without a reflection on quality of service).

From what I've read on it, it's not so much the waiters pushing for it. A lot of restaurant owners (higher end) prefer the no tipping policy.

 

[moreorless87]

Millenials can't cook which doesn't help either. Millenials are garbage, but to be fair, their parents are to blame. How do you have a daughter and not teach her how to fucking cook? It's such a vital life skill.

 

[sub_thug]

But why? If the waiters are happy, the restaunt is happy..

Just because its that uncomfortable to tip?

Its great that it works in Italy

Have you even stopped to think and compare? Theres sooo many more restaunts in America. Theres dine in restaurants on every corner. Its not comperable.

Its not changing. And i really see zero reason why anyone would want it to. Just dont tip and risk the throat cutting

I'm not particularly passionate one way or the other. I was just merely asking the question. Like I said, I tip, normally about 15%. If the service sucked, I tip less. Maybe twice in my life have I ever given no tip, and that was because something egregious happened. It's not bothering me to tip the standard amount for standard service.

 

[Drenalin]

Tips are stupid. Businesses should pay their servers adequate wages. Subsidizing their overhead because they're too miserly to pay it themselves should be made obsolete.

Are you Jewish?

 

[Deleted member 409801]

Every industry passes the labor expense to the customer....

This^
How does this have to said?

A business turning a profit means every single solitary expense and then some is passed on to the customer. The only logical reason to do away with tipping ( from the tippers standpoint anyway ) is that math is hard . Under the tipping system you have maximum leeway to be a cheap fuck if that's what you want to do. What business will do anything but pass that additional cost...and probably some more for good measure... on the customer ? I'm supposed to beleive that these guys really REALLY want to pay more upfront ?

Cheap fucks don't like being judged , but also want to hang on to that 4 dollars , thats what the crying is really about.

 

[sub_thug]

From what I've read on it, it's not so much the waiters pushing for it. A lot of restaurant owners (higher end) prefer the no tipping policy.

Yes, but for a lot of reasons, if reason serves me well. If they can offer a higher salary, they can recruit better professional wait staff instead of this guy:

They'll have less turnover and more consistent service. And if they suck, it's too easy to fire them and replace them. If you offer minimum wage, you'll get minimally-qualified folks for you, and that's bad for your brand if these people are the face of your business.

 

[Darth_Inv1ctu5]

Soo... Why does it matter if you're paying the server directly or running the money through the restaurant first? If the restaurant starts having to cover everything, it'll definitely be more than 20%.

And if the service is shitty and you have a horrible experience because the server was awful? You're ok with paying 20% extra (or more) on the restaurant bill regardless?

Just so we're straight on this. Because it really makes no fucking sense.

Pay stability for servers and nonhassle for me. If the service is shit, I don't go there anymore, period. If the increase in prices is more than standard too, I go elsewhere, they can fuck me over only once. It makes perfect sense if you want more pay stability for servers and less hassle for customers.

 

[sub_thug]

Yes, it's optional.

If the service was so bad that I felt the need to leave no tip (or a minimal) tip, I would do so. However, I wouldn't leave until I talked to a manager first so it's completely understood why I did. They need to know that their employee is fucking over a paying customer.

My old boss, who was amazing to us, had a saying about providing good service... every time.

- If you provide a good experience, maybe 1 in 5 customers will go out tell someone else about it.
- If you provide a shitty experience, that customer will immediately go out and tell 10 other people about it

People love to complain and tell other people about terrible experiences.

All of that is extremely fair, but at the same time, the guy was talking about how we should all tip 15-25% anyways because "it's a few bucks, you'll make more." He can't simultaneously hold your belief AND the belief that everyone should tip the 15-25% because you are otherwise taking money out of the waiter's pocket.

 

[Scerpi]

Pay stability for servers and nonhassle for me. If the service is shit, I don't go there anymore, period. If the increase in prices is more than standard too, I go elsewhere, they can fuck me over only once. It makes perfect sense if you want more pay stability for servers and less hassle for customers.

Keep the servers out of it... They don't want it. Seriously, they don't want you arguing for them.

And I'm not understanding the "Hassle". Is the math too hard? They often put the amounts on the receipt now for different percentages. 10% 15% 20%... You also have a mini-computer in your pocket to help as well if you're unable to do the math in your head.

 

[Scerpi]

All of that is extremely fair, but at the same time, the guy was talking about how we should all tip 15-25% anyways because "it's a few bucks, you'll make more." He can't simultaneously hold your belief AND the belief that everyone should tip the 15-25% because you are otherwise taking money out of the waiter's pocket.

Well, I agree in general. If you have an acceptable experience, then 15% is customary. I'm not sure where the 25% as a standard is coming from. I don't agree that 20% should be the norm either.

My only exception to this is when I dine out at super cheap places, like a Denny's or Ihop and my tab is less than $15 or so. I'll definitely round up or give an extra dollar. I know it sounds stupid, but it's really nothing out of my pocket for me, but it does mean something to the server.

 

[ProBoxingInsidr]

these threads show how absolutely stupid milennials usually are. they use the "put the cost of the extra wage in the food" excuse to justify being a cheapskate. it is a cop out because they expect great service, but if the cost was added in, that would encourage even shittier service than they sometimes already get.

With anything in life, it is usually those who protest the most loudly that realize they are being dicks. they are just trying to justify it to themselves. there is no current excuse for not tipping. also, Anthony Bourdain is a hero to many of you milennials. go read what he said about not tipping.

one restaurant cant make a change. it would take a federal law to be passed in order to fix the wage issue. so until that happens, don't act like you are some sort of hero for not tipping or are standing up for what is right. if you want to do that, become a lobbyist.

as for those saying they should "get a better job" if they want to make good money, being a server is very often a job for those working their way through college, having a second job, etc. the flexibility is what many of them need.

finally, the "they dont do anything but hand me my food" crowd are not worth adderessing and have clearly never been a server. imagine having to run back and forth for some of these people only to be greeted at the end of the meal with nothing and "get a better job if you dont like it." but society has changed enough to where many of these kids think it is cool to be a dick. yet most of them won't be manly enough to do it to the server's face, they will just brag about it on Sherdog.

 

[Oblivian]

Yes, but for a lot of reasons, if reason serves me well. If they can offer a higher salary, they can recruit better professional wait staff instead of this guy:

They'll have less turnover and more consistent service. And if they suck, it's too easy to fire them and replace them. If you offer minimum wage, you'll get minimally-qualified folks for you, and that's bad for your brand if these people are the face of your business.

It's not really higher pay, but more equal pay among the wait staff. That's the big misconception. If the restaurant is charging just over 20%, they aren't going to be paying more than 20%.

The reasoning from owners had more to do with issues with the the industry. It gives the chef/owner more control. Waiters will push issues under the rug and not tell the owner. They can be pushed around by customers and give away shit so that they maintain their potential for a tip.

 

[Darth_Inv1ctu5]

Keep the servers out of it... They don't want it. Seriously, they don't want you arguing for them.

And I'm not understanding the "Hassle". Is the math too hard? They often put the amounts on the receipt now for different percentages. 10% 15% 20%... You also have a mini-computer in your pocket to help as well if you're unable to do the math in your head.

Dude I can guarantee you that an overwhelming majority of servers would take a stable pay scenario over tip-based, for every one personable server you have a dozen who would be better off with higher hourly. Being reliant on occupancy and people's benevolence <<< knowing that you get paid either way. I'm not particularly bothered by the tip math - I do it for my friends all the time because for some reason percentage math in the low hundreds causes a lot of people here brain anneurisms, but it's even better when there's none of that

 

[Oblivian]

Dude I can guarantee you that an overwhelming majority of servers would take a stable pay scenario over tip-based, for every one personable server you have a dozen who would be better off with higher hourly. Being reliant on occupancy and people's benevolence <<< knowing that you get paid either way. I'm not particularly bothered by the tip math - I do it for my friends all the time because for some reason percentage math in the low hundreds causes a lot of people here brain anneurisms, but it's even better when there's none of that

Wow....