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Trump-Ukraine v 11 lowering the Barr

Discussion in 'The War Room' started by PolishHeadlock2, Nov 7, 2019.

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  1. PolishHeadlock2

    PolishHeadlock2 Absolutley Haram Platinum Member

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    https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...0fc209e065a8_story.html?utm_source=reddit.com

    President Trump wanted Attorney General William P. Barr to hold a news conference declaring that the commander in chief had broken no laws during a phone call in which he pressed his Ukrainian counterpart to investigate a political rival, though Barr ultimately declined to do so, people familiar with the matter said.

    The request from Trump traveled from the president to other White House officials and eventually to the Justice Department. The president has mentioned Barr’s demurral to associates in recent weeks, saying he wished Barr would have held the news conference, Trump advisers say.

    In recent weeks, the Justice Department has sought some distance from the White House, particularly on matters relating to the burgeoning controversy over Trump’s dealings on Ukraine and the impeachment inquiry they sparked

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/07/world/europe/ukraine-trump-zelensky.html

    KIEV, Ukraine — It was early September, and Ukraine’s new president, Volodymyr Zelensky, faced an agonizing choice: whether to capitulate to President Trump’s demands to publicly announce investigations against his political enemies or to refuse, and lose desperately needed military aid.

    Only Mr. Trump could unlock the aid, he had been told by two United States senators, and time was running out. If the money, nearly $400 million, were not unblocked by the end of the fiscal year on Sept. 30, it could be lost in its entirety.

    In a flurry of WhatsApp messages and meetings in Ukraine’s capital, Kiev, over several days, senior aides debated the point. Avoiding partisan politics in the United States had always been the first rule of Ukrainian foreign policy, but the military aid was vital to the war against Russian-backed separatist forces in eastern Ukraine, a conflict that has cost 13,000 lives since it began in 2014.

    By then, however, Mr. Zelensky’s staffers were already conceding to what seemed to be the inevitable, and making plans for a public announcement about the investigations. It was a fateful decision for a fledgling president elected on an anticorruption platform that included putting an end to politically motivated investigations.

    an impeachment inquiry undertaken after accusations surfaced of Mr. Trump’s demands.

    But interviews in Kiev with government officials, lawmakers and others close to the Zelensky government have revealed new details of how high-level Ukrainian officials ultimately decided to acquiesce to President Trump’s request — and, by a stroke of luck, never had to follow through.

    Aides were arguing in favor of “bowing to what was demanded,” said Petro Burkovskiy, a senior fellow at the Democratic Initiatives Foundation who has close ties to the Ukrainian government. They were willing to do so, he said, despite the risk of losing bipartisan support in the United States by appearing to assist Mr. Trump’s re-election bid. “The cost was high.”

    admitted Tuesday in congressional testimony, the Trump administration had withheld the military aid to pressure Mr. Zelensky to make a public statement on the two investigations: one into whether former Vice President President Joseph R. Biden Jr. had pressed for the firing of a Ukrainian prosecutor who was investigating Burisma, a natural gas company where his son served on the board; the other into unproven accusations that it was Ukraine, not Russia, that meddled in the 2016 election to promote the candidacy of Hillary Clinton.

    a whistle-blower complaint and touched off the impeachment inquiry, Mr. Zelensky offered private assurances that his government would look into those matters.

    But a public statement that raised doubts about Russian meddling and Mr. Biden, whom the president regarded as the greatest threat to his re-election, would be far more useful politically to Mr. Trump. Not only would it smear Mr. Biden, it could also appear to undermine the Mueller investigation into Russian electoral interference by pinning some blame on Ukraine.

    A tug-of-war ensued between a senior aide to Mr. Zelensky, Andriy Yermak, and another of Mr. Trump’s envoys to Ukraine, Kurt Volker, over the wording of the proposed public statement. Mr. Volker went so far as to draft a statement for Mr. Zelensky that mentioned both investigations.

    Mr. Yermak pushed back, suggesting language that mentioned investigations but in general terms, so as not to antagonize the Democrats. Late in the negotiations, the American diplomats consented to dropping mention of Ukrainian interference in the 2016 election.

    Even as Mr. Yermak negotiated the wording in August, the stakes were clear. While rumors had been swirling for months about a possible hold on military aid, by early August high-level Ukrainian officials had confirmed the freeze.

    The trade soon became explicit. They were approached in September by Mr. Sondland, a major donor to Mr. Trump’s inauguration who had been appointed ambassador to the European Union despite having no diplomatic experience. At that point, he explained in blunt terms to Mr. Zelensky and Mr. Yermak, there was little chance the aid would be forthcoming until they made the public statement on the investigations.

    said in sworn testimony released Tuesday by the House committees leading the impeachment inquiry.

    Twitter posts.

    They also uncovered a post from Mr. Trump attacking Fox News as “not working for us anymore!”

    Nearly all Mr. Zelensky’s top advisers favored his making the public statement, said one of the officials who participated in the debate. United States military aid, they agreed, as well as diplomatic backing for impending peace talks to end the war outweighed the risks of appearing to take sides in American politics.

    There was a lone holdout — Alexander Danyliuk, the director of the national security council. Mr. Danyliuk, who resigned in late September, told the Ukrainian news media that the Zelensky administration would now need to “correct the mistakes” in relations with the United States and “in particular their own.”

    Finally bending to the White House request, Mr. Zelensky’s staff planned for him to make an announcement in an interview on Sept. 13 with Fareed Zakaria, the host of a weekly news show on CNN.

    Though plans were in motion to give the White House the public statement it had sought, events in Washington saved the Ukrainian government from any final decision and eliminated the need to make the statement.

    testified in the impeachment inquiry that the freeze on aid was part of a quid pro quo designed to coerce Mr. Zelensky into making the public statement.

    In Kiev, there is still a debate about whether Mr. Zelensky caved or held out. “The Zelensky team was ready to make this quid quo pro,” said Mr. Burkovskiy, the analyst. “They were ready to do this.”

    But Pavlo Klimkin, Ukraine’s foreign minister until a change of government on Aug. 29, said there was no telling what Mr. Zelensky would have ended up saying in the interview, as there were so many versions of a statement under negotiation.

    “From the contacts that took place, it’s difficult to say if they led, or did not lead, to concrete deals,” Mr. Klimkin said in an interview. In public, Mr. Zelensky has insisted he would never order a politicized prosecution.

    Either way, Mr. Klimkin said, Ukrainian officials were at the least keenly aware of the stakes — a trade of United States assistance for political favors, even as Mr. Trump’s supporters have insisted they should not have viewed relations in this light.

    “We are not idiots, or at least not all of us,” Mr. Klimkin said.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
  2. lilelvis

    lilelvis Black Belt Platinum Member

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    Mmmmm. Have you ever wondered if the government and the media do this shit for ratings?
    The shit is so over the top it just feels weird.
    Maybe we’re all playing the violin at the annual sap’s convention.
     
    Malvo, ShadowRun and Sketch like this.
  3. MilesAbove

    MilesAbove Gold Belt

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    I mean.... of course Barr would say that. That was never in question.
     
  4. ShadowRun

    ShadowRun error Platinum Member

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  5. andnowweknow

    andnowweknow The Giant On Whose Shoulders You Stand Double Yellow Card

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    Maybe the TV portion of the hearings will illuminate further. I'm psyched.
     
  6. andnowweknow

    andnowweknow The Giant On Whose Shoulders You Stand Double Yellow Card

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    Nobody credible tweets for Trump, now he's enlisted his D student of a son.

    "Hunt some shit and get ripped" would have been a better book than the political musings of a case study in nepotistic mediocrity.
     
    tonni, pinger, BarryDillon and 2 others like this.
  7. Fritzl's Basement

    Fritzl's Basement The log cabin dude

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    Was wondering where the fuck this thread went.

    I wonder how many people Dirty John Miller didn't ask to lie for him...
     
    Strychnine likes this.
  8. Fritzl's Basement

    Fritzl's Basement The log cabin dude

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    Tell you what, he has the most smug, punchable face in DC apart from his sickening criminal father.
     
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  9. PolishHeadlock2

    PolishHeadlock2 Absolutley Haram Platinum Member

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    I wonder if Jr realizes that his father will never love him back
     
  10. Swing

    Swing Brown Belt

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    I recall that debate where someone in the audience asked Clinton and Trump if there was anything positive they could say about each other, and Clinton said she appreciated his kids.

    His response was to question to her sincerity; and I had to chuckle because even though his motivation was plainly just to be ungracious, I had to wonder how he actually feels about them.
     
  11. PolishHeadlock2

    PolishHeadlock2 Absolutley Haram Platinum Member

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  12. ShadowRun

    ShadowRun error Platinum Member

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    So they have to submit a list so it get's approved and the dems don't have to go through that process huh?
     
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  13. Fritzl's Basement

    Fritzl's Basement The log cabin dude

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    Jordan is without honor and a soul
     
  14. PolishHeadlock2

    PolishHeadlock2 Absolutley Haram Platinum Member

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    He also lacks a law license because he couldn't pass the bar exam
     
  15. Fritzl's Basement

    Fritzl's Basement The log cabin dude

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    That's amusing.
    I don't really know much about him other than every time I see him running his mouth on the teevee, he's saying something stupid.
     
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  16. andnowweknow

    andnowweknow The Giant On Whose Shoulders You Stand Double Yellow Card

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    You don't think there should be an approval process? Jordan can literally call any relevant witness. The approval process is there so he doesn't call irrelevant witnesses. Without a check process, he'd put Sean Hannity on the docket.
     
  17. ShadowRun

    ShadowRun error Platinum Member

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    That wasn't what I was talking about, I am pointing out it's obvious the dems don't have to do this, which is why this is a partisan crap show in a way. Where's the integrity if they want the public to look at this without partisan blinders on?
     
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  18. Farmer Br0wn

    Farmer Br0wn Farmer Br0wn belt

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    The left is so desperate to get rid of President Trump, that they would impeach him for ripping the tag off of the couch cushion.

    Their desperation is starting to border on panic wrestling.
     
  19. ShadowRun

    ShadowRun error Platinum Member

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    Yea I see that, I am all for them doubling down on it to. This really helps him with the election, should of what happened here be reviewed? probably yes but they are taking it up 10 notches, which is the mistake they tend to make a lot. Trump says something bad about Baltimore and he should of been criticized but no it had to be blown out of proportion and he was full blown racist ....again. When this happens the dumb thing Trump originally did or said has no more merit or less merit/value.
     
  20. PolishHeadlock2

    PolishHeadlock2 Absolutley Haram Platinum Member

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    I mainly know about him because of his amateur wrestling career. The Jordans are dynasty in Ohio.
     
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