trying to add the butterfly guard/sitting guard to mygame...

B

blanko

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it has been a humbling experience... I am getting assraped and i always end up playing half butterfly instead of butterfly/sitting guard.. it sucks... *end rant*
 
at first it does suck.. but as you get more use to it.. soooo many sweeps from that position.. its a lot of fun
 
the problem with my butterfly guard is that instead of using sound techniques.. i am sweeping people with my instinct. Meaning, i might be able to sweep them, but i dont' know what i am doing...
 
blanko said:
the problem with my butterfly guard is that instead of using sound techniques.. i am sweeping people with my instinct. Meaning, i might be able to sweep them, but i dont' know what i am doing...
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I wouldnt call that a problem. I always hear here on forums (even from brown belts - read Hayliks posts) when it comes to particular tehniques that he is doing something but he doesnt know egzactly what.
so, just continue to sweep heeh
 
Just keep working at it, have your coach show you sweeps he likes from there, talk to other people about it. I worked on it a lot and it has really taken my game up. Even if you get half or half butterfly, use it to get back to butterfly and start over. If you sweep, let the guy back up and continue to work butterfly. Just keep going back to it. It will make for fun days of training.
 
This is one of the hardest but most important games you can have in your game. It is going to get passed many times and you have to keep at it. I would suggest recovering guard and going back to the traditional butterfly or hook sweep position.
 
Blanko, I feel you. When I first started back, I was sort of forced into working on my butterfly guard because my instructor had decided that was what he was teaching for the next couple fo weeks. My butterfly sucks but I found myself using a few times when we rolled. My sitting guard (thanks txfighter13) is better and I like it a lot because I can control his base with my feet. I tend to use it to lengthen him out before I try a sweep, like a scissor sweep or a sweep like this.

My half guard focus over the last month has shown a huge improvement but the guys at my gym are starting to do everything they can to stay out of it. I think I am going to focus on Butterfly/Sitting guard for the next month. Let us know how it goes and any hurdles you run into.
 
I'm sure you know all the standard butterfly sweeps and controls. It sounds to me like you need to work on guard retention while in butterfly.
 
yea i think it just the fact that i am so "uncomfortable" in the butterfly as opposed to the other guards i play. And i play alot of guards..
 
I don't recommend trying to add butterfly/sitting guard to your game by just working a few items in. If you're going to learn it, I recommend playing it exclusively. Yeah, it's gonna suck for 1-2 months as people torch your guard, but then it will start to catch on.

Butterfly guard requires you to have superb escapes and half guard if you want to play it well, so it is a demanding guard. I think it's a great way to force yourself to improve skills that you otherwise would minimize.

If you did want to add part, however, I would start with sitting guard (one hand on the cross collar grip, other hand behind) and work collar drags, loop chokes, and ankle picks/knee taps off of it. You can easily take this guard every time you start rolling, and you can easily transition into your normal guard if things start to go south. This will give a great base for transitioning into the hook butterfly game.
 
What I like most about sitting guard is that it is so great for transitions.

Maybe even more so than working sweeps, I focus on grip fighting and getting good control. It's an easy guard to transition from.

example - I'm in sitting guard and opponent attempt to grab my ankles, pretty much in my guard. I'll grab a wrist with my left hand, and I'll grab a deep overhook (to the point of grabbing my other wrist) with my other, with my head driving into his face on the overhook side. From there I'm in such poisition where I can threaten sweeps, or easily force him into a front head lock/turtle position.
 
Armless Guard Drill (let someone try to pass your guard, and you cannot use your arms)

you're going to get run through in the beginning but it'll eventually pay off for open guard, it will help you rely on your legs/hips much more
 
Zankou said:
I don't recommend trying to add butterfly/sitting guard to your game by just working a few items in. If you're going to learn it, I recommend playing it exclusively. Yeah, it's gonna suck for 1-2 months as people torch your guard, but then it will start to catch on.
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no i am definately gonna work on it during the summer. That's my goal for this summer in bjj.. my butterfly/sitting guard.

Butterfly guard requires you to have superb escapes and half guard if you want to play it well, so it is a demanding guard. I think it's a great way to force yourself to improve skills that you otherwise would minimize.
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yea. but it's tough bro.. tough.

If you did want to add part, however, I would start with sitting guard (one hand on the cross collar grip, other hand behind) and work collar drags, loop chokes, and ankle picks/knee taps off of it. You can easily take this guard every time you start rolling, and you can easily transition into your normal guard if things start to go south. This will give a great base for transitioning into the hook butterfly game.
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thanks will try that.

In all honesty, it's not like i have all these white belts pasing my guard.. heck even some of the low blues get swept in my butterfly.. it's just that.. i don't fell like i can "lock" my opponent. Not to mention the fact that when they do pass my guard it's like a hot knife through butter.. oh well such is life in jiu jitsu.
 
i love threads like this. i started thinking about it because of some lloyd irvin emails, but the best way to get better at anything in jiujitsu is to do it every single practice every single roll.

when i first started everybody at my school jumped guard so i only worked top game. i went to my first tournament and my takedowns sucked so i ended up playing bottom but my bottom game was terrible. i took an entire YEAR to play bottom game, playing guard whenever possible. my guard game has gotten MUCH better and my top game has gotten better as well because now i can sweep and play top.

point of the story, play your butterfly against everybody you can. i've started playing it against new white belts (i'm a white belt as well) and i'm starting to understand it a bit more.
 
the problem is... that the game is speeding up so fastwhen i use my butterfly guard (especially in no gi) i just don't feel like i can lock on to my opponent and slow things down in my butterfly.
 
Just focus on slowing it down, not doing anything, but just gaining control.

Like everyone's been saying, if you want to improve, become single minded. I spent 6 months working armbars from guard, because they sucked. After the 6 months, I could armbar from guard.

I'm trying to work my butterfly as well, so I just make an effort to always switch to it. I'm getting passed alot, but in a few months I'll be much more comfortable and I'll have an alternative to boring closed guard.
 
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