Your thoughts on this sweep

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Anthas, Feb 22, 2016.

  1. Anthas

    Anthas Yellow Belt

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  2. Allan san

    Allan san Green Belt

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    Its a good sweep; kind of like a tornado guard sweep. The only issue I ever have with throwing the arm is they are still able to actively post. The kneebar is super easy to grab and if they keep rotating out, I put them straight into the honey hole. After that it is a leg lock of my choosing.
     
  3. dmwalking

    dmwalking Sapateiro Belt

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    I like it. I already do something similar so I can see it working efficiently.
     
  4. Zankou

    Zankou Muscle and Hate Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    I really love that transition from kimura/half guard into a far leg attack, but that sweep is almost never going to work. You can turn that general leg control into many other sweep/takedown attacks, and I think they are more high-percentage.
     
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  5. Anthas

    Anthas Yellow Belt

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    Thanks everybody. I tried it today and it really is easy to get the kneebar... But the last part of the sweep was hard... Any videos or ideas on other interesting options from there?
     
  6. fanboysareevil

    fanboysareevil Green Belt

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    In my experience, against good guys, you have to control a cross sleeve/wrist and the leg at the same time, or else they will sprawl/crossface/limp arm, no matter how quickly/powerfully you do the move. I don't like just guiding the arm over like in the video, as you loose a lot of ability to manipulate their weight by hitting the armpit if you don't hold it. And to Zankou, I would argue that the sweep itself is most definitely going to work and IMO should be considered a go to if you can control both the far leg and wrist. Dean Lister and Caio Terra are both big on this move, as have been some of the best leg lock guys I've ever trained with. Works very well from half butterfly (where I use it) too because your leg is already partially circled in.
     
  7. Big_Chief_Stove

    Big_Chief_Stove Silver Belt

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    Looks like a good sweep. They might be able to post a little before the finish, but if you threaten with the knee bar that post goes away. Don't forget about passing on the near side option after sweep is complete.
     
  8. Zankou

    Zankou Muscle and Hate Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Honestly I've never seen it used successfully at a high level. I could go into the reasons for this, but a major one is that it's almost impossible to maintain a strong wrist control against your opponent while simultaneously controlling the leg with your arm+both legs AND rolling. These are all antithetical controls (his wrist is nowhere near the leg position you are entering), which means to get the sweep to work is going to require entering with a lot of speed, timing, momentum, and luck. None of which I like.

    This sweep is basically a variant on the (very good, but not super high percentage) backroll sweep from half guard. Like so. But you have to lock the bejeezus out of the arm to really make the backroll work (either stretching it out with a dominant sleeve grip or jamming it super deep under the guy). Here is the jamming approach.



    And here is the stretching approach.

     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2016
  9. fanboysareevil

    fanboysareevil Green Belt

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    I think we're looking at the sweep pretty differently if you're looking at it as a variation of the backroll/shaolin sweep. I see it as much closer to a half/inverted guard version of a flower/xande sweep, as the key kuzushi is in impacting the armpit with the leg and then lifting the leg you grip.
     
  10. Zankou

    Zankou Muscle and Hate Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Leg never really contacts the arm. Watch the slomo. He's jamming the arm under really quick with his hand right (like the backroll sweep) as he brings the leg through. That's why he is rolling backwards, taking his opponent the opposite direction of a pendulum sweep.

    Can it be done, sure, is it very likely, again not something I've ever seen hit in high level competition.
     
  11. fanboysareevil

    fanboysareevil Green Belt

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    For clarification's sake, I don't like the way it is shown in the video and think that without the component I'm talking about i believe the move is very weak/low percentage. They do indeed travel in a different direction than with a pendulum sweep (to the side/back corner instead of the front corner), but the concept is very similar nonetheless.
     

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