What Happens if Brock Never Contracts Diverticulitis?

Ludwig von Mises said:
Bad match ups will always be bad match ups. He beat Hunt easily years past his prime because it was a good match up.
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Oh please, any version of Hunt would get smashed by (healthy) Brock in an octagon. Hunt would have to land that KO punch right away or his fat crybaby ass is going for a ride to strawberrytown

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Lesnar is one of the biggest "what if's" in MMA history, in general. The diverticulitis is certainly one of those questions I have, although there are others...

What if he started training MMA earlier in his career, instead of WWE?
What if he trained with a legit top team (Jacksons, AKA, etc.) instead of a team tailored specifically to him (Deathclutch)?
What if he learned to strike properly?
What if he learned to take a punch, rather than cower when he got hit?

Lesnar always seemed extremely coachable, and I think he would have excelled in a lot of areas other than just rely on his wrestling and brute power.
 
Lionheart7167 said:
Lesnar is one of the biggest "what if's" in MMA history, in general. The diverticulitis is certainly one of those questions I have, although there are others...

What if he started training MMA earlier in his career, instead of WWE?
What if he trained with a legit top team (Jacksons, AKA, etc.) instead of a team tailored specifically to him (Deathclutch)?
What if he learned to strike properly?
What if he learned to take a punch, rather than cower when he got hit?

Lesnar always seemed extremely coachable, and I think he would have excelled in a lot of areas other than just rely on his wrestling and brute power.
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I wonder what camp would have been the best fit. Was Roufusport around back then? Turn him into K-1 Lesnar lol
 
it didn't help for sure, but there was never going to be any way of getting around the fact that the dude did not like getting hit. the cain fight exposed him, badly and permanently.
 
Without teh disease Brock would've reigned for a long time~

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I feel like it was his health issues slowing him down. Most people look at his performances at face value without adding that in. I don't think anyone at the time could've beaten him otherwise.

A KO at HW is always a possibility for anyone at any time, so maybe he gets caught, but it wouldn't be a regular thing.

I don't think Cain would've outworked him. We learned a lot about that once Cain fought in the mountains.
 
He still loses to Cain and Reem. I admit I never gave a crap about Brock so that may be my bias talking. I don't disagree that Diverticulitis diminished him from where he was prior. I'm also of the belief he never was this unbeatable monster and was destined to be exposed. Carwin had him but didn't have the gas tank to finish the job. That wasn't going to be the case with Cain who bounced him across the cage.
 
Guess I'm in the minority but I can totally see Brock beating Cain if he were healthy.

Brock's wrestling skill was higher and he was stronger, I don't think anyone could avoid being put on their back by him, not even Cain.

Plus Brock has a very good chin. People make a big deal out of him reacting poorly to getting hit but the chin was solid, I think he'd adapt better to the striking over time.

I could see Brock holding that HW belt until DC came along and eventually took it from him.
 
I'm still disappointed we didn't get Cigano vs Brock, I was so pumped for that fight even though Carwin was a good replacement
 
He would still be at a disadvantage against good wrestlers that can punch. Randy did OK while it lasted and Carwin only lost because he punched himself out.

Maybe he could have taken Ubereem down and beat him, the Reem was kind of a front runner.
 
Against Reem it wasn't even punches that hurt him, I think he got hit with maybe 3 'power' punches the whole fight... it was a series of devastating KNEES TO THE GUT that folded Brock
 
DougieJones said:
Against Reem it wasn't even punches that hurt him, I think he got hit with maybe 3 'power' punches the whole fight... it was a series of devastating KNEES TO THE GUT that folded Brock
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Brock was just fulfilling a contractual obligation with that fight. His walkout was even weird, with him singing along to his song n' shit. Not the security guard shoving intense monster we had become accustomed to. His mind was elsewhere. I think Frank Mir even gave a bit of a "huh?" reaction to his performance, and said something like "Please fight me like that, Brock."

Of all his fights, that was the worst showing he ever made. Sure, Cain kicked his ass pretty good, but the effort was still there. He just folded against Overeem.
 
HereticBD said:
And Lesnar did the latter against Cain. He covered up and backpedaled against Carwin. These are not unique reactions fighters have when they get rocked. What would've been better? Especially against Carwin? Stand there and get KO'd?

Compared to who? Seasoned veteran Overeem literally turned his back and tried to run from a dude after getting rocked. GSP(arguable GOAT) tapped out, after getting rocked and spiraling out of control against Serra. There are thousands of examples of fighters looking out of sorts after a big shot. What is this mythological "appropriate" response by veteran fighters, to getting their brains scrambled, that Lesnar just didn't possess? Do I need to pull up some clips of those tough non-WWE affiliated "real fighters" looking stupid, after they got rocked? I mean, come on.

It's such a silly criticism.
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"Seasoned veteran" Overeem was well-known for having a soft chin, both as a pre-horse-meat LHW, and then as a HW. Bad choice.

Like I said, compared to other HW and other fighters, Brock would simply freeze and not "intelligently defend" more often.

And, no, it's not a silly critcism. That's a legitimate flaw as a fighter, and one that in a hypothetetical divirticulitus-free world, would still limit his potential results.

Not saying it makes him shitty, not saying he's an awful person because of it, just that that's a "c-h-i-n-k" (dashes added because the site thinks it's a racial reference) in the armor that has nothing to do with him eating too much meat and 'roids, and not enough roughage.
 
fzoid4454 said:
"Seasoned veteran" Overeem was well-known for having a soft chin, both as a pre-horse-meat LHW, and then as a HW. Bad choice.

Like I said, compared to other HW and other fighters, Brock would simply freeze and not "intelligently defend" more often.
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Who? You've already excused one veteran fighter from literally running away from an opponent after being hit. What HW fighter reacts in some mythical stoic way, when they get rocked? I've already gone down the list of times Brock got hit and didn't panic or "freeze", so who are these mythological figures who just eat haymakers and just shrug them off?

I mean, Fedor was all out of whack after being smoked by Fujita. Is that one of his flaws, or do you forgive it because he won...like Lesnar did against Carwin?
fzoid4454 said:
And, no, it's not a silly critcism. That's a legitimate flaw as a fighter, and one that in a hypothetetical divirticulitus-free world, would still limit his potential results.
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But I'm saying you have yet to prove that "flaw". There were two times Lesnar acted out of sorts after being hit. They were both big shots that nailed him on the button. What about all the other strikes he ate, and didn't lose focus?
 
HereticBD said:
Who? You've already excused one veteran fighter from literally running away from an opponent after being hit. What HW fighter reacts in some mythical stoic way, when they get rocked? I've already gone down the list of times Brock got hit and didn't panic or "freeze", so who are these mythological figures who just eat haymakers and just shrug them off?

I mean, Fedor was all out of whack after being smoked by Fujita. Is that one of his flaws, or do you forgive it because he won...like Lesnar did against Carwin?

But I'm saying you have yet to prove that "flaw". There were two times Lesnar acted out of sorts after being hit. They were both big shots that nailed him on the button. What about all the other strikes he ate, and didn't lose focus?
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You hand wave away evidence offered, and put up an overly simplistic comparison of apples to oranges, claiming they're the same thing. So, really, what would the point be?

Again, I'm not criticizing for just getting rocked, even though you keep dishonestly pretending that. When Fujita rocked Fedor, he didn't just put his hands up by his head and crouch. He immediately, drunkenly reached out and clinched, even out on his feet. That is exactly the difference I'm talking about, so, good example for what I'm saying, not so much for you.

Do I have to start listing fights were someone completely rocked and even out on their feet land meaningful shots that turn or win the fight? Or responded in an effective defensive way that helped them survive BECAUSE of their response? In order for that to happen, they obviously don't just turtle up and do nothing else, right?

Cheick Kongo/Pat Barry would be an obvious example.
 
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Brock was severely allergic to getting punched in the face and kicked in the liver.
 
His career would have likely been the same. None of the things you talked about have anything to do with his inability to respond well to getting hit/hurt. Overeem shits in him and so does cain. He also didn't have great hands. The biggest what if is had he learn to box when he was younger.
 
ocfightfan said:
Brock was severely allergic to getting punched in the face and kicked in the liver.
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That's only because he was new to the sport. That's a noobs reaction to getting punched. Even so he was very impressive.
 
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