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Trump's Border Wall and The Upcoming Elections

Discussion in 'The War Room' started by waiguoren, Sep 10, 2018.

  1. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    In my view, there is no single issue that can rev up Trump's base more than illegal immigration. Trump's "wall" was the centerpiece of his platform. In national polls, Republicans cite immigration as the #1 most important issue facing the USA.

    700 miles long, 30 ft. high. No need to build over mountains and other natural barriers for now.

    So where is it?

    Trump has been in office for nearly two years. His party has held the House and the Senate during this period.

    Here we are, 20 days out from the budget deadline. It's the last budget deadline before the alleged "blue wave" could pour in and wipe out any chance for legislative implementation of the wall or any other part of Trump's agenda.

    Two days ago, Ryan and McConnell supposedly went to the White House to try to convince Trump not to push for the wall until after the mid-terms. Unless I'm missing something, this would be a huge political mistake. A shutdown battle over the wall would rev up the Trump base like none other. Without the boost, losing the House is a major possibility.

    If the Rs lose the House how much wall funding do you think Trump can get?

    The answer is zero.

    So what are McConnell/Ryan doing? My guess is they are suckling the teets of their wealthy donors, who don't want the wall primarily because their business interests depend on cheap labor.

    Almost no one seems to be writing about it, but we have arrived at a key moment in the Trump presidency. Is Trump merely a master media manipulator, or does he have what it takes to be a courageous commander of consequence?

    If the former, perhaps Trump is destined to be a transitional president, rather than a transformational president.


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    Republicans Surrender on Trump’s Border Wall to Push Paul Ryan’s ‘Tax Reform 2.0’

    While GOP midterm voters — by a majority — say they want President Trump’s economic nationalist agenda on immigration, Republican lawmakers are ignoring those calls to instead promote House Speaker Paul Ryan’s “tax reform 2.0.”

    For the last six months, GOP midterm voters have told pollsters that the number one issue facing the country is immigration. Meanwhile, tax reform is considered one of the least pressing issues in the U.S. by Republican voters.

    Among 53 percent of GOP voters in the latest Harvard/Harris Poll, immigration should be the biggest priority for the Trump administration and the Republican-controlled Congress. This makes immigration more important to Republican voters than even the economy, terrorism, and healthcare.

    Tax reform, on the other hand, ranks among one of the least important issues to Republican voters, with only 11 percent saying it is the most pressing issue in the country. This makes tax reform less important than even obscure issues like corruption, guns, and national defense.



    The will of GOP voters, though, is not stopping Republican lawmakers from surrendering on Trump’s populist-nationalist immigration agenda before the midterm elections. Even Freedom Caucus Chairman Rep. Mark Meadows (R-NC) — considered a conservative leader in Congress — told the Huffington Post that border wall funding should be further prolonged until next year.

    House Speaker Paul Ryan (R-WI) and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) have both previously said that they will not fight for the border wall before the midterms, instead surrendering the issue to Democrats.

    “We have a very good understanding with the president that we want to get our appropriations done,” Ryan told Roll Call last week.

    “We still want to get funding for the wall,” McConnell told Fox News last week. “But we think the best time to have that discussion is after the election.”

    The border wall funding the GOP leadership wants to approve after the midterm election is tied to a slew of open borders policies, as Breitbart News’s Neil Munro reported, that will inflate immigration levels while only providing a sliver of funds to construct the wall.

    Rather than focusing on securing the $25 billion it is expected to cost to build the border wall, Republican lawmakers will begin touting their “tax reform 2.0” plan.

    The plan is likely to be embraced by Trump foes and the big business lobby — some of the primary donors to the GOP — such as the Chamber of Commerce, the billionaire Koch brothers, and the Business Roundtable.

    Almost two years into the Trump presidency, the GOP-controlled Congress has yet to give any money towards the border wall. In the last spending fight earlier this year, the GOP actually funded a border wall in the country of Jordan, but banned Trump from using border wall prototypes on the U.S.-Mexico border.

    This is the second year that Ryan’s uninfluential, economic libertarian agenda of tax reform and spending cuts has taken priority over Trump’s populist-nationalist agenda of immigration reduction and a border wall.




    https://www.breitbart.com/big-gover...order-wall-to-push-paul-ryans-tax-reform-2-0/
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2018
  2. tonni 2019 Snitch of the Year

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    Will the pathological liar and scam artist follow up on his crazy promises?

    Right after he “locks her up”.
     
  3. cincymma79 Gold Belt

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    Every president loses seats first term
    Why would this one be different?
    If it does happen though it will be unprecedented
     
  4. skold Black Belt

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    That wall was about as realistic and effective as a degree from Trump U
     
  5. bufetadanacara Black Belt

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    I don't think a literal wall will ever be built, at least not something resembling the Great Wall of China. A wall like that just isn't practical in my opinion. I can see some sort of fortification built in certain areas though and I think that may be a generally good idea.

    The biggest problem is the divide, it is the split between those who oppose illegal immigration vs those who don't. The part that I cannot figure out is how there are people who are not opposed to illegal immigration. I think that the first step is to try to teach people to think sensibly so they can recognize the problem with not having a secure border. Once that consensus is created, a practical solution can begin to be debated. As it is now, the two sides are far too divided.
     
  6. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    He has followed through on many promises.
     
  7. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    I'm not talking about "losing seats".

    I'm talking about losing the House.

    Huge difference.
     
  8. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    [​IMG]

    These are two of the Trump prototypes. The one on the left should work.

    Well, @Jack V Savage disagrees. He says he most Democrat voters oppose illegal immigration and that no one in the House/Senate supports illegal immigration.

    Could you respond to the point of the OP? Am I right that Trump would be making a political mistake to kick the can down the road for at least the third time? The way I see it, the Trump base's enthusiasm level is at 7.5/10 right now, while the resistance is at 11/10. If that holds, blue wave is coming.
     
  9. bufetadanacara Black Belt

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    He will continue to "kick the can down the road". I don't know if this will hurt him or help him though. He could excuse this by promoting the idea that there are more important and critical things to focus on now. That blue wave you speak of could be coming, it is really 50-50 right now.

    I would also like to know the Democrat's solution to illegal immigration. What do they propose?
     
  10. nac386 Gold Belt

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    He can't say there are more important things though, since the wall was the most important part of his campaign. He made illegal immigration (and legal immigration in some cases) sound like most cruicial challenge our country faces. To dismiss that notion now would be a huge change of policy and even character.

    But, I don't understand his support base. They seem to just go along with whatever he feels at that moment, so maybe they won't mind.
     
  11. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    Fair enough.

    What do you think would be the effect on the November elections if he were to put his foot down and insist that any spending bill contain full funding for the wall? No effect?

    The position of @Jack V Savage , who is the closest thing to a "Democrat" I can find, is that illegal immigration used to be a problem but it has been fixed. His evidence for this is that apprehensions of illegal immigrants in the Southwest border region used to be in the 1.5 million per annum range 10+ years ago, but now they are in the 400,000 per annum range.
     
  12. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    I think very few of his supporters will support him "no matter what".

    My perception is that there is little more that Trump can do pre-November to rev up the anti-abortion voters or the economy voters or the national security voters.

    However, the immigration people feel unsatisfied, particularly with the lack of progress on the wall. Given that Republicans say immigration is the #1 issue, this would seem to be a good direction for Trump to go pre-November.
     
  13. bufetadanacara Black Belt

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    I think that would hurt him come November, if he put his foot down as I assume that many of his supporters don't actually want to see that much money spent on a wall.

    Glad to hear the problem "has been fixed"- It is hard to believe that there are morons there who say this with a straight face.




    Edit: I would like to add something. I think the wall could be a positive thing as well. It could create many jobs and would become a major, major tourist attraction. I could see the wall lined with resorts, amusement parks, strip malls, etc. It would employ and attract many people. There is great weather all year in most of that region too.

    Overall, I don't see it as a practical solution but it could also serve as a symbol.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2018
  14. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    Seriously? Wow. Obviously you would agree that the Breitbart crowd feels the opposite, so I'm guessing you think the Breitbart crowd constitutes a smaller part of his supporters than I think.

    He has written those exact words multiple times on these forums and he is perhaps the most influential Democrat here. I think his views are typical of Democrats today. He has also written that immigration is "free money".
     
  15. Rockapotomuss Woke Based Poster

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    Gop wants illegal immigration for slave labor and dems want it for diversity, trump and his 30% bass are on their own. The gop supports trump for the Supreme Court picks only and won’t go along with this.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2018
  16. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    If the media reports are accurate, Ryan/McConnell thought this issue so important that they went to the White House personally with photos of the new "wall" in hand to try to persuade Trump to put this issue off.

    You say the GOP won't go along with this, but Trump can force their hand. He is the head of the Party. He has 90% approval among Republicans. Ryan and McConnell are far less popular among Republicans. If Ryan or McConnell dares to go against him, he can blast them on Twitter and other platforms.
     
  17. Rockapotomuss Woke Based Poster

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    The gop are corrupt and each receive enough money in bribes to lose their job over. If trump wants the wall he should fund it personally or order the military to build it.
     
  18. cincymma79 Gold Belt

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    That happens pretty much every president
    Like the last one for instance
     
  19. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    He can't legally fund it himself, obviously.

    He's talking about using the military to fund it. The courts will probably shut him down.

    Congress is the proper avenue.
     
  20. waiguoren Double Yellow Card Double Yellow Card

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    Yup, and passage of legislation slowed to a crawl.

    Again, the point is that he sure as hell isn't going to get funding for the wall if the Ds control the House.
     

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