What'd be the point in Diaz/McGregor 2 being at 155?

[johncola]

Diaz/McGregor 1 at UFC 196 was obviously @ 170.

Diaz/McGregor 2 was booked for UFC 200 @ 170.

People complained about this at the time, and wanted it to be at 155. I'm hearing the same complaints again, for the potential rematch that could happen at UFC 202. Even Ariel Helwani said on Submission Radio that he wants the fight to happen at 155 because it'd "give it a little bit of a different spin". I think he's suggesting that the weight class will affect how many buys the fight will generate, which is stupid.

There's 2 big reasons for the fight to happen @ 170. Firstly and most importantly, is that Conor is doing this fight to avenge a loss. He wants to totally get the win back. He doesn't want his win to be put down to being at a different weight class, as stupid fans would likely do. Secondly, is that weight cutting is stupid.

There's 2 reasons I can think of for having the fight @ 155...

Firstly, Diaz is bigger than McGregor, and thus probably cuts more weight. Putting it at 155 would be to make Diaz have to cut more weight. But Conor doesn't want to win that way. He doesn't want to win via making his opponent more dehydrated than him. He wants to win by being the better fighter. And anyway, this would only be a small advantage in the big picture.

Secondly, putting the fight at 155 would make giving the winner a title shot at 155 more legitimate within the divisional structure of the sport. Again, this isn't a very important reason. Conor is above the divisional structure of the sport. That stuff's for regular fighters. Conor already had his 155 shot on the table, and he's still 145 champion. He doesn't need to fight at 155 to prove he can make the weight, as we know he can. A win over Diaz at 170 means the same thing as a win over Diaz at 155. And besides, he might decide to challenge for the 170 title instead of the 155 title.

 

[CountOfSoCal]

Here's the real question: who wants the FW division to be held up (once again) for another year, while the HEALTHY champion is fighting outside the weight-class?

 

[skysolo]

Diaz/McGregor 1 at UFC 196 was obviously @ 170.

Diaz/McGregor 2 was booked for UFC 200 @ 170.

People complained about this at the time, and wanted it to be at 155. I'm hearing the same complaints again, for the potential rematch that could happen at UFC 202. Even Ariel Helwani said on Submission Radio that he wants the fight to happen at 155 because it'd "give it a little bit of a different spin". I think he's suggesting that the weight class will affect how many buys the fight will generate, which is stupid.

There's 2 big reasons for the fight to happen @ 170. Firstly and most importantly, is that Conor is doing this fight to avenge a loss. He wants to totally get the win back. He doesn't want his win to be put down to being at a different weight class, as stupid fans would likely do. Secondly, is that weight cutting is stupid.

There's 2 reasons I can think of for having the fight @ 155...

Firstly, Diaz is bigger than McGregor, and thus probably cuts more weight. Putting it at 155 would be to make Diaz have to cut more weight. But Conor doesn't want to win that way. He doesn't want to win via making his opponent more dehydrated than him. He wants to win by being the better fighter. And anyway, this would only be a small advantage in the big picture.

Secondly, putting the fight at 155 would make giving the winner a title shot at 155 more legitimate within the divisional structure of the sport. Again, this isn't a very important reason. Conor is above the divisional structure of the sport. That stuff's for regular fighters. Conor already had his 155 shot on the table, and he's still 145 champion. He doesn't need to fight at 155 to prove he can make the weight, as we know he can. A win over Diaz at 170 means the same thing as a win over Diaz at 155. And besides, he might decide to challenge for the 170 title instead of the 155 title.

What's the point at fighting at 170?
What's the point of the fight in the first place?
Didn't Mcgregor want to defend his title?
Didn't Mcgregor want to challenge for the LW title?

Mcgregor cut more to make 145 than Diaz did to make 155.

Why stop at WW? Let's see Mcgregor fight Jacare for the number contender to MW title.

 

[wilKO]

What is the point of Diaz McGregor 2?

 

[Chain Saw]

Nate is a natural 155er, he said he wants it at 155.

 

[Drake]

Here's the real question: who wants the FW division to be held up (once again) for another year, while the HEALTHY champion is fighting outside the weight-class?

What's the point at fighting at 170?
What's the point of the fight in the first place?
Didn't Mcgregor want to defend his title?
Didn't Mcgregor want to challenge for the LW title?

Mcgregor cut more to make 145 than Diaz did to make 155.

Why stop at WW? Let's see Mcgregor fight Jacare for the number contender to MW title.

What is the point of Diaz McGregor 2?

 

[Mr Wings]

The point of doing it at 155 is that it seems to be the ideal weight for both men.

The point of doing it at 170, unfortunately, is that if Conor loses he can say "I moved up two weight classes, it was a ballsy risk." If he wins: "I moved up two weight classes and beat a welterweight." He gets more credit for the win, and less "discredit" for the loss.

 

[NotoriousNick]

McGregor's frame is better for lightweight. The trade off between his speed and cardio for the weight behind his punches at welterweight isn't worth it if you gas in one and a half rounds against a more durable fighter.

 

[johncola]

What's the point at fighting at 170?
What's the point of the fight in the first place?
Didn't Mcgregor want to defend his title?
Didn't Mcgregor want to challenge for the LW title?

Mcgregor cut more to make 145 than Diaz did to make 155.

Why stop at WW? Let's see Mcgregor fight Jacare for the number contender to MW title.

To answer your questions:

The point of fighting @ 170 is that that's where the first fight was. It's also a weight limit that exists. And both fighters would only have to cut a minimal amount of weight.

The point of fighting in the first place would be the same for most fights that get made. For the fans, we get to see a competitive fight, we get to see who the better fighter is, we get an exciting fight, we get a hyped fight, we get an entertaining buildup. Fans of McGregor get to see him try and avenge a loss. For the UFC, they get to make money.

McGregor does want to defend his title, but RDA was the favorable option. Now this rematch is the favorable option.

McGregor does want to challenge for the LW title. Why do you ask?

I agree that McGregor probably cut more to make 145 than Diaz did to make 155. But why do you bring that up?

Personally I think he should stop at WW because his chances of winning become unrealistic above that weight. Jacare, Rockhold, Weidman are horrible fights. Superfights against Bisping and Anderson would be good though.

 

[johncola]

Here's the real question: who wants the FW division to be held up (once again) for another year, while the HEALTHY champion is fighting outside the weight-class?

The situation isn't ideal, but none is. And this is what the interim title is for.

 

[johncola]

What is the point of Diaz McGregor 2?

For us, competitive fight, exciting fight, hyped fight, and for Conor fans seeing a loss avenged.

For UFC, money, as usual.

 

[johncola]

Nate is a natural 155er, he said he wants it at 155.

But why should it happen at 155? There still needs to be a good reason.

 

[johncola]

I answered all of their questions with ease. If they get an applause, you're gonna have to build a statue of me in your garden.

 

[Chain Saw]

But why should it happen at 155? There still needs to be a good reason.

Because both fighters are natural 155ers and the winner of the 1st fight wants it at 155...

The only reason it happened at 170 was because Nate only had 12 days notice.

Under any other circumstances the fight would've been 155.

 

[skysolo]

To answer your questions:

The point of fighting @ 170 is that that's where the first fight was. It's also a weight limit that exists. And both fighters would only have to cut a minimal amount of weight.

The point of fighting in the first place would be the same for most fights that get made. For the fans, we get to see a competitive fight, we get to see who the better fighter is, we get an exciting fight, we get a hyped fight, we get an entertaining buildup. Fans of McGregor get to see him try and avenge a loss. For the UFC, they get to make money.

McGregor does want to defend his title, but RDA was the favorable option. Now this rematch is the favorable option.

McGregor does want to challenge for the LW title. Why do you ask?

I agree that McGregor probably cut more to make 145 than Diaz did to make 155. But why do you bring that up?

Personally I think he should stop at WW because his chances of winning become unrealistic above that weight. Jacare, Rockhold, Weidman are horrible fights. Superfights against Bisping and Anderson would be good though.

My point to asking any of those questions is to show that thread is silly. The fight is/was happening at 170lbs because Mcgregor wanted it to. That is the only reason. Any theorizing is unnecessary.

What do you mean "favorable option"? Why the hell would he even have a chance or get a chance to fight for the WW strap?

He lost to Nate Diaz; who is not exactly unbeatable.

 

[johncola]

The point of doing it at 155 is that it seems to be the ideal weight for both men.

The point of doing it at 170, unfortunately, is that if Conor loses he can say "I moved up two weight classes, it was a ballsy risk." If he wins: "I moved up two weight classes and beat a welterweight." He gets more credit for the win, and less "discredit" for the loss.

It being the ideal weight, refers to fighters they're likely to run into in the divisions. For example:

McGregor probably cuts too much for 145. At WW, he'd be small, and his weakness is wrestlers, so he'd get outmuscled a lot. 155 is ideal.

Diaz is bigger than Conor, but he likely has an even bigger weakness against wrestlers. He got outmuscled against Stun Gun and Rory. 145 is out of the question. 155 is ideal.

But we aren't talking about what weight class Diaz and McGregor should be fighting at in general. We're talking about this one-off, special attraction of a fight.

The point of 170, originally, was that Diaz didn't want to make 155. If it wasn't at 155, they may as well have cut a minimal amount of weight, and do it at 170. The rematch, for Conor, is about redemption. He wants to avenge the loss. Like I said in my OP, the redemption would be tainted, and excuses would be made, by stupid fans, were he to win at 155. For example "He only won because it was at 155". Plus, cutting weight is unhealthy and not fun. So why do it for no reason?

 

[ortizgnp]

For us, competitive fight, exciting fight, hyped fight, and for Conor fans seeing a loss avenged.

For UFC, money, as usual.

Except it's not competitive.

 

[johncola]

McGregor's frame is better for lightweight. The trade off between his speed and cardio for the weight behind his punches at welterweight isn't worth it if you gas in one and a half rounds against a more durable fighter.

We don't know for sure what caused his cardio issues. I think Diaz's pressure boxing style and reach was more of a factor. What we do know for sure, is that cutting weight wouldn't help his cardio. Maybe he'd focus more on cardio training as a result of a bigger weight cut, and that'd help his cardio. But the weight cut itself isn't gonna help him. A bigger weight cut isn't gonna make him faster either.

 

[johncola]

Because both fighters are natural 155ers and the winner of the 1st fight wants it at 155...

The only reason it happened at 170 was because Nate only had 12 days notice.

Under any other circumstances the fight would've been 155.

I agree with 2nd and 3rd sentences. But they don't provide a reason for this rematch needing to be at 155.

Diaz and McGregor being natural 155ers mean they should be fighting at 155 in general. I explained this in post #16. But that doesn't ean that this fight needs to happen at 155. The fighters are still fighting each other, regardless of how much they cut. They aren't gaining height and reach by going up to 170.

Look at it like this: Diaz should fight at 155 where he'd be facing Pettis, Michael Johnson, Edson Barboza, instead of 170 where he'd be facing Wonderboy, Rory, Condit. Same for McGregor. Diaz should be fighting at 155 where he'd be facing McGregor. Diaz should be fighting at 170 where he'd be facing McGregor. You see what I mean? Other fighters of those divisions don't matter in this case. Diaz and McGregor don't have to face big WWs. They are only facing each other.

 

[Deleted member 429453]

Here's the real question: who wants the FW division to be held up (once again) for another year, while the HEALTHY champion is fighting outside the weight-class?

Which is why Conor is the worst champ in ufc history