Vasyl “Hi-Tech” Lomachenko officially enters the Top 10 P4P rankings

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

He's now Top 10 P4P ranked according to The RING's list, sitting at #7.

http://ringtv.craveonline.com/ratings

According to Boxing Scene's Top 10 P4P rankings he's now ranked Top 5 P4P, sitting at #5.

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/view.php?pg=pound

5) Vasyl Lomachenko (6-1, 4 KO)
Age: 28
Current Titles: WBO Super Featherweight (2016-Present, 0 Defenses)
Previous Titles: WBO Featherweight (2014-16, 3 Defenses)
Record in Title Fights: 5-1, 3 KO
Last Five Opponents: Roman Martinez (KO5), Romulo Koasicha (KO10), Gamalier Rodriguez (KO9), Chonlatarn Piriyapinyo (UD12), Gary Russell Jr. (MD12)

Next Opponent: TBA

The Take: He’d looked technically superb from the start, even in losing his second (depending on who is counting) pro fight to Orlando Salido. Against Rocky Martinez, he looked like something more. Showing killer instinct and single shot power, he iced a man whose chin and durability had served him through many wars. Lomachenko could have done what many do, fighting a dozen or so no hopers to pad his record. He skipped that part and it’s paying dividends. His combination of speed, footwork, defensive fundamentals, and power is as good as anyone possesses in boxing. The Salido loss has looked better in the time since with Salido arguably defeating two titlists at 130 lbs. only to settle for draws. Russell went on to win a title at featherweight. In terms of resume, there is more to build. In terms of the eye test, how many fighters would be favored over Lomachenko before we get to 140 lbs? Chalk this corner up as all in and this spot as a balance between resume and the eye. Lomachenko is the goods and he’s going to get better.

Boxrec hasn't updated their P4P rankings yet, it appears, as Lomachenko is still listed at #55 there for all active male boxers.

http://boxrec.com/records/40

He's not listed yet in the TBRB's Top 10 P4P rankings.

http://www.tbrb.org/p4p

Yahoo! Sports hasn't updated their list yet. Sports Illustrated's P4P rankings (www.si.com/boxing) will be updated next month. ESPN's updated P4P rankings should be listed any day now.

 

[Seano]

The backflip clinched it.

 

[Confucamus]

I don't think he's top 10 P4P just yet. The RING has notoriously made some bad choices in the past, like putting Broner at #5 out of nowhere.

 

[KillerIsBack V2]

p4p ? for what? Is his amateur pedigree playing into this so much?
Usyk had to work hard and still only jsut earned a titleshot at CW with an undefeated record all by electric KOs.

I don't think he's top 10 P4P just yet. The RING has notoriously made some bad choices in the past, like putting Broner at #5 out of nowhere.

This choice is worse than Broner. Atleast Broner is very good at selling himself, was undefeated, and holds a large quantity of pro fight.
Hell, even now Broner has won world championships are 4 bloody weight classes!


somebody is being whined and dined!

 

[JayElectra]

The p4p list is a little wide open, right now. Lomachenko getting in at the very bottom isn't completely ridiculous.

 

[Sivo The Ram]

i dont think much of p4p list but thats cool that he's getting some shine! i'd say him and inoue are my two favorite current fighters

 

[Shoemaker]

The p4p list is a little wide open, right now. Lomachenko getting in at the very bottom isn't completely ridiculous.

I agree putting him at the very bottom isn't entirely ridiculous. But the BoxingScene list has him at 5 - above guys who have much better wins.

I guess I don't get how some people decide their P4P lists. Seems to me they should be based on accomplishments-to-date, but it's sort of half popularity contest. For instance, Boxing Scene claims that the Cotto win was "just enough" to push Canelo to the 7th spot. But beating Martinez launches Vasyl to #5? That doesn't add up.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

I agree putting him at the very bottom isn't entirely ridiculous. But the BoxingScene list has him at 5 - above guys who have much better wins.

I guess I don't get how some people decide their P4P lists. Seems to me they should be based on accomplishments-to-date, but it's sort of half popularity contest. For instance, Boxing Scene claims that the Cotto win was "just enough" to push Canelo to the 7th spot. But beating Martinez launches Vasyl to #5? That doesn't add up.

The Boxing Scene list clearly states that they've placed him there at #5 partially due to the "eye test" after observing the incredible amount of skill he's shown, even in his lone (and very dirty) split decision defeat to Salido in his second pro fight, in addition to his résumé. They go on to mention that Gary Russell Jr. became Featherweight champ after Loma beat him (just two fights later) and how Salido had been doing.

I don't agree with either list, btw. This shit is all fantasy (P4P) and should go only by accomplishments. We'll have a concrete #1 P4P though when Ward & Kovalev fight, especially if Ward wins (since he moved up).

 

[Shoemaker]

The Boxing Scene list clearly states that they've placed him there at #5 mostly due to the "eye test

And I clearly stated how I felt about that.

I don't agree with either list, btw. This shit is all fantasy (P4P) and should go only by accomplishments. We'll have a concrete #1 P4P though when Ward & Kovalev fight, especially if Ward wins (since he moved up).

Yep. The winner of that will bump off Gonzalez for sure.[/QUOTE]

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

The Boxing Scene list clearly states that they've placed him there at #5 partially due to the "eye test" after observing the incredible amount of skill he's shown, even in his lone (and very dirty) split decision defeat to Salido in his second pro fight, in addition to his résumé. They go on to mention that Gary Russell Jr. became Featherweight champ after Loma beat him (just two fights later) and how Salido had been doing.

I don't agree with either list, btw. This shit is all fantasy (P4P) and should go only by accomplishments. We'll have a concrete #1 P4P though when Ward & Kovalev fight, especially if Ward wins (since he moved up).

The P4P lists that most check anyway are The RING's and Boxrec's primarily, with the TBRB's. He's only on one of those at the moment and that's The RING's.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

p4p ? for what? Is his amateur pedigree playing into this so much?
Usyk had to work hard and still only jsut earned a titleshot at CW with an undefeated record all by electric KOs.

This choice is worse than Broner. Atleast Broner is very good at selling himself, was undefeated, and holds a large quantity of pro fight.
Hell, even now Broner has won world championships are 4 bloody weight classes!

somebody is being whined and dined!

Lomachenko isn't just being fast tracked, he's being very fast tracked. You just don't know the difference but that's okay. Broner being good at selling himself means fuck all, same with how many pro fights he's had. It's quality, not quantity, and if you're really great, you'll have a good quantity of quality opponent wins. Moving up and looking amazing also helps.

I don't think he's top 10 P4P just yet. The RING has notoriously made some bad choices in the past, like putting Broner at #5 out of nowhere.

Broner was #6 at his highest on The RING's P4P list, not #5.

 

[aries]

They are clearly rating him on perceived ability i.e. who wouldn't put him as favourite vs. anyone at his weight. P4P generally are done by actual achievements but as I argued once you could make a case for them being on perceived ability much like we do when we look at historical vs. modern P4P fighters.

 

[ironfist05]

Ridiculous, Lomachenko has no place on there when his best win is the ATG Gary Russel Jr.

 

[tehmvp]

Ridiculous, Lomachenko has no place on there when his best win is the ATG Gary Russel Jr.

He needs to fight the legendary TBA, Who Russell has beaten over and over again.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

They are clearly rating him on perceived ability i.e. who wouldn't put him as favourite vs. anyone at his weight. P4P generally are done by actual achievements but as I argued once you could make a case for them being on perceived ability much like we do when we look at historical vs. modern P4P fighters.

Correct. Talking in general here, these hypothetical Pound-for-Pound rankings are often based on a balance (using different weighted formulas) of both merit and recent accomplishments. Some lists are much more merit-based than others, though.

For example, the relatively new Transnational Boxing Rankings Board P4P rankings weigh much more heavily on actual recent accomplishments. As such, Lomachenko was just proposed to be included in their Top 10 P4P list but the notion was defeated.

Updates, 14 June 2016: ***

At P4P, Vasyl Lomachenko was proposed to enter into the #10 spot, bumping out Naoya Inoue. It was defeated. Lomachenko looks like a P4P fighter right now, but his accomplishments haven’t caught up to the hype –not yet anyway. ***

http://www.tbrb.org
Their Pound-for-Pound list -> http://www.tbrb.org/p4p

The TBRB is a volunteer organization created in late 2012 to be the most neutral and authoritative board for recognizing professional boxers' rankings. It spans 18 different countries around the world with 51 board members/journalists and growing. Days ago they denied Lomachenko, who was proposed to be #10, which would've bumped Inoue out of the #10 spot on their P4P list.

Who else uses their rankings? Boxing News 24 adopted them, Boxing.com, The Queensberry Rules, The Sweet Science, East Side Boxing, Esquina Boxeo and Stiff Jab, among others.

If anyone has an issue with merit-based rankings, especially ones that weigh it heavily, then just go with the TBRB's "authoritative" rankings. It's a simple solution.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transnational_Boxing_Rankings_Board

Last month, through May 11th, ESPN published their P4P rankings list. This was obviously before Lomachenko moved up and took out Martinez in emphatic fashion after easily outclassing him. Even back then, Lomachenko had the second most votes to break into their own Top 10 P4P list.

Other receiving votes: Naoya Inoue (9), Vasyl Lomachenko (8), Wladimir Klitschko (6), Keith Thurman (4), Kell Brook (4), Deontay Wilder (3), Danny Garcia (3), Shinsuke Yamanaka (1), Viktor Postol (1)

http://espn.go.com/boxing/story/_/id/15506296/canelo-alvarez-wins-stays-no-5

Roy Jones Jr. has had Lomachenko on his own personal P4P list for a while now and he once again made that clear on HBO heading into the Lomachenko-Martinez fight. In fact, he only places Ward before Lomachenko on his list, as Ward has yet to lose and has beaten better opposition (sure, RJJ is biased towards him). But, Andre Ward himself said over a year ago to expect Lomachenko to be Top 10 P4P soon and was extremely impressed with what he'd seen him do while watching him fight Rodriguez ringside.

Lomachenko is already being heralded as the most special (skilled and still rapidly improving) P4P talent from Boxing News 24 to Forbes as the heir apparent to Mayweather's vacant throne. Whether or not he can live up to this remains to be seen. His ridiculous skills more than speak for themself, however.

 

[JayElectra]

I'm going to call you KMB from now on, but there is no chance I'm ever reading any post that's essentially about nothing that really amounts just to one fighter's position in rankings no one ever questioned or cared about (especially when you quote almost any boxing writer from the last 20 years). You're clearly adding something in terms of information, but no one's reading that shit, at this moment. At least, I'm not.

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

I'm going to call you KMB from now on, but there is no chance I'm ever reading any post that's essentially about nothing that really amounts just to one fighter's position in rankings no one ever questioned or cared about (especially when you quote almost any boxing writer from the last 20 years). You're clearly adding something in terms of information, but no one's reading that shit, at this moment. At least, I'm not.

The TBRB isn't just about a single fighter. Where the hell have I quoted "almost any boxing writer from the last 20 years"? People have taken issue in this thread with Loma being added to P4P Top 10 lists. It's now clarified, they can use the "authoritative" list that goes by accomplishments rather than more heavily on merit.

"This isn't rocket science" -Tyson Fury

 

[JayElectra]

The TBRB isn't just about a single fighter. Where the hell have I quoted "almost any boxing writer from the last 20 years"? People have taken issue in this thread with Loma being added to P4P Top 10 lists. It's now clarified, they can use the "authoritative" list that goes by accomplishments rather than more heavily on merit.

"This isn't rocket science" -Tyson Fury

Sorry, what?

 

[ironfist05]

I think he's overrated skillswise too, but I will say, he did impress me against Martinez and is starting to make me second guess myself on that

 

[Kovalev's "Man Bag"]

Sorry, what?

I'm going to call you KMB from now on, but there is no chance I'm ever reading any post that's essentially about nothing that really amounts just to one fighter's position in rankings no one ever questioned or cared about (especially when you quote almost any boxing writer from the last 20 years). You're clearly adding something in terms of information, but no one's reading that shit, at this moment. At least, I'm not.

Your bolded statement, back it up. You made the claim.