Visited Valente Bros GJJ. 5 star

[sauron0379]

The instructor matches you up. It was a fundamental class but there were all belt colors

 

[Sexy Pants]

Different strokes- different folks

 

[FinBJJ]

I don't see how sparring with one opponent for 45 minutes differs that much from a sports focused school.
45 minutes is a pretty common time for rolling and you have to conserve energy even if you change partners. The 30 second break when changing partners doesn't make a difference.

 

[sauron0379]

@FinnBJJ. The difference is the goal. In sports BJJ, the time is not part of the strategy as opposed to self defense BJJ. Time is truly part of the weapon in Gracie Jiu jitsu. It is all about getting your opponent to tire before you begin to attack. In gracie Jiu jitsu the emphasis is closing distance to avoid taking strikes, even in the guard. Sports Jiu jitsu guards rely more on creating space and are more techincal. Gracie Jiu jitsu guards are more basic and are used to close distance to avoid getting hit.

 

[SuperSuperRambo]

Honestly, I'm glad you enjoy the experience there and I'm sure you'll learn a ton. But the belt system has the smell of youth sports: everyone gets a trophy because they tried. Can't say I'm big on that

It was actually Helio's method, at least for beginners. He had attendance cards and after a certain amount of classes you were promoted.

 

[SuperSuperRambo]

Aside from specific competition prep classes, I don't remember ever feeling like any of my training partners were counting points in their head while they rolled with me. Or maybe I just didn't recognize it because I never do it. Is that kind of thing common for BJJ players during regular sparring sessions?

But, you are doing things for the sake of scoring points, no? Like for example, you have the back but only one hook. Rather than work from there, you're focusing on securing the second hook, right? Or, say, turtling to prevent the pass? We are taught to do these things but the reasoning comes partly from how points are scored in tournaments. I have noticed a difference in style from guys who have no knowledge or experience in competition. They're more willing to give up things that would score in tournaments, and don't seem to work tactically to prevent them. And it doesn't make them worse off.

 

[lechien]

@FinnBJJ. The difference is the goal. In sports BJJ, the time is not part of the strategy as opposed to self defense BJJ. Time is truly part of the weapon in Gracie Jiu jitsu. It is all about getting your opponent to tire before you begin to attack. In gracie Jiu jitsu the emphasis is closing distance to avoid taking strikes, even in the guard. Sports Jiu jitsu guards rely more on creating space and are more techincal. Gracie Jiu jitsu guards are more basic and are used to close distance to avoid getting hit.

I know that you are an experienced grappler (wrestler).

How did you fare with sparring that one training partner for 45 minutes?

How many times did you tapped him out? How many did you tapped you out?

How many restrats?

 

[Calibur]

After the class, the sparring class started. No time limits, no points. It ended being a 45 minute sparring session non stop. IM sure evryone knows that the gracie's don't beleive in tournament rules, so sparring like this forces you to conserve energy, relying on an untrained person to tire and then make your move.

Everyone thinks longer sparring session= more realistic. If you wanted realistic you would have two people roll for an undisclosed random amount of time (preferablly between 7 and 90 seconds) where at any time several people can come in and scratch at you and your opponent while strawberry limeades get dumped on your head. Maybe throw in a falling lawn chair or two.

Than the winner has to explain why he had no choice BUT to put his opponent in an armbar. If the explanation is unacceptable (hint: don't lead with "he insulted my gilrfriend/wife") you go to jail and you spend the next month delibirating with your opponents lawyer how much you owe in hospital bills.

THAT is true self defense training.

 

[Balto]

Everyone thinks longer sparring session= more realistic. If you wanted realistic you would have two people roll for an undisclosed random amount of time (preferablly between 7 and 90 seconds) where at any time several people can come in and scratch at you and your opponent while strawberry limeades get dumped on your head. Maybe throw in a falling lawn chair or two.

Than the winner has to explain why he had no choice BUT to put his opponent in an armbar. If the explanation is unacceptable (hint: don't lead with "he insulted my gilrfriend/wife") you go to jail and you spend the next month delibirating with your opponents lawyer how much you owe in hospital bills.

THAT is true self defense training.

Truth

 

[Thai Otoshi]

I train at a GJJ school, but thankfully, the coach issues stripes at his own discretion, and you still have to test for promotion from belt to belt. You don't get auto promoted to blue/purple just because you attended the right amount of classes. You still have to know wtf you're doing.

Everyone thinks longer sparring session= more realistic. If you wanted realistic you would have two people roll for an undisclosed random amount of time (preferablly between 7 and 90 seconds) where at any time several people can come in and scratch at you and your opponent while strawberry limeades get dumped on your head. Maybe throw in a falling lawn chair or two.

Than the winner has to explain why he had no choice BUT to put his opponent in an armbar. If the explanation is unacceptable (hint: don't lead with "he insulted my gilrfriend/wife") you go to jail and you spend the next month delibirating with your opponents lawyer how much you owe in hospital bills.

THAT is true self defense training.

The truthiness is off the charts.

 

[StupidityKills]

Everyone thinks longer sparring session= more realistic. If you wanted realistic you would have two people roll for an undisclosed random amount of time (preferablly between 7 and 90 seconds) where at any time several people can come in and scratch at you and your opponent while strawberry limeades get dumped on your head. Maybe throw in a falling lawn chair or two.

Than the winner has to explain why he had no choice BUT to put his opponent in an armbar. If the explanation is unacceptable (hint: don't lead with "he insulted my gilrfriend/wife") you go to jail and you spend the next month delibirating with your opponents lawyer how much you owe in hospital bills.

THAT is true self defense training.

Sign me up.

 

[Alonbenav]

@lechien. 1 sparring partner. there was no time limit but it went 45 minutes. if a person taps, you start over from feet. If gloves are not worn, you can simulate slaps. Gracies are big on closing the distance in standing. Sparring for this long really forces you to dial things back and tire your opponent out. I can understand why alot of sport guys call Gracie style Jiu jitsu stalling. However, I also understand the concept, alow your opponent to tire and then submit him.

You seriously "understand this concept?"

I'd be blown away if the Gracies, or anyone else for that matter, could produce evidence of a street fight that lasted 45 continuous minutes.

LARP harder, cultists.

 

[cms9690]

I'm sure you're a nice dude in real life, but the narrative behind all of your threads just really suck ass.

You act as though you have a vendetta against certain things in every thread, this one being 'sport jiu jitsu'.

It's as though your thread isn't actually created to engage in dialogue with other posters. It's more used as an affirmation for you to state that you're making the right decisions followed by the reasons why.

 

[Thai Otoshi]

I'm sure you're a nice dude in real life, but the narrative behind all of your threads just really suck ass.

You act as though you have a vendetta against certain things in every thread, this one being 'sport jiu jitsu'.

It's as though your thread isn't actually created to engage in dialogue with other posters. It's more used as an affirmation for you to state that you're making the right decisions followed by the reasons why.

I still remember this thread.

http://forums.sherdog.com/forums/f12/strength-accusations-2697469/

 

[joeytriangles]

I'm sure you're a nice dude in real life, but the narrative behind all of your threads just really suck ass.

You act as though you have a vendetta against certain things in every thread, this one being 'sport jiu jitsu'.

It's as though your thread isn't actually created to engage in dialogue with other posters. It's more used as an affirmation for you to state that you're making the right decisions followed by the reasons why.

In Tolkien's works Sauron is sometimes known as Sauron the deceiver.
He has literally written he is a troll in his username and people still fall for it?

 

[SuperSuperRambo]

You seriously "understand this concept?"

I'd be blown away if the Gracies, or anyone else for that matter, could produce evidence of a street fight that lasted 45 continuous minutes.

LARP harder, cultists.

Calling someone a "cultist" is lame. You're probably just as bad with whatever you support, and most people probably would think the same of you. Right up there with "sheeple." The people using those terms can usually be described equally well by those terms.

 

[dalexan242]

But, you are doing things for the sake of scoring points, no? Like for example, you have the back but only one hook. Rather than work from there, you're focusing on securing the second hook, right? Or, say, turtling to prevent the pass? We are taught to do these things but the reasoning comes partly from how points are scored in tournaments. I have noticed a difference in style from guys who have no knowledge or experience in competition. They're more willing to give up things that would score in tournaments, and don't seem to work tactically to prevent them. And it doesn't make them worse off.

I do those things, but I never consciously thought it was about points. I thought the second hook made it less likely for my opponent to escape and that I would rather be I turtle than bottom side control. It isn't clear to me why I should behave differently for self-defense.

I guess I do usually control a dominant position for 3 sec, but I'm big and move slowly. I'm not sure that controlling your opponent is bad for self-defense either. It seems like it would probably be more effective to pin someone until the authorities arrive than spin off them to break their arm.

 

[KarateFist]

45min with one person is not realistic
a strategy focused around conserving energy in a fight is not realistic

real fights last between 30secs to 2min, in that time I want to absolutely blitz the other guy and inflict as much damage as possible.

you get jumped in a bad neighbourhood, you don't hold on to the guy and wait him out, you beat the shit out of him and get out as soon as possible before more shit goes down.

 

[Estebanantonio]

45min with one person is not realistic
a strategy focused around conserving energy in a fight is not realistic

real fights last between 30secs to 2min, in that time I want to absolutely blitz the other guy and inflict as much damage as possible.

you get jumped in a bad neighbourhood, you don't hold on to the guy and wait him out, you beat the shit out of him and get out as soon as possible before more shit goes down.

You use that strategy if you don't have a choice. It was taught by Sun Tzu in his writings "The Art of War". To paraphrase "When faced with a larger more powerful opponent, make your defenses so that you can not be defeated then eventually you will defeat him". It doesn't mean this is the strategy for every situation or should it be.

I would suggest people watch Rickson vs Zulu and Royce vs Dan Severn to see this strategy used in a 1 on 1 situations where in both cases the only way for them to win was with this strategy. I get it it was a controlled environment with no one jumping in and bla bla bla.

 

[Ryo]

You use that strategy if you don't have a choice. It was taught by Sun Tzu in his writings "The Art of War". To paraphrase "When faced with a larger more powerful opponent, make your defenses so that you can not be defeated then eventually you will defeat him". It doesn't mean this is the strategy for every situation or should it be.

I would suggest people watch Rickson vs Zulu and Royce vs Dan Severn to see this strategy used in a 1 on 1 situations where in both cases the only way for them to win was with this strategy. I get it it was a controlled environment with no one jumping in and bla bla bla.

So what? Everything you said is pretty much made null by the statement you made? The strategy for fighting in a controlled environment is not the same as fighting in a environment with no restrictions or rules...

Prize fights are not self defense.