Crime What did the cops do wrong today Megathread Vol. 6 ? (who knows, lots of cop threads)

[Stoic1]

"Motherfucker, i'm gonna choke you you out"

Proceeds to choke guy to death.

And then suddenly, for no reason at all, people didn't trust or believe police anymore.

I especially liked one of the comments, "if half of the officers did their job the other half would be in prison."

Cops walked with no disciplinary action.

 

[lifelessheap]

For every one interaction where the cops are in the wrong, there are thousands of other ones where cops are doing the right thing and the public is fucking insane.

I regularly watch body cam videos. The amount of bullshit that cops have to deal with on the daily is unreal. I couldn't do that job, I would start curb stomping people after two weeks. They get treated like complete shit and attacked all of the time over basic ass interactions that the criminal escalates into a huge issue, and have to just take it and be nice while it's happening.

We need more no-nonsense cops IMO. Sometimes police brutality is warranted.

This is the total back the blue until it happens to you post. They will wreck you while you kneel and try to swallow the whole boot.

 

[IanEdwards]

They sign up for that job. They get paid very well for that job.

do they? I feel like in the U|K Police pay is pretty poor. mind you, i guess in a country where there are more guns than people policing comes with a danger premium $$$ attached

 

[DoctorTaco]

do they? I feel like in the U|K Police pay is pretty poor. mind you, i guess in a country where there are more guns than people policing comes with a danger premium $$$ attached

In the United States guys will often make tons of cash playing the overtime game. Considering you only need a high school diploma to qualify it is one of the best paying jobs you can get with no prior experience or formal education

 

[Sinister]

In the United States guys will often make tons of cash playing the overtime game. Considering you only need a high school diploma to qualify it is one of the best paying jobs you can get with no prior experience or formal education

I actually dont think Cop jobs pay enough. IMO they need higher base salaries, and education thresholds. Incentivization to attract a better qualify of applicant. And even then there will still be quite a few applicants who are racist/classist enough to get a degree so they can make $200-$250k beating and killing poor people, but there wont be the same level of goon squad bullsh*t going on now.

 

[lifelessheap]

This bitch as cops will try to ruin your life any way possible. It doesn't matter if you are sober. They will try to fucking destroy your life.

 

[DoctorTaco]

I actually dont think Cop jobs pay enough. IMO they need higher base salaries, and education thresholds. Incentivization to attract a better qualify of applicant. And even then there will still be quite a few applicants who are racist/classist enough to get a degree so they can make $200-$250k beating and killing poor people, but there wont be the same level of goon squad bullsh*t going on now.

No argument here. Raise the pay, raise the standard of expectation. Take half the shit they’re expected to deal with off of their plate and give it to other civil servants with specialized training

 

[gatchaman]

No argument here. Raise the pay, raise the standard of expectation. Take half the shit they’re expected to deal with off of their plate and give it to other civil servants with specialized training

Excuse my interjection, but I don't think that raising pay is the answer. "Raise the pay" really means: Reduce the numbers.

When there was a problem with flash mobs (formerly known as swarming) over ten years ago on South Street, Philadelphia, deployment of hundreds of officers totally extinguished the problem.

Compare that to my city of Edmonton, where cops are paid over twice as much money per officer but can't secure a similarly sized (number of stops compared to number of intersections) LRT line.

The real solution is to remove qualified immunity and require officers to carry liability insurance like doctors and nurses. The average cost of the insurance could be reimbursed, hopefully at less than the amounts of tax-funded settlements on behalf of the qualified immune. Bad officers who exceed the average cost would be priced out of business by increasing premiums.

 

[My Spot]

Cops in my suburban area start out at roughly $54k. Cops in Atlanta start out at roughly $61k. I don't think the extra $7k annually would be worth the extra headaches.
Ideally, the average cop would live in the city where they work.

 

[Sinister]

Excuse my interjection, but I don't think that raising pay is the answer. "Raise the pay" really means: Reduce the numbers.

When there was a problem with flash mobs (formerly known as swarming) over ten years ago on South Street, Philadelphia, deployment of hundreds of officers totally extinguished the problem.

Compare that to my city of Edmonton, where cops are paid over twice as much money per officer but can't secure a similarly sized (number of stops compared to number of intersections) LRT line.

The real solution is to remove qualified immunity and require officers to carry liability insurance like doctors and nurses. The average cost of the insurance could be reimbursed, hopefully at less than the amounts of tax-funded settlements on behalf of the qualified immune. Bad officers who exceed the average cost would be priced out of business by increasing premiums.

Edmonton doesnt have anything to do with this. The hiring standards in the US are garbage. And we are drastically over-policed in numerous cities. Just take Vegas as an example, there is Metro, and then UNLV have their own department of Metro as does the Strip, complete with different uniforms. Then we have Sheriff's office. Then we have Marshal's office. And we have Nevada State Police on the highways. Recently the Marshals got in trouble because they made a Highway stop with no jurisdiction, which they've been increasingly doing, where they have no jurisdiction. The State Police were on-scene and did nothing to stop them.

You want more Cops and better hiring standards with higher pay to attract better candidates? You reduce the amount of militarized equipment they have. That's where the money goes in the US.

 

[Sinister]

Cops in my suburban area start out at roughly $54k. Cops in Atlanta start out at roughly $61k. I don't think the extra $7k annually would be worth the extra headaches.
Ideally, the average cop would live in the city where they work.

I'd want them paid closer to $100k. $54k to risk your life in gunfights is garbage

 

[My Spot]

I'd want them paid closer to $100k. $54k to risk your life in gunfights is garbage

Gunfights in the burbs? The biggest crime here recently was someone stealing $60k worth of Pokemon cards.

 

[Sinister]

Gunfights in the burbs? The biggest crime here recently was someone stealing $60k worth of Pokemon cards.

Implied risk of being a 1st responder. Doesnt matter how safe it is. If I'm supposed to be the one to engage you're gonna pay me well. Otherwise you get people who dont take the job seriously, they're working a job just to make the check., which sucks.

 

[gatchaman]

Edmonton doesnt have anything to do with this. The hiring standards in the US are garbage. And we are drastically over-policed in numerous cities. Just take Vegas as an example, there is Metro, and then UNLV have their own department of Metro as does the Strip, complete with different uniforms. Then we have Sheriff's office. Then we have Marshal's office. And we have Nevada State Police on the highways. Recently the Marshals got in trouble because they made a Highway stop with no jurisdiction, which they've been increasingly doing, where they have no jurisdiction. The State Police were on-scene and did nothing to stop them.

You want more Cops and better hiring standards with higher pay to attract better candidates? You reduce the amount of militarized equipment they have. That's where the money goes in the US.

I don't know why you want to dismiss Edmonton. I've had the same experience in Beijing and Shanghai, where there are even more cops just standing around than there are in Center City, Philadelphia. And Chinese cops probably make less than a fifth of what Philadelphia cops make. Just the physical presence of security in overwhelming numbers is a major deterrent to crime. When Scarborough Town Centre, Toronto had a problem with swarming in the mall, a police station was built right in the mall, and the swarming problem disappeared.

And you haven't addressed the other half of my argument, which was for individual liability insurance for officers (like already exists for doctors and nurses) replacing qualified immunity. The problem of acting with no jurisdiction would also disappear if cops could be individually sued for their misdeeds.

 

[DoctorTaco]

Excuse my interjection, but I don't think that raising pay is the answer. "Raise the pay" really means: Reduce the numbers.

When there was a problem with flash mobs (formerly known as swarming) over ten years ago on South Street, Philadelphia, deployment of hundreds of officers totally extinguished the problem.

Compare that to my city of Edmonton, where cops are paid over twice as much money per officer but can't secure a similarly sized (number of stops compared to number of intersections) LRT line.

The real solution is to remove qualified immunity and require officers to carry liability insurance like doctors and nurses. The average cost of the insurance could be reimbursed, hopefully at less than the amounts of tax-funded settlements on behalf of the qualified immune. Bad officers who exceed the average cost would be priced out of business by increasing premiums.

Interject away, it’s always worth having earnest and thoughtful contributions to a discussion.

Hear me out- let’s end qualified immunity AND pay cops better. If we hold them to higher standards and offer better pay we will get better people being cops.

Cops in my suburban area start out at roughly $54k. Cops in Atlanta start out at roughly $61k. I don't think the extra $7k annually would be worth the extra headaches.
Ideally, the average cop would live in the city where they work.

Extra pay for night shift, rubber stamped overtime- most cops I know game the system and clear 70-100k+ annually.

 

[gatchaman]

Interject away, it’s always worth having earnest and thoughtful contributions to a discussion.

Hear me out- let’s end qualified immunity AND pay cops better. If we hold them to higher standards and offer better pay we will get better people being cops.

Extra pay for night shift, rubber stamped overtime- most cops I know game the system and clear 70-100k+ annually.

You haven't addressed the problem of better pay, fewer cops, less dissuasion of crime by police presence (See South Street, Scarborough Town Centre, Shanghai, Beijing, etc).

 

[DoctorTaco]

You haven't addressed the problem of better pay, fewer cops, less dissuasion of crime by police presence (See South Street, Scarborough Town Centre, Shanghai, Beijing, etc).

If the city isn’t paying out settlements then there’s plenty of money to pay cops more and have the appropriate number for the city. Especially if you start paring down what they are called out for and have other specialists responding to non criminal and non violent calls.

 

[gatchaman]

If the city isn’t paying out settlements then there’s plenty of money to pay cops more and have the appropriate number for the city. Especially if you start paring down what they are called out for and have other specialists responding to non criminal and non violent calls.

I reject your speculation that higher pay equals fewer settlements.

I agree that there should be different categories of policing. I think detectives should be paid more than beat cops, but it is beat cops that are needed in large numbers to engage in preventative policing.

To achieve preventative policing (of the kind done in downtown Beijing and Shanghai) you need a huge low paid security force to put the boots on the ground. The police I'm talking about in Beijing and Shanghai don't even have guns, but their numbers send the message that you are not going to get away with any nonsense.

 

[DoctorTaco]

I reject your speculation that higher pay equals fewer settlements.

Ending qualified immunity equals fewer settlements.

 

[Sinister]

I don't know why you want to dismiss Edmonton. I've had the same experience in Beijing and Shanghai, where there are even more cops just standing around than there are in Center City, Philadelphia. And Chinese cops probably make less than a fifth of what Philadelphia cops make. Just the physical presence of security in overwhelming numbers is a major deterrent to crime. When Scarborough Town Centre, Toronto had a problem with swarming in the mall, a police station was built right in the mall, and the swarming problem disappeared.

And you haven't addressed the other half of my argument, which was for individual liability insurance for officers (like already exists for doctors and nurses) replacing qualified immunity. The problem of acting with no jurisdiction would also disappear if cops could be individually sued for their misdeeds.

The US is not China, nor Canada, that's why I dismiss them. You're referring to an extremely policed Country that has the highest population of prisoners or any developed Nation and behaving as if we have some sort of shortage of policing. We also have surveillance essentially everywhere. We ALSO have had a reduction in crime over the last 30 years despite unending cries that crime is out of control by people looking to use that false assertion as a political cudgel. Our current police forces are often overworked, underpaid, undertrained, and undereducated. No thanks on more of those roaming the streets. System overhaul first.

I dont buy the "strong targets" argument, I mentioned earlier how UNLV has their own branch of Metro located on campus, yeah they still had an active shooter situation there and the area around UNLV is a high crime area. In fact in almost every American City I've lived in areas around police departments are often dumps with elevated crime rates. From everything I've read the biggest indicator of crime is wealth disparity + proximity. Poor communities with high crime rates tend to be over-policed here.

I'm all for ending qualified immunity and implementing insurance. That's what we have as boxing Coaches, well our insurance is guaranteed by USA Boxing, which puts your licensing at risk if you're behaving irresponsibly. However, police often play politics to get their jobs back even after they egregiously commit crimes.