WESTWORLD Season 2

Easily the best episode of the season (admittedly not saying much). The Dolores and Meave plot lines are really weak but I enjoy young/old William and Bernard.
 
GearSolidMetal said:
For those who've seen the second season of True Detective, was it as bad as the second season of Westworld, three episodes in?
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I would say True Detective season 2 was better. That being said its not good.
 
Zanatos333 said:
Easily the best episode of the season (admittedly not saying much). The Dolores and Meave plot lines are really weak but I enjoy young/old William and Bernard.
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The only intriguing thing about this show is Ed Harris fucking robots up and unraveling the mysteries of the park.

This episode was good because it didn't have any of the god awful boring/cringey robot uprising storylines with Dolores and Thandie Newton that made every other episode this season unbearable shit.
 
Verace said:
I dont think so. I think they have hinted at this pretty clearly throughout episode 2. And i think it connects with the weapon thingy. [SPOILER AHEAD] In the teasers for this season there were more scenes that showed James Delos doing stuff that lead to believe uploading his concience into a host body to save himself from dying from the illness was an actual thing. And it may be through this thing both dolores and MIB are trying to get to. We'll have to wait and see. [END OF SPOILER]
William mentioned to James during the party where dolores is playing the piano that they were close, and James says something along the lines of "some people have more time than others".
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So you were right with this. It annoys me because either I just missed it or brushed it off as irrelevant (quite possible), or the show didn't really do a good job of leading us to this. Either way, this episode really put the focus on the idea of immortality through host conversion.

But, there's one HUGE question opened up with this. There's two obvious things that the James Delos clone(?) is: he's a built from scratch new model of host programmed to act like Delos; or he's either an uploaded consciousness direct from the dying Delos.

If it's the first, then the idea is a little underwhelming, which is possibly why I (subconsciously?) chose to ignore it. Having a robot that thinks and acts like me still isn't me. It doesn't benefit me to have an effective clone, as I will still die. I wouldn't particularly care what my clone would accomplish after I died. Maybe Delos is concerned with legacy (certainly would fit the stereotype), and fooling the world for a time to think he'd accomplished immortality might be something he'd appreciate. But, he'd still be smart enough to know that he won't get to personally experience any real benefit to it; he's dead.

The second would be the real goal. Transferring your mind to an immortal vessel would certainly make sense as an obsessive goal for a lot of people. That's true immortality of the mind. But if this is somehow possible, it opens up some questions. First, there has to be some interface between the human mind and the computer where it's stored. This is a huge technological leap that has yet to be hinted at on the show. It would presumably also be an evolving technology that would have more mundane applications at first, such as prosthesis integration or mental health applications. Certainly these would be worthwhile money makers as well that the company would exploit. Also, does the transfer of consciousness kill the original body? If not, then it's effectively just another clone, the original body still lives, and someone still has to die. This is sort of a philosophical "problem" for a lot of stories that have things like stored consciousness (Altered Carbon) or teleportation (Start Trek): is having a clone that thinks it actually is you the same thing as you? Does teleporting you effectively kill you and create a new version of you that thinks and behaves the same? Or is it actually you? Theseus' ship.

On the other front with Bernard (hey Elsie's back!), I get what they're doing there. But I'm getting confused on the timeline. How long ago did Bernard kill all those lab techs before returning with Elsie? It couldn't have been long, as there's no appreciable signs of decay when he returns the second time. How long was Elsie chained up? Did he do the lab massacre at the same time he brought Elsie there? And how many times has he been there? At least twice, but maybe three? There's the first time when he killed them all and the second time when he was there with Elsie. This also has to be after his "injury" since she injects brain goo in him. But, there was that one little weird bit with how he mentioned he wasn't really there with Elsie while she shot the lab door out. Was that a third time he was there after being there with Elsie? Or was that just his memory issues that he's experiencing? If it is a third instance, which instance, the second or third, was the time Clementine dragged him there? Maybe I'm reading too much into that little exchange. Also, how long was the (presumably) 149th Delos 'bot decaying in there before Elsie barbecued him? Did that last interview with William/MiB happen before the first season?

I also forgot that it wasn't ghost nation that took Elsie; it was (hinted at) Bernard.

This episode was narratively much better but also seemed clumsy.
 
GearSolidMetal said:
For those who've seen the second season of True Detective, was it as bad as the second season of Westworld, three episodes in?
Click to expand...

Inasmuch as it didn't live up to the first season, the second season of True Detective was worse than the second season of Westworld.

That isn't to say it's bad, though. I still enjoyed the second season enough to finish it. But it wasn't anywhere near the masterpiece that the first season was. True Detective season 1 is gold, maybe the best season of TV I've ever watched.
 
this episode was better than the ones before, things start making some sense, but there are still too many jumps
 
osudude said:
Also, how long was the (presumably) 149th Delos 'bot decaying in there before Elsie barbecued him? Did that last interview with William/MiB happen before the first season?
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I figured that last interview took place shortly before the beginning of season 1. Willaim's wife (Delos' daughter) had already killed herself by that point. Then some time after that (also before season 1) Ford sent Bernard there to kill the humans and destroy the worker hosts. Ford probably programmed Barnard to leave Elsie there specifically, as well as programming Clementine to drag Bernard there, so that he and Elsie would discover what was there.

I realized that this new character William's daughter has actually met Delores before. During the flashback to the party where William brought Delores to play piano a little girl came up to her and said she was pretty, then I think Delores asked her name, but before she answered she was called over by her mother. That little girl is the lady who ran from the tiger in the Indian world. I wonder if them having met previously will get brought up.
 
Last edited:
Found this on reddit. Up to date timeline (with a couple of minor mistakes) via http://www.thisisinsider.com/westworld-timeline-spoilers-2018-4

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chickenluver said:
I figured that last interview took place shortly before the beginning of season 1. Willaim's wife (Delos' daughter) had already killed herself by that point. Then some time after that (also before season 1) Ford sent Bernard there to kill the humans and destroy the worker hosts. Ford probably programmed Berbard to leave Elsie there specifically, as well as programming Clementine to drag Bernard there, so that he and Elsie would discover what was there.
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That would make sense but it also puts some constraints on the timing that might be hard to put together without some, albeit minor, timing holes.

I noted that the bodies in the lab showed no signs of decomposition. At least Elsie didn't make any faces about a stink, and the blood was still red. So, at most, Bernard committed the massacre just a few days (which might even be generous) before going back in with Elsie. So, if this happened immediately before season 1 began, it puts a short timeframe on how long it all took all the events Bernard was involved in, as well as old William arriving, doing his adventures about the maze, and the beginning parts of season 2.

I guess it's also possible the massacre took place in the middle of season 1, like immediately before he kidnapped Elsie or maybe even at the same time. So, how long was Elsie tied up for? And how is he going to and from these remote park places?

They're going to have to very carefully piece these things all together.
 
osudude said:
That would make sense but it also puts some constraints on the timing that might be hard to put together without some, albeit minor, timing holes.

I noted that the bodies in the lab showed no signs of decomposition. At least Elsie didn't make any faces about a stink, and the blood was still red. So, at most, Bernard committed the massacre just a few days (which might even be generous) before going back in with Elsie. So, if this happened immediately before season 1 began, it puts a short timeframe on how long it all took all the events Bernard was involved in, as well as old William arriving, doing his adventures about the maze, and the beginning parts of season 2.

I guess it's also possible the massacre took place in the middle of season 1, like immediately before he kidnapped Elsie or maybe even at the same time. So, how long was Elsie tied up for? And how is he going to and from these remote park places?

They're going to have to very carefully piece these things all together.
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I figured the massacre was immediately after he dropped off Elsie and he's only been gone a day or two because that's how long it's been since the hosts went nuts?

So he's just been there twice. Once to drop off Elsie and do the work and massacre and again to collect Elsie.
 
Sounds like i need to see the new episode.

Im not even excited for it anymore after episode 2

Edit i mean episode 3
 
So it looks like William/Man in Black really is a cyborg. He probably try and get his young body back, transfer his consciousness into that one, and go be with Dolores.

Now we getting into Altered Carbon territory.
 
GearSolidMetal said:
For those who've seen the second season of True Detective, was it as bad as the second season of Westworld, three episodes in?
Click to expand...

I would say no, although it's hard to compare for me. I don't think the first season of "Westworld" was such hot shit to begin with, so the quality of this season isn't such a drastic drop for me. I think it's merely maintaining it's mediocrity, that was carried over from the last half of the first season.
 
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