Training style vs individual style

[RelentlessT]

Hi.

I am training for MMA.

After researching the fun out of stances and trying a more rear legged stance in sparring, I've come to find it's pretty effective against fighters who have a reach advantage over me. Especially, since I am short and the quicker front kicks allow me to distance myself, along with the advantage of seeming within range of my opponent, but being able to move quickly out of the way.

However, our lead coach was out tonight and another filled in his stead. When practicing the fundamentals of parrying and evading, she insisted that I put more weight on my front foot and take an "aggressive stance."

I feel like I was being somewhat forced into the same ideology and method rather than focusing on my individual strengths and weaknesses. I'm quick and have a good sense of balance while being lower to the ground, so to me, it makes more sense to work on my rear legged stance.

Now, I understand that it's important to be efficient in more than one stance and to vary it depending on the situation. But, at what point should a student begin to implement his own style?

I'm no expert, but I am simply going off of the many opinions presented within the forums here and I'm eager to improve.

 

[Bekim]

Hi.

I am training for MMA.

After researching the fun out of stances and trying a more rear legged stance in sparring, I've come to find it's pretty effective against fighters who have a reach advantage over me. Especially, since I am short and the quicker front kicks allow me to distance myself, along with the advantage of seeming within range of my opponent, but being able to move quickly out of the way.

However, our lead coach was out tonight and another filled in his stead. When practicing the fundamentals of parrying and evading, she insisted that I put more weight on my front foot and take an "aggressive stance."

I feel like I was being somewhat forced into the same ideology and method rather than focusing on my individual strengths and weaknesses. I'm quick and have a good sense of balance while being lower to the ground, so to me, it makes more sense to work on my rear legged stance.

Now, I understand that it's important to be efficient in more than one stance and to vary it depending on the situation. But, at what point should a student begin to implement his own style?

I'm no expert, but I am simply going off of the many opinions presented within the forums here and I'm eager to improve.

Just follow your lead coach.............you need to perfect your basics.............

 

[jonander50]

No, don't blindy follow your coach. The coach is that, a coach, an assessment.

Take what works for you and discard the rest, fights aren't won by most book technical fighter but by using what works. Experiment yourself and free from the group thinking.b

 

[Reyesnuthugr]

Learn it his way and show him you learned it. After that you can do whatever you want and he wont feel that disrespected.


You probably should at least learn some proficiency in his way even if it doesn't work as well because there will be little instances or circumstances where it might become useful. You don't have to actually adopt it, just learn it as a challenge which will force you to learn some clever tricks around it and as a plan B/option to mix in or switch up from your regular mode at times to throw off your opponents. You can even start from his way as a fake and quickly go to your regular to mess with opponents right off the bat.

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Or you could just keep doing it your way. Coaches usually kinda give up if you don't listen. It's good to at least throw in what they want once in a while, then its all good again, as long as what you're doing is effective.

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Another option is to at least practice his way on the bag sometimes. Then you don't have to use it in sparring if its not there for you.

 

[RelentlessT]

Just follow your lead coach.............you need to perfect your basics.............

What is your mode of thought behind this? I understand I need to perfect my basics, but would you agree that my go-to stance will define how I implement other fundamentals? To me, it is logical to be good at more than one stance, however, I think that if I only practice his way, then I will never become as proficient doing things my way, ie progress according to what works best for me.

 

[AndyMaBobs]

What is your mode of thought behind this? I understand I need to perfect my basics, but would you agree that my go-to stance will define how I implement other fundamentals? To me, it is logical to be good at more than one stance, however, I think that if I only practice his way, then I will never become as proficient doing things my way, ie progress according to what works best for me.

Let me explain it the best I can.

Lyoto Machida is a shotokan black belt and the greatest karateka in MMA history. Samart Payakaroon is the greatest muay thai fighter of all time. You'd think that these fighters would have vastly different styles right? But they don't. They both focus on drawing the opponent out and countering on the way in causing a collision.

I haven't done a single karate lesson since I was 9 years old, and I train pretty much only in muay thai, but the principles of Lyoto Machida still influence my fighting. But I don't adopt his stance, because I don't need it.

Learn your coaches stance, especially if you're new to martial arts. DON'T be lead leg heavy like she says, but not because it interferes with your method, but because it will make you very susceptible to low kicks that will wreck you in the ring. Focus your balance in the middle, that way you can take the aggression that she wants for now and still be able to throw your front kick.

It's important that you listen to her and take on board what she's telling you, but if you find that you really clash in styles later down the line, then change gym and find a coach who meshes with your strengths. But until that time arises (which it may not) stick roughly to what she says but keep experimenting and seeing what works with you.

Admittedly the gym I come from was more relaxed on what you did, which meant there was a wider range of techniques from all the different guys that we shared, but if you're not in that environment then it will do you better just to stick with your coach's advice for now because they will have more experience than you

 

[RelentlessT]

Let me explain it the best I can.

Lyoto Machida is a shotokan black belt and the greatest karateka in MMA history. Samart Payakaroon is the greatest muay thai fighter of all time. You'd think that these fighters would have vastly different styles right? But they don't. They both focus on drawing the opponent out and countering on the way in causing a collision.

I haven't done a single karate lesson since I was 9 years old, and I train pretty much only in muay thai, but the principles of Lyoto Machida still influence my fighting. But I don't adopt his stance, because I don't need it.

Learn your coaches stance, especially if you're new to martial arts. DON'T be lead leg heavy like she says, but not because it interferes with your method, but because it will make you very susceptible to low kicks that will wreck you in the ring. Focus your balance in the middle, that way you can take the aggression that she wants for now and still be able to throw your front kick.

It's important that you listen to her and take on board what she's telling you, but if you find that you really clash in styles later down the line, then change gym and find a coach who meshes with your strengths. But until that time arises (which it may not) stick roughly to what she says but keep experimenting and seeing what works with you.

Admittedly the gym I come from was more relaxed on what you did, which meant there was a wider range of techniques from all the different guys that we shared, but if you're not in that environment then it will do you better just to stick with your coach's advice for now because they will have more experience than you

Ah, I think I understand now. I can still vary the weight on my feet, depending on what is necessary for the time, without having to change my stance. Thus, I am able to take the advantages of any weight distribution and apply it to any stance. That gave me an "aha!" moment. I think my misunderstanding was that stance = weight distribution.

Thank you

 

[Uchi Mata]

What is your mode of thought behind this? I understand I need to perfect my basics, but would you agree that my go-to stance will define how I implement other fundamentals? To me, it is logical to be good at more than one stance, however, I think that if I only practice his way, then I will never become as proficient doing things my way, ie progress according to what works best for me.

How long have you been training? It's very common to go through phases where you like one style, then play with another and like it, going through several style iterations before figuring out what your long term style is going to be. Specializing too early can rob you of the chance to learn a lot of methods you might find you like, and in general you have to work on something a while before you can really decide whether it's for you or not. I started out doing a lot of TKD, then went to more boxing and in-fighting, and now I do mostly Dutch style kickboxing. With each of those styles I tried to learn how to fight that way without bringing too much in from what I'd already done, and now that I've been training a minute I feel like I'm actually smart enough to synthesize them effectively. But had I not been open minded about learning a different approach, I'd probably still be just a rangy kicker fighting out of a bladed stance. Unless you've been training quite a while I'd say just try to learn and absorb what your coach is teaching, and when you've spent 6 months or a year working on that style, if it's still not for you, find a different gym.

 

[RelentlessT]

I've been training twice a week for about 2 months in striking.

I have plans to go the Thailand next winter. But, it kind of worries me that if I train there, I'll become less proficient in MMA striking and create weaknesses.

What are your thoughts?

 

[AndyMaBobs]

Ah, I think I understand now. I can still vary the weight on my feet, depending on what is necessary for the time, without having to change my stance. Thus, I am able to take the advantages of any weight distribution and apply it to any stance. That gave me an "aha!" moment. I think my misunderstanding was that stance = weight distribution.

Thank you

Easy mistake to make stance is more the positioning of your body itself than the distribution of your weight. So say for example most karate styles will have a narrower and lower stance typically with a low guard, as opposed to boxing which is narrow with a high guard, and muay thai which would be square with a high guard

 

[AndyMaBobs]

I've been training twice a week for about 2 months in striking.

I have plans to go the Thailand next winter. But, it kind of worries me that if I train there, I'll become less proficient in MMA striking and create weaknesses.

What are your thoughts?

Go for the experience. It won't hurt your MMA striking at all anyway.

 

[aerius]

I've been training twice a week for about 2 months in striking.

You're in the happy glorious part of your journey where every day is a fresh new experience with a zillion things to learn. IMO, try your coach's way for a while, get familiar with it and learn what aspects of it work or don't work for you. Understand the concepts & principles, and add the parts that do work to your own style. And if another coach has another style then learn it too, play with it and figure out why it works or doesn't work for you, take what works and add it to your style. At 2 months in you're still a mostly blank canvas, your style isn't set yet and it's going to evolve a fair bit if you keep an open mind.

 

[Universal Kombat]

Hi.

I am training for MMA.

After researching the fun out of stances and trying a more rear legged stance in sparring, I've come to find it's pretty effective against fighters who have a reach advantage over me. Especially, since I am short and the quicker front kicks allow me to distance myself, along with the advantage of seeming within range of my opponent, but being able to move quickly out of the way.

However, our lead coach was out tonight and another filled in his stead. When practicing the fundamentals of parrying and evading, she insisted that I put more weight on my front foot and take an "aggressive stance."

I feel like I was being somewhat forced into the same ideology and method rather than focusing on my individual strengths and weaknesses. I'm quick and have a good sense of balance while being lower to the ground, so to me, it makes more sense to work on my rear legged stance.

Now, I understand that it's important to be efficient in more than one stance and to vary it depending on the situation. But, at what point should a student begin to implement his own style?

I'm no expert, but I am simply going off of the many opinions presented within the forums here and I'm eager to improve.

Don't listen to your coach if what you're doing works. I'm a boxing/tae kwon do guy, but I go to a Muay Thai school, granted the coaches are pretty open minded since many mma fighters go there to train on their stand up.

The two top coaches teach us muay thai stuff, but they never force us to use it, I like the gym for that reason.

The only people who get angry at me and "correct my horrible form" are the guys I spar who have no answer for my side kicks or my bladed stance. Though I'm positive a professional muay thai guy would destroy me, my peers on my level can't and I seem to put them to work.

Same thing with Judo, when I joined there was a Mongolian jacket or pants wrestler (I forget) who has some sick and serious moves I've never seen before. As much as I wanted to call them "bad form" they weren't against the rules and they worked pretty damn well on me.

Instead of being a pussy I asked to learn and adapted them into my arsenal, well... am trying too.

 

[Universal Kombat]

Go for the experience. It won't hurt your MMA striking at all anyway.

It's will improve your mma striking. Though yes there are differences, learning to throw proper elbows, knees, kicks, and most importantly devastating someone with the clinch can only make you a better striker.

Frankie Edgar, Nick Diaz, Conor McGregor, Anderson Silva, Michael Bisping, and Fedor all train in boxing from what I'm aware of. I'm pretty sure it's only helped them become better strikers in MMA, I'd wager since muay thai is even more similar to mma, its going to translate even better... oh and add GSP to boxing.

 

[j123]

What is your mode of thought behind this? I understand I need to perfect my basics, but would you agree that my go-to stance will define how I implement other fundamentals? To me, it is logical to be good at more than one stance, however, I think that if I only practice his way, then I will never become as proficient doing things my way, ie progress according to what works best for me.

I'm basing this, assuming you are aiming to compete in the near future.

As a new fighter, your fights are mostly fueled on instinct and aggression, very rarely does a person maintain their composure and cognitive thinking. Because of this, good coaches will recognize the game and ingrain basic techniques, tactics, etc to you, so come fight night your body will run on auto pilot due to repetition after repetition (muscle memory basically) all camp.
For striking, some basics would be: your stance, retaliating ASAP, throwing combinations (retaliating with combinations as well), pressing forward to control the ring/cage, doing everything in your power to not let your opponent finish their combinations/tee off on you, basic clinch strikes and escapes (pummeling)

There is also the fact that most new fighters are terrible at distance management. Its very common to see in ammy Muay Thai fights where both guys press forward, crosses end up being hooks, and within 20 seconds end up in a clinch where it grinds out for awhile. The ref breaks, and it repeats over and over.
This repeats throughout the round, nerves, adrenaline, pressure from the crowd all add up, and staying calm is something only a very small minority of people can do in those situations.

So at that stage from a coach's perspective, there's not enough time to have individually customized tailored techniques/stances to be thrown in when you only have 8 week period. There's only so much you can cover; That's just technique alone, you also have to do your conditioning as well. And its not really 8 weeks either, its 7 weeks, because the last week is cut week and you're pretty much off that week in terms of exercising.

A reason most advocate front legged heavy stance is to help with TDD, its more time consuming and harder to sprawl ASAP when in your traditional MT, or back leg heavy stance. Your coach probably knows that when it comes fight night, and someone gets close to jam your kick, it will be hard to stuff the takedown there.

imo from my exp. about a near year in competing is when you find what works for you individually, prior to then the basics take time to ingrain. It took me about a year to have the basics down to muscle memory (to be applied in a fight), the ones I mentioned above, about the stance, retaliation, etc. Prior to that I was training for about 2 years (non-competitively: hitting pads, bag, grappling classes).