WelterWeight division situation

[Kvothe_the_kingkiller]

Burns is fighting WB in a little over 3 weeks, our assumptions are if WB wins, he will be next in line for a title shot. But if Burns wins, will he not be entitled? Even though he has already had his shot. Seems a bit off, if WB gets a shot if he wins, and Burns doesn't.

This is not uncommon at all.

The rest of the post is pretty solid. It IS an exciting division, but could be so much more exciting if the top fighters weren't all cherry picking and avoiding each other and getting rewarded with title shots for doing so. It needs to be repeated 10,000x, Dana shares much blame for a lot of these shenanigans, by rewarding them (e.g. Colby and Masvidal title shots, even way back to rewarding Woodley for sitting out with a title shot against Lawler).

 

[GueseGuy]

Lmfaoooo imagine looking at this and thinking these are actually the best WWs in the world. Several guys in PFL and Bellator would smoke these dudes. You UFC casuals are clueless honestly.

 

[fullspar]

This is not uncommon at all.

The rest of the post is pretty solid. It IS an exciting division, but could be so much more exciting if the top fighters weren't all cherry picking and avoiding each other and getting rewarded with title shots for doing so. It needs to be repeated 10,000x, Dana shares much blame for a lot of these shenanigans, by rewarding them (e.g. Colby and Masvidal title shots, even way back to rewarding Woodley for sitting out with a title shot against Lawler).

Yeah that's true I guess, when one is ranked higher, more deserving etc. I did think that.

And I agree, I do not understand Dana sometimes. He wants to make big money fights, and make money, yet he wont get Colby to fight Mas, or have some other WW fighters face each other. I doubt its that hard to make them fight each other. I am sure Colby V Mas would be as big a draw as Colby V Usman 2, or very close.

And as fighters, you would've thought they would try maximise earning by fighting more, as opposed to waiting for the title fight they will inevitably lose. Surely it can pay of that much, but I guess they think if they can win, then its life changing.

 

[KOPPE]

Wonderboy to school on Burns to try and weasel out of the Colby rematch,

Colbys only win in top10 is twood.
He doesn't deserve it at all.
WB, Burns 2, hell even Leon is more deserving than Duckngton

 

[Kvothe_the_kingkiller]

And I agree, I do not understand Dana sometimes. He wants to make big money fights, and make money, yet he wont get Colby to fight Mas, or have some other WW fighters face each other. I doubt its that hard to make them fight each other. I am sure Colby V Mas would be as big a draw as Colby V Usman 2, or very close.

Oh I think it's very hard to make them fight each other. But he cannot force them to fight each other. He can only incentivize and disincentivize them to sign.

But letting Colby only fight once - probably the biggest named weakest top 10 fighter on the roster - between title fights incentivizes the holdouts. Allowing Masvidal to duck Colby and Edwards and giving him a title shot instead does the same.

We get it. Dana works for short term big money fights. That's how he defines his job, and he's good at it. But let's give credit where credit is due. These guys are holding out because they've figured out Dana's game, and he is an active participant. In fact, I would argue he (and his policies, or lack thereof) is the biggest culprit, and deserves the most blame. That's all I'm saying.

I guess I'm just frustrated that the guys in the top 5 are refusing to fight each other and holding out for title shots. Fuck that. The risk of holding out is having your bluff called.

/rant

 

[laleggenda27]

The problem is that most of the top WWs have been avoiding each other. It's thrown everything out of whack and left us with no one who is truly deserving of a title shot. And the idea of Colby getting a rematch after a single win and a year of inactivity would just be nonsense.

In my opinion, they should wait for the Wonderboy/Burns fight to play out. If Wonderboy wins, he gets the next shot. He'd be on a 3-fight win streak against top 10 opponents, a win over Burns would be better than any of Edwards' wins and better than Colby's win over Woodley, and WB would be a fresh matchup for Usman. In this case, Colby fights Edwards for the next shot.

If Burns beats Wonderboy, then Edwards gets the title shot. And Colby fights Burns for the next shot.

Meanwhile, Luque-Chiesa is already scheduled. They should go ahead and make Masvidal-Nate 2 and Belal-Magny. Suddenly the division would be moving and everything would make sense. Which is why it probably won't happen.

 

[fullspar]

Oh I think it's very hard to make them fight each other. But he cannot force them to fight each other. He can only incentivize and disincentivize them to sign.

But letting Colby only fight once - probably the biggest named weakest top 10 fighter on the roster - between title fights incentivizes the holdouts. Allowing Masvidal to duck Colby and Edwards and giving him a title shot instead does the same.

We get it. Dana works for short term big money fights. That's how he defines his job, and he's good at it. But let's give credit where credit is due. These guys are holding out because they've figured out Dana's game, and he is an active participant. In fact, I would argue he (and his policies, or lack thereof) is the biggest culprit, and deserves the most blame. That's all I'm saying.

I guess I'm just frustrated that the guys in the top 5 are refusing to fight each other and holding out for title shots. Fuck that. The risk of holding out is having your bluff called.

/rant

Yeah it makes sense, and if he forced them to fight, or tried, it could also back fire on the quick big money fights if he has a list of 5 or more fighters with recent losses. I guess this way he has a list of fighters with at least a few wins under their belt, who could all be called upon for the big fight.

 

[fullspar]

The problem is that most of the top WWs have been avoiding each other. It's thrown everything out of whack and left us with no one who is truly deserving of a title shot. And the idea of Colby getting a rematch after a single win and a year of inactivity would just be nonsense.

In my opinion, they should wait for the Wonderboy/Burns fight to play out. If Wonderboy wins, he gets the next shot. He'd be on a 3-fight win streak against top 10 opponents, a win over Burns would be better than any of Edwards' wins and better than Colby's win over Woodley, and WB would be a fresh matchup for Usman. In this case, Colby fights Edwards for the next shot.

If Burns beats Wonderboy, then Edwards gets the title shot. And Colby fights Burns for the next shot.

Meanwhile, Luque-Chiesa is already scheduled. They should go ahead and make Masvidal-Nate 2 and Belal-Magny. Suddenly the division would be moving and everything would make sense. Which is why it probably won't happen.

Whilst I agree mostly, my only concern for waiting for WB/Burns would mean we need to wait at least 6 months, maybe more. Usman has been very active recently, and am sure he could go in the next couple months, it will be around 3 months since he last fought when the WB/Burns fight happens. I guess we could wait, but I think he could fit one fight in between.

 

[laleggenda27]

Whilst I agree mostly, my only concern for waiting for WB/Burns would mean we need to wait at least 6 months, maybe more. Usman has been very active recently, and am sure he could go in the next couple months, it will be around 3 months since he last fought when the WB/Burns fight happens. I guess we could wait, but I think he could fit one fight in between.

Why would we need to wait "at least 6 months"? Wonderboy and Burns fight in less than 3 weeks. Assuming Wonderboy came out uninjured, I have no doubt he'd take a title fight with 2 or 3 months notice. If he refused, then you move on to Edwards and do WB-Colby.

 

[Dude Incredible]

I was gonna quote a bunch of you but there are a lot of great responses in this thread. And OP if he is done after 4 more fights, I'll be bummed but good for Usman if he calls it early-ish.

I assume Colby is actually getting the next shot (which I'm actually fine with) however @Herwald has an excellent point.
Usman vs Colby
Leon vs Winner of Burns/WB - winner #1 contender
And any one of these: Luque vs Belal , Luque vs Chiesa, Chiesa vs Belal

 

[fullspar]

Why would we need to wait "at least 6 months"? Wonderboy and Burns fight in less than 3 weeks. Assuming Wonderboy came out uninjured, I have no doubt he'd take a title fight with 2 or 3 months notice. If he refused, then you move on to Edwards and do WB-Colby.

Yeah maybe, but it seems Usman is the one of few who is fighting that often, not only in WW but in the whole UFC. WB fights max twice per year, as most fighters, some once. I guess if a title shot is presented he would have to.

 

[fullspar]

I was gonna quote a bunch of you but there are a lot of great responses in this thread. And OP if he is done after 4 more fights, I'll be bummed but good for Usman if he calls it early-ish.

I assume Colby is actually getting the next shot (which I'm actually fine with) however @Herwald has an excellent point.
Usman vs Colby
Leon vs Winner of Burns/WB - winner #1 contender
And any one of these: Luque vs Belal , Luque vs Chiesa, Chiesa vs Belal

Well he is on 4 defences now, so to tie George he needs 5 more. He could do it with CC 2, WB, Leon, then Luque/Bilal/Chiesa or even Khamzat if he got that far.
It is certainly doable going off his recent performances, and even go for 10 defences. 5 or 6 more defences is a big risk, he could do it but could quite easily lose.
He is 34, and would need to another 2/3 years to do it. As others have mentioned in other posts, Leon and others are younger and have age on their side.

If Burns beat WB, I think Leon and Burns should fight for the number 1 contender spot. Or Leon just fights Mas, and gets it over with.
If WB wins he should get a shot, but I cannot see it going any different than is 2 attempts at T Wood.

 

[Herwald]

Colbys only win in top10 is twood.
He doesn't deserve it at all.
WB, Burns 2, hell even Leon is more deserving than Duckngton

Usman has proven lately that he can have fun performances vs anyone, so I'd like to see UFC mix it up and throw Wonderboy in there. Colby, I agree, has been a bit of a dust farmer - ducking Leon a couple of times didn't help.

If you look at the past few years, though, Leon and WB haven't been very active themselves. Burns didn't do much in the first fight to really make people want a rematch. And Usman stalled the entire division for Mas 2, when it should've been Colby by that point (or Colby vs Mas at TUF). Plus, their beef and the first fight is easier to use for promotion than these other options, so I get why Daner might want it more.

I'm down for whatever, though. I just want things to move forward.