What would have happened if Ali had reported for service?

EGarrett

EGarrett

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It seems weird that they drafted the reigning World Heavyweight Champion. Obviously he can refuse to fight as a matter of principle, but what do you think they were planning to do with him if he had reported for service, or what do you think they were likely to do?

Keeping him at home and having him just do basic training and then a few commercials or exhibition bouts for the military while continuing his fighting career would have been far more beneficial to them then any other role he could've played. This is basically what happened when Joe Louis voluntarily enlisted.
 
Well, I imagine he'd be sent to basic training like everyone else, no? Wether they'd keep him off the field and use him as a propaganda tool or not I'm not sure. He was hated by a lot of people back then.
 
he was told he'd never see combat but who knows if that's true or not. I wouldn't count on it. But, he would have been better used as a symbol, as someone who thought he could be his own man and was shown that he couldn't be. Just like Elvis. Paul McCartney always says that the Beatles hated Elvis after he went in the service and Lennon said "Elvis died when he entered the Army" when he was told that Elvis was dead. You can't please everyone, if he'd went, black people would have been disappointed, the young freaks and hippies would have been disappointed but the people that still hate him would be saying "good boy".
 
It's hard to say. You'd think they would have used him like Joe Louis was in World War 2, just speaking and doing exhibitions to rally the troops, but Ali wasn't beloved at the time like Joe Louis was so maybe they really would have sent him over deep into the shit.
 
He would of been on the front lines to die and if he survived would of been fucked in the head
 
He was already well known. I think they would have given him the Captain America treatment (sell war bonds, parades, etc).
Seeing the front lines, not a chance.
 
1mic said:
He was already well known. I think they would have given him the Captain America treatment (sell war bonds, parades, etc).
Seeing the front lines, not a chance.
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Ali was hated. I doubt it, I felt he was singled out for that draft but who knows
 
he was singled out but so was Elvis. There was a law that protected celebrities, Elvis could have performed his way through the two years but his manager didn't want him performing for free and also, it didn't hurt him with most of the American public. Law or no law, I don't believe anything the government says at face value, I doubt Ali did either. Two schools of thought, some people thought Muhammad was a coward, scared to got to war, others think he was a hero for not going. seems to be evidence for both. so how history judges, who's to say.
 
mozfonky said:
he was singled out but so was Elvis. There was a law that protected celebrities, Elvis could have performed his way through the two years but his manager didn't want him performing for free and also, it didn't hurt him with most of the American public. Law or no law, I don't believe anything the government says at face value, I doubt Ali did either. Two schools of thought, some people thought Muhammad was a coward, scared to got to war, others think he was a hero for not going. seems to be evidence for both. so how history judges, who's to say.
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I got the impression Elvis wanted to serve and Ali didn't. I'm not saying who was right or wrong.
 
Elvis didn't want to serve but didn't see the point of whining about it, he just figured to make the best out of it. Some people have even insinuated that his manager pulled strings to make sure he'd end up in the army because he was worried about him straying away from him. No one making that kind of money in their prime would want to chance taking two years away fucking around with some overgrown boys little games when they could be making the big bucks and doing what they loved.
 
that's what I don't get what the disappointment by people was with Elvis, what was he supposed to do? that's a classic catch 22. McCartney says "we went off him in a big way". Just stupid, so Elvis is supposed to fight the govt. get imprisoned, definitely have his career ruined, just to make some of his fans happy?
 
mozfonky said:
that's what I don't get what the disappointment by people was with Elvis, what was he supposed to do? that's a classic catch 22. McCartney says "we went off him in a big way". Just stupid, so Elvis is supposed to fight the govt. get imprisoned, definitely have his career ruined, just to make some of his fans happy?
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Hey, like I said no crime on Elvis, and we'll probably get dubbed for a thread hijack but it's important to say. Put me in the same situation I wouldn't have wanted to fight. Can't argue with that.
 
so, what's your point? Not sure what you're saying. I replied saying that the above poster thinks Ali would have cracked in combat. Like he's a weak person, like he had no courage or emotional strength and he would be "fucked in the head". Well, enough people love Ali, he didn't need you guys.
 
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Also, it's still not clear whether Ali was trying to evade combat or following his conscience or following the Muslims. Black men of his time and before were often ambivalent about fighting for a country that treated them like third class citizens. Dizzy Gillespie told a story of his attempted induction, that if they gave him a gun and told him to shoot the enemy, he might shoot the wrong guy. Malcolm X said in his process that he "couldn't wait to get his hands on a gun so he could kill a lot of crackers". Both men were rejected of course. I just googled David Kindred for his take on Ali's death, he didn't seem to mention what he used as a basic premise in his book on Ali, Sound and Fury, that Ali was a coward and that he was a mindless zombie. He seemed to, I guess rightly, not go into that at all in his article.
 
mozfonky said:
Also, it's still not clear whether Ali was trying to evade combat or following his conscience or following the Muslims. Black men of his time and before were often ambivalent about fighting for a country that treated them like third class citizens. Dizzy Gillespie told a story of his attempted induction, that if they gave him a gun and told him to shoot the enemy, he might shoot the wrong guy. Malcolm X said in his process that he "couldn't wait to get his hands on a gun so he could kill a lot of crackers". Both men were rejected of course. I just googled David Kindred for his take on Ali's death, he didn't seem to mention what he used as a basic premise in his book on Ali, Sound and Fury, that Ali was a coward and that he was a mindless zombie. He seemed to, I guess rightly, not go into that at all in his article.
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In all fairness, I think it's crystal clear. I think he was with the NOI for better or worse before he publicly called himself Muhammad Ali, and it was never about dodging the draft. I've clarified on here before many, many times that I was never condoning the NOI (who, in the end is a shit organization who can be understood in their context and still be completely condemnded), but it was always genuine, and there is shit all to say otherwise.

Shit, you have read up on Malcolm X's autobiography. I don't believe a lot of the shit he wrote (to a point). Not to say he wasn't a brilliant man, because any plain person with any affiliation would have to admit he was (I envy at how he could read and retain, to say nothing about his speaking ability), but he said a lot of shit which isn't fully believable). He did avoid the WW2 draft, but probably because he was a junkie, more than anything else (I don't believe all that other shit, or any of his in prison miraculous stories).
 
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JayElectra said:
In all fairness, I think it's crystal clear. I think he was with the NOI for better or worse before he publicly called himself Muhammad Ali, and it was never about dodging the draft. I've clarified on here before many, many times that I was never condoning the NOI (who, in the end is a shit organization who can be understood in their context and still be completely condemnded), but it was always genuine, and there is shit all to say otherwise.

Shit, you have read up on Malcolm X's autobiography. I don't believe a lot of the shit he wrote (to a point). Not to say he wasn't a brilliant man, because any plain person with any affiliation would have to admit he was (I envy at how he could read and retain, to say nothing about his speaking ability), but he said a lot of shit which isn't fully believable). He did avoid the WW2 draft, but probably because he was a junkie, more than anything else (I don't believe all that other shit, or any of his in prison miraculous stories).
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I don't believe everything in the bio, but I also don't think that was all Malcolm's fault. What people forget is that Malcolm was dead before it came out and Alex Haley had his own agenda. he was successfully sued over the roots story so I do think his credibility was questionable. How moderate Malcolm became is still unknown, Haley may have put words in Malcolms mouth and a lot of the book is just demonstrably false. Malcolm was far from illiterate when he went to prison and his reading the dictionary story is probably more to inspire black people to study than an actual fact.
 
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