Tony Ferguson Jiu Jitsu level.

[cmw43]

Charles Oliveira was submitted by Jim Miller in 2010 but submitted him in 2018. Whose BJJ is better?

Jim Miller was prime against green Charles, the rematch was old past prime Miller against prime Charles so it's hard to pick.

 

[cmw43]

I don't know much about Jiu Jitsu but it looks to me that Paul Felder Jiu Jitsu is better than Ferguson.
There is a huge difference if I compare the fights of Felder and Fergusons against Oliveira.
Any expert?

Tony's old and just doesn't have it any more, his knees a mess and it looks like his wars have caught up with him, oldest man in the division.

Not that Charles isn't great but it seems like Tony's time is passed.

Tony used to batter and then sub black belts like Tibau and Barboza.

 

[Rkue]

Tony's BJJ is GODLIKE when he's fighting a super tired person.....Normal basis? he's average....

 

[Hassan Mouzine]

there is more to grappling than just slick submissions.
oliveira improved his wrestling, his control on the ground and still has his threat of submitting opponents. he also improved his striking.

tony looked slow and old. he got manhandled in the entire grappling department, not just jiu jitsu

it's kinda like people always said that khabib would lose to a great striker with tdd or would lose to a great wrestler that nullified khabibs takedowns. they just dont see that khabib isn't a simple takedown and ground and pound guy........he is excellent everywhere and kept improving it, along with improving his striking. there are levels to this shit and khabib was already miles ahead of the rest and kept improving.

oliveira was good, but not ahead of the rest. he has improved and tony has stayed the same skillwise but looks shopworn and old. ferg will never beat oliveira and it's not due to jiu jitsu/submission threat

 

[10mm]

I don't think you can really do MMA math like that to determine who has better Jiu Jitsu.

Oliveira dominated Felder on the ground in the first round of their fight as well. He had his back several times and constantly threatened submissions. Oliveira burned himself out going for the finish in round 1 and didn't have much left in round 2, that seemed to happen to him quite a bit back then but he's improved that part of his game considerably. It was also an elbow on the feet from Felder that clipped Charles started the beginning of the end, it's not like Felder outgrappled Oliveira at all. That narrative is just completely untrue.

Oli used to gas. Maybe since he cuts less weight now? Not sure, but his gas tank used to lose him fights. He is alot bigger now than he once was.
I love how everyone calling Tony a bum. He got smothered, but took zero damage on bottom. Oli seems to really be that good these days, so im surprised Tony didnt get choked. The armbar was nuts. I bet his arm is wishing he tapped. I think the thumb was turned just enough but that arm has to have some damage.
Kbib still destroys Oli.
Oli has to be the comeback of the decade.

 

[Greyscale]

Jim Miller was prime against green Charles, the rematch was old past prime Miller against prime Charles so it's hard to pick.

That was my point.

 

[Feardafighta1126]

Charles Oliveira was submitted by Jim Miller in 2010 but submitted him in 2018. Whose BJJ is better?

rickson Gracie.. he manhandled his son when he hadn’t rolled in 5 years and his son has just won brown belt world championship at the age of 50

 

[Kwic]

Charles Oliveira was submitted by Jim Miller in 2010 but submitted him in 2018. Whose BJJ is better?

I honestly totally forgot they rematched. Thanks for reminding.

 

[FIGHTING TALK]

There are levels to the skills in Jiu Jitsu. Some fighters can pull out subs late on when they are extremely gassed and there is virtually nothing left of their opponent, that’s a great skill to have, but it doesn’t equate to great grappling when your opponent is more skilful and less tired than you

 

[Kowboy Karl]

10th planet is a joke in legit bjj world

it showed