Where would you rate Usyk in the top 10 of all time Heavyweight boxers.

[totoro mick b]

He's not one of the best ever.
Just doesnt have enough fights to say that.

It's "who" not "how many".
If "doesn't have enough fights" is the standard, then logically,
Valuev 50 - 2 - 0
Should be one of the very best ever right ?
Cut the fat, forget padded records...

a 10 - 0 - 0 record filled with champions has more merit than a +50 wins padded record.
The fact that Usyk has achieved so much with so few fights makes it even more impressive.

 

[Badr Hari]

Usyk is one of the p4p GOATS but at heavyweight alone he is not even top15.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

It's "who" not "how many".
If "doesn't have enough fights" is the standard, then logically,
Valuev 50 - 2 - 0
Should be one of the very best ever right ?
Cut the fat, forget padded records...

a 10 - 0 - 0 record filled with champions has more merit than a +50 wins padded record.
The fact that Usyk has achieved so much with so few fights makes it even more impressive.

I agree that the total number of fights isn't that significant. It's the quality that matters most. However, Usyk has a very limited number of fights at heavyweight. Six fights with a couple big name wins is all. That isn't enough to make it into the all-time heavyweight Top 10.

At cruiser though Usyk has the best resume in the division's history. Out of his top wins there 4 of them were undefeated and 3 were current world champions. None of Holyfield's top cruiserweight wins were over undefeated fighters. They all had anywhere between a few losses to a handful when he beat them. His win over Qawi (hall of famer) is all that really stands out.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

top 20 or so

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

I agree that the total number of fights isn't that significant. It's the quality that matters most. However, Usyk has a very limited number of fights at heavyweight. Six fights with a couple big name wins is all. That isn't enough to make it into the all-time heavyweight Top 10.

At cruiser though Usyk has the best resume in the division's history. Out of his top wins there 4 of them were undefeated and 3 were current world champions. None of Holyfield's top cruiserweight wins were over undefeated fighters. They all had anywhere between a few losses to a handful when he beat them. His win over Qawi (hall of famer) is all that really stands out.

de leon is a really solid win at cruiserweight for holyfield as well. i'd say he's on par with someone like dorticos, bellew, or gassiev.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

de leon is a really solid win at cruiserweight for holyfield as well. i'd say he's on par with someone like dorticos, bellew, or gassiev.

I also think De Leon is a solid win but he already had 4 or 5 losses by the time Holyfield beat him.

 

[Mujeriego]

It's "who" not "how many".
If "doesn't have enough fights" is the standard, then logically,
Valuev 50 - 2 - 0
Should be one of the very best ever right ?
Cut the fat, forget padded records...

a 10 - 0 - 0 record filled with champions has more merit than a +50 wins padded record.
The fact that Usyk has achieved so much with so few fights makes it even more impressive.

Sure but were not comparing him to Valuev.
You're trying to crown him best of this generation and bringing up Valuev.

Bring up Canelo. 61-2-2 with a substantially better resume.
Hes the guy of this generation whether you like him or not.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

I also think De Leon is a solid win but he already had 4 or 5 losses by the time Holyfield beat him.

yeah i don't personally weigh losses (unless they're really really bad) as much as wins. basically, i don't hold gassiev in some super high regard just because he was undefeated. he had some nice wins on his record, which matters much more to me.

funny enough, i think breidis became a better cruiserweight resume-wise after he lost to usyk. he hadn't really beaten anyone noteworthy besides an aging huck before usyk. afterwards is when he built a nice altogether resume adding dorticos and glowacki.

 

[KAZSoliloquy]

It's "who" not "how many".
If "doesn't have enough fights" is the standard, then logically,
Valuev 50 - 2 - 0
Should be one of the very best ever right ?
Cut the fat, forget padded records...

a 10 - 0 - 0 record filled with champions has more merit than a +50 wins padded record.
The fact that Usyk has achieved so much with so few fights makes it even more impressive.

what do you do with someone like lomachenko who came in the game a 2-time gold medalist, is only 18-3 over an entire decade and half of those wins are against mediocre competition? lol

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

yeah i don't personally weigh losses (unless they're really really bad) as much as wins. basically, i don't hold gassiev in some super high regard just because he was undefeated. he had some nice wins on his record, which matters much more to me.

funny enough, i think breidis became a better cruiserweight resume-wise after he lost to usyk. he hadn't really beaten anyone noteworthy besides an aging huck before usyk. afterwards is when he built a nice altogether resume adding dorticos and glowacki.

I don't hold Gassiev in super high regard either but he did have some nice wins and was an undefeated unified champion when Usyk beat him. He also did it in his backyard. A Ukrainian defeating a Russian in Russia just a few years after Crimea was invaded. That's ballsy.

 

[tasteslikechicken]

No. Just no

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

Sure but were not comparing him to Valuev.
You're trying to crown him best of this generation and bringing up Valuev.

Bring up Canelo. 61-2-2 with a substantially better resume.
Hes the guy of this generation whether you like him or not.

Canelo is arguably the most accomplished fighter but he refuses to fight his main rival at SMW. Demanding $200 million to fight his WBC mandatory is some diva shit. Benavidez is a guy he's obligated to face. Canelo also isn't undefeated, when others like Usyk, Inoue & Bud are, so calling him the best of this generation is debatable.

 

[SuperLuigi]

Im curious how many more wins Usyk would need for people to consider him to have surpassed Holifield. Like if he beat Fury in the rematch, then say, Parker, Wilder, and Zhang, would that be enough?

 

[Doctor Grudge]

Im curious how many more wins Usyk would need for people to consider him to have surpassed Holifield. Like if he beat Fury in the rematch, then say, Parker, Wilder, and Zhang, would that be enough?

I think his wins are starting to become comparable, but Holyfield still has more depth.

Also, boxing is very fickle about fighters with losses. If Usyk had beaten Wilder instead of Parker, it'd make his resume look better, but now people will just say Wilder is a can. Ditto with Zhang and Parker.

 

[Seano]

Sort of depends on how you rank Joshua and Fury, I guess.

I don't think he comes close to the resumes of Lewis, Louis and Ali. Holyfield had similar accomplishments and a deeper resume.

Top 15 maybe. Not that he doesn't have the ability to rank higher, its more that he's only had a handful of HW fights, its tough for me to rank him over guys who had legendary careers at the weight.

 

[Seano]

I think his wins are starting to become comparable, but Holyfield still has more depth.

Also, boxing is very fickle about fighters with losses. If Usyk had beaten Wilder instead of Parker, it'd make his resume look better, but now people will just say Wilder is a can. Ditto with Zhang and Parker.

Its really too bad Wilder dropped off so badly, I always wanted to see Usyk vs Wilder. Not so much now.

 

[Boxiana]

I wont make my own list quite yet but I'm sure this was already discussed anyone want to take a stab. does he crack the top 10?

Where do you rate Fury and AJ? Nowhere near top 10 I’d guess - probably not even top 20

 

[SandisLL]

Honorable mention.

He has cemented himself as the best of his generation, unified in 2 weight classes, unblemished pro record.

But his quality> quantity approach leaves him a bit short of the type of statistical accomplishments generally expected of top 10 of all time HW status.

He had a lot of problems cos Covid era prohibitions and restrictions limiting gathetings etc because this had impacted revenue sales potential from live gate ( and this includes potential to get money from VIP lodges and VIP tables etc....
).
Also Fury talks boring till death....

 

[SandisLL]

I think his wins are starting to become comparable, but Holyfield still has more depth.

Also, boxing is very fickle about fighters with losses. If Usyk had beaten Wilder instead of Parker, it'd make his resume look better, but now people will just say Wilder is a can. Ditto with Zhang and Parker.

Usyk didn't had Parker.

Holyfield is considered by a lot of boxers in europe as one from top3 cruiserweight boxers ever. Yes, muricans a bit hate this division despite they are larger than LHW boxers...
Greatest versions of Holyfield you might see from his amateur fights and CW pro fights. Real Deal was very good there...

 

[SandisLL]

yeah i don't personally weigh losses (unless they're really really bad) as much as wins. basically, i don't hold gassiev in some super high regard just because he was undefeated. he had some nice wins on his record, which matters much more to me.

funny enough, i think breidis became a better cruiserweight resume-wise after he lost to usyk. he hadn't really beaten anyone noteworthy besides an aging huck before usyk. afterwards is when he built a nice altogether resume adding dorticos and glowacki.

For converted KBer Briedis did had relatively well in boxing. Also like Usyk he did fights on foreign soil etc...He didn't had such high achievements in am boxing like Holyfield or Usyk or Bet etc....
Unfortunately he looks that is not only old now, also in lazy mode after WBSS2 + more contentrated about business and politics...