War Room OT Discussion v2

[Fawlty]

Saves ever doing it in real life which probably saves some friendships. I find anytime people talk politics in real life, people end up angry at each other. People try to surround themselves with people they agree with and when they run into opposition, they get defensive and thus angry. This place lets me talk without worrying about that stuff cause usually people here have thicker skin or if they get mad at me, it's not the end of the world having someone I never met dislike "Lead".

There's nothing more annoying than an IRL heated political argument. But I like talking politics IRL way more than online. I can hang with almost anybody without getting rude or even annoyed, except family. That pretty much always goes to hell. But regular people I can have a nice talk for whatever reason. I think because their feelings and their little slice of face-to-face human experience actually matter to me in a way that online doesn't at all.

 

[senri]

25-30

djafglrehgou;ah;ruteogh;rhuaup;iri;ruiuy;gareiubeyriiari;vgygvlairgliygievgliyrev

 

[senri]

This got me thinking. How old are you guys? Talking about age brackets, not exact age. I am in my early to middle thirties.

Are you....

I can't remember to be honest with you.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Saves ever doing it in real life which probably saves some friendships. I find anytime people talk politics in real life, people end up angry at each other. People try to surround themselves with people they agree with and when they run into opposition, they get defensive and thus angry. This place lets me talk without worrying about that stuff cause usually people here have thicker skin or if they get mad at me, it's not the end of the world having someone I never met dislike "Lead".

I like talking politics in real life, but it is very different. If I'm talking to someone who doesn't really follow stuff that closely, I'll usually just kind of go along. And if it's someone I don't know that well, it's also mostly just polite. But if the other person knows their shit and likes it, I can get into it. Plus, I have some long-time friends and some family members that I can get into it with.

In that group, there are people I have big disagreements with, but no one who says the kind of stupid stuff we see here (Pizzagate, Seth Rich theories, denying obvious reality, various crazy Clinton CTs, etc.), and I never see the kind of deliberate misunderstanding of points that is pretty regular here (good recent example was with @Giblert). That's really where things get off the rails here--when you have complete idiots or people who don't argue honestly. And I never encounter either of those things in real life. I also never people in real life who are obsessed with college kids and Islam, while those things seem to be the most important things in the lives of some of the worst posters here.

 

[senri]

I like talking politics in real life, but it is very different. If I'm talking to someone who doesn't really follow stuff that closely, I'll usually just kind of go along. And if it's someone I don't know that well, it's also mostly just polite. But if the other person knows their shit and likes it, I can get into it. Plus, I have some long-time friends and some family members that I can get into it with.

In that group, there are people I have big disagreements with, but no one who says the kind of stupid stuff we see here (Pizzagate, Seth Rich theories, denying obvious reality, various crazy Clinton CTs, etc.), and I never see the kind of deliberate misunderstanding of points that is pretty regular here (good recent example was with @Giblert). That's really where things get off the rails here--when you have complete idiots or people who don't argue honestly. And I never encounter either of those things in real life. I also never people in real life who are obsessed with college kids and Islam, while those things seem to be the most important things in the lives of some of the worst posters here.

Do you talk politics while drinking wine Mr Savage?

 

[Lead]

I like talking politics in real life, but it is very different. If I'm talking to someone who doesn't really follow stuff that closely, I'll usually just kind of go along. And if it's someone I don't know that well, it's also mostly just polite. But if the other person knows their shit and likes it, I can get into it. Plus, I have some long-time friends and some family members that I can get into it with.

In that group, there are people I have big disagreements with, but no one who says the kind of stupid stuff we see here (Pizzagate, Seth Rich theories, denying obvious reality, various crazy Clinton CTs, etc.), and I never see the kind of deliberate misunderstanding of points that is pretty regular here (good recent example was with @Giblert). That's really where things get off the rails here--when you have complete idiots or people who don't argue honestly. And I never encounter either of those things in real life. I also never people in real life who are obsessed with college kids and Islam, while those things seem to be the most important things in the lives of some of the worst posters here.

Other than my family, the people I run into seem so outside of it that if they get into a conversation about it, they get defensive and angry fast which I find odd if they aren't that into it but I think part of that act is the more you act emotional might mean people think you really devote a lot of time and thus are passionate about it and thus know a lot about what's going on which I often find it's the opposite. I have one friend I talk politics with but he's a very relaxed person in general. With my family, it gets brought up a lot and I usually sit out but I'm almost at the point of trying to turn the subject if it starts up since the election happened. My sisters side of the family had a meltdown and started implying my/ our parents were racist. Was a really shitty month family wise but I think most of its passed now.

I agree you can run into some odd ideas in here. It's both a good and bad thing. I dont mind the Islam and college student material but I don't get why it must be spammed so much. Like I don't need to see five threads about different specific stabbing incidents followed by 100 "knife of peace" comments. Have a single thread about statistics of Islamic violence in a certain area, etc. We get the latter sometimes but far too often the dumb antedoctal threads where the premise makes it impossible to even have a real debate.

Which reminds me, that is why I hated the Zimmerman Martin trail so much and any other trial the media latches onto. You shouldn't take an issue and have it all laid over a specific case. It's the worst thing you could do if you really want justice for a case but the media does it all the time. From day 1 of that event, you had both sides immediately picking the one that fit their viewpoint on the national issues at large and applying it to the case. It's disguising and isn't logical at all. Zimmerman could've been guilty and it doesn't mean all cop or mixed race violence is based on race. He could've been innocent and it doesn't mean there isn't that either. To place that national issue on one case is moronic.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Other than my family, the people I run into seem so outside of it that if they get into a conversation about it, they get defensive and angry fast which I find odd if they aren't that into it but I think part of that act is the more you act emotional might mean people think you really devote a lot of time and thus are passionate about it and thus know a lot about what's going on which I often find it's the opposite. I have one friend I talk politics with but he's a very relaxed person in general. With my family, it gets brought up a lot and I usually sit out but I'm almost at the point of trying to turn the subject if it starts up since the election happened. My sisters side of the family had a meltdown and started implying my/ our parents were racist. Was a really shitty month family wise but I think most of its passed now.

Damn, that's unfortunate. For me, it's old friends, some co-workers, and family members who are really plugged in and smart and like to hash shit out, but we only have one kind of crazy uncle who gets really heated. He likes me, though, because my approach with him is more asking questions (to expose holes) than coming at him direct. I have another uncle that's pretty far left (former law professor at Berkeley). I've mentioned this before, but I asked him once if getting rich changed his politics, and he said, "yeah, I used to favor violent revolution, but now I support a peaceful transition to socialism." He really doesn't get along with that other uncle.

I agree you can run into some odd ideas in here. It's both a good and bad thing. I dont mind the Islam and college student material but I don't get why it must be spammed so much. Like I don't need to see five threads about different specific stabbing incidents followed by 100 "knife of peace" comments. Have a single thread about statistics of Islamic violence in a certain area, etc. We get the latter sometimes but far too often the dumb antedoctal threads where the premise makes it impossible to even have a real debate.

100% agreed with this and the part I snipped.

 

[Lead]

Damn, that's unfortunate. For me, it's family members who are really plugged in and smart and like to hash shit out, but we only have one kind of crazy uncle who gets really heated. He likes me, though, because my approach with him is more asking questions (to expose holes) than coming at him direct. I have another uncle that's pretty far left (former law professor at Berkeley). I've mentioned this before, but I asked him once if getting rich changed his politics, and he said, "yeah, I used to favor violent revolution, but now I support a peaceful transition to socialism." He really doesn't get along with that other uncle.



100% agreed with this and the part I snipped.

Questions usually are a safer way to approach those conversations. It starts them reflecting on their own thoughts first rather than what is their view and your view. Seems far less confrontational

 

[Jack V Savage]

Questions usually are a safer way to approach those conversations. It starts them reflecting on their own thoughts first rather than what is their view and your view. Seems far less confrontational

Yeah, that works best. I also argue politics with the president of my company (he's a right-leaning moderate). That usually takes the form of one of us recommending a book or article and then asking about it. So it's kind of a step removed. Like he'll say, "I thought this was really well-argued but I'm sure you'll disagree with it. Where did the guy go wrong?" Or I'll do the same. And we can hear out each other's points. Doesn't become an ego thing like it is here. People see someone point out a flaw in their argument and think, "this guy just said I'm stupid or somehow deficient as a person" and react accordingly. But with that other form, no one takes anything personally.

 

[Lead]

Yeah, that works best. I also argue politics with the president of my company (he's a right-leaning moderate). That usually takes the form of one of us recommending a book or article and then asking about it. So it's kind of a step removed. Like he'll say, "I thought this was really well-argued but I'm sure you'll disagree with it. Where did the guy go wrong?" Or I'll do the same. And we can hear out each other's points.

I think you find most success here when you do that. I may have actually started doing that because of you and not realized it til now. It's very effective and I usually don't want to seem hostile to those I argue with so it was easy to gravitate to.

 

[senri]

Questions usually are a safer way to approach those conversations. It starts them reflecting on their own thoughts first rather than what is their view and your view. Seems far less confrontational

Civility is overrated, sometimes you have to penetrate Mr Lead.

 

[Lead]

Civility is overrated, sometimes you have to penetrate Mr Lead.

No gay stuff senri

 

[senri]

No gay stuff senri

Don't be silly Mr Lead. I speak candidly with the poetry of life. Listen to the resonance of my essence. What i am illustrating can be pierced into the cortex of the Sapien, this will allow for beautiful subversion towards the truth. It can be done, eloquently and not so stealthy as you describe. This way you will never be held against someone accusing you of a beguiling nature.

 

[Lead]

Oh yeah, you're near Pittsburgh

Flyers fan here. Feels fucking bad man.

Yea. Philly is at least pretty level with their sports teams. We've got hockey and football but we've let the pirate be a shit team for about 20 years now and the owner doesn't give a shit.

Luckily I hate baseball

 

[KONE]

Yea. Philly is at least pretty level with their sports teams. We've got hockey and football but we've let the pirate be a shit team for about 20 years now and the owner doesn't give a shit.

Luckily I hate baseball

lol, well they're level in the sense that they haven't won anything for an eternity, aside from the Phillies but I only watch hockey and football.

Watching the Flyers blow up their team constantly and play like a middling, lethargic team for a few years now has been insufferable. At least some of my favorites went to other teams and won cups like Timonen and Gagne, but still

 

[Lead]

lol, well they're level in the sense that they haven't won anything for an eternity, aside from the Phillies but I only watch hockey and football.

Watching the Flyers blow up their team constantly and play like a middling, lethargic team for a few years now has been insufferable. At least some of my favorites went to other teams and won cups like Timonen and Gagne, but still

I think the pens purposely sucked so we could get Crosby and Malkin. Some of that was luck with the draft order but it's paid off with three cups now. I actually think the pens might be more popular here now than the steelers which is crazy to think but they did win all five cups in about 25 years

 

[Lead]

Anyone listen to MMA hour this week?

Cliffs
Joe Lauzon lectures Ariel on business and how whining doesn't solve problems
Faber foreshadows unintentionally his gym will go bankrupt in a year or never make money

 

[senri]

Anyone listen to MMA hour this week?

Cliffs
Joe Lauzon lectures Ariel on business and how whining doesn't solve problems
Faber foreshadows unintentionally his gym will go bankrupt in a year or never make money

I was making some routes for tonight. What else was being talked about?

 

[Jack V Savage]

Anyone listen to MMA hour this week?

Cliffs
Joe Lauzon lectures Ariel on business and how whining doesn't solve problems
Faber foreshadows unintentionally his gym will go bankrupt in a year or never make money

I'm really not the target audience for that. Don't care much about the business of MMA, not a fan of podcasts in general, and Faber is my least favorite fighter of all time. I also had a little thing with Helwani. Staredown.

 

[Lead]

I was making some routes for tonight. What else was being talked about?

I didn't get though it all. Winklejohn mostly saying holly will win this time, he swears. wandereli saying how much he hates Chael. Holloway is on it too but I didn't get to hear his cut

I'm really not the target audience for that. Don't care much about the business of MMA, not a fan of podcasts in general, and Faber is my least favorite fighter of all time. I also had a little thing with Helwani. Staredown.

I'm surprised how much I dislike helwani but enjoy the show. Nothing too eventful happens but the cards are better for me after hearing different guys talk on there. You get some of their personality out of it. And yea, I've always been annoyed with Faber and the only bad part of the Cruz- garbrant night was Faber all happy in the cage like he got a 1 up on Cruz.

I listen to podcasts too often. I'll find a week where I just cut it out entirely every once in awhile and it feels like a cleanse for my head. I think just having constant voices, whether music or podcasts running must not be too great for someone.

edit- electorate on staredown