The ridiculous notion that Conor getting more money = everyone getting more money

[Grenz]

This argument has always been around, and I've seen in a lot today and yesterday. Conor putting pressure on the UFC for higher paydays apparently is great for all fighters in the UFC because that means that they too will get paid more. Problem is of course that this argument isn't actually supported by any facts.

1. Corporations (at least well run companies) budget for absolutely everything. The payroll is no exception. So let's say the UFC sets aside 100 mil in 2016 for fighter pay. If Conor wants 10 instead of 5, the payroll budget doesn't magically increase from 100 to 105. That money has got to come from somewhere and it's most likely out of the same budget. Not great news for everyone else renegotiating their contracts.

2. Conor's pay is in no way shape or form linked to anyone else's pay. Conor can ask for more money because he can present concrete evidence that he directly is responsible for selling tickets. He's headlining events and they've done better everytime he's headlined. That's leverage. There are only very few fighters who can make that same kind of claim and those fighters aren't the issue, they're already getting paid well. The problem is with the guys who have to hold down a 9-5 because they can't pay the bills with their UFC money alone. These are the guys on the undercard or on the first 3 fights of an event. They have very little leverage in contract negotiations and Conor's pay won't change that.

I've brought it up in other threads: CEO pay increases every year, yet average employee pay has remained stagnant for decades. There is very little (if any) correlation between CEO pay and normal employee pay, just like there is very little correlation between 'star' pay and regular fighter pay.

3. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. While Conor's pay will have no impact on 90% of the fighters, Conor's presence will have a positive impact on the UFCs bottomline. UFC Fighter pay has been increasing over the last ten years and that is solely due to the fact that the company is growing. That's how the payroll is increased, by the company making more money, not by Conor asking for more money. So when Conor pulls this shit - withdrawing from the biggest event in the company's history which he was supposed to headline - it's hurting the company's bottomline (already been estimated that the UFC will lose 30 - 40 million because of this). That is not good for the UFC and by extension, it's not good for the fighters. The only one who's not really hurt by this is Conor, since he's already the richest guy in the UFC (according to himself) so surely he can afford to see all of this go down as he's driving around in his dick extension of a car.

 

[LoopingRight]

 

[Hans Gruber]

This argument has always been around, and I've seen in a lot today and yesterday. Conor putting pressure on the UFC for higher paydays apparently is great for all fighters in the UFC because that means that they too will get paid more. Problem is of course that this argument isn't actually supported by any facts.

1. Corporations (at least well run companies) budget for absolutely everything. The payroll is no exception. So let's say the UFC sets aside 100 mil in 2016 for fighter pay. If Conor wants 10 instead of 5, the payroll budget doesn't magically increase from 100 to 105. That money has got to come from somewhere and it's most likely out of the same budget. Not great news for everyone else renegotiating their contracts.

2. Conor's pay is in no way shape or form linked to anyone else's pay. Conor can ask for more money because he can present concrete evidence that he directly is responsible for selling tickets. He's headlining events and they've done better everytime he's headlined. That's leverage. There are only very few fighters who can make that same kind of claim and those fighters aren't the issue, they're already getting paid well. The problem is with the guys who have to hold down a 9-5 because they can't pay the bills with their UFC money alone. These are the guys on the undercard or on the first 3 fights of an event. They have very little leverage in contract negotiations and Conor's pay won't change that.

I've brought it up in other threads: CEO pay increases every year, yet average employee pay has remained stagnant for decades. There is very little (if any) correlation between CEO pay and normal employee pay, just like there is very little correlation between 'star' pay and regular fighter pay.

3. What's good for the goose is good for the gander. While Conor's pay will have no impact on 90% of the fighters, Conor's presence will have a positive impact on the UFCs bottomline. UFC Fighter pay has been increasing over the last ten years and that is solely due to the fact that the company is growing. That's how the payroll is increased, by the company making more money, not by Conor asking for more money. So when Conor pulls this shit - withdrawing from the biggest event in the company's history which he was supposed to headline - it's hurting the company's bottomline (already been estimated that the UFC will lose 30 - 40 million because of this). That is not good for the UFC and by extension, it's not good for the fighters. The only one who's not really hurt by this is Conor, since he's already the richest guy in the UFC (according to himself) so surely he can afford to see all of this go down as he's driving around in his dick extension of a car.

Yep. If he gets paid 10 million others (who are not facing him and who don't have PPV points) on the card aren't likely to get paid more so they can still make large profits

I am all for increased fighter pay but there is a huge difference between someone who gets paid millions wanting to get paid more and someone like Rory wanting more than 40 to 60 K for his fight against Lawler

 

[Prime Yossarian]

In his last fight, do you think Nate got paid more or less than his previous bout against Michael Johnson?

 

[MikeMcMann]

The history of Sport, Movies, Musicians is that once that bar is raised it is very hard to lower it again and all who follow tend to benefit.

When a top athlete pushes for a new ground breaking contract you see others use it as leverage to gain more and they do. Same for when Actors and Musicians establish new limits with studios or tour promoters.

 

[Benoco]

I feel Conor will be seen as an important fighter in terms of expediting the long term trend of fighters getting a larger piece of the pie. It doesn't compute that he could possibly be anything but good for fighter pay.

 

[CerebralKnievel]

Yep. If he gets paid 10 million others on the card are likely to get paid less so they can make profits

I wouldn't say that, but his earning 10 mil doesn't have an immediate, positive impact on anyone else's salary. Anyone saying "Conor is fighting against the evil corporation! All hail the hero" are just beyond ignorant. You think the actor in the bank scene working as a teller is earning more money because the star of the film demanded 1% of revenue on top of his salary? Please; and they have a union.

 

[cumafish]

his opponents might get paid more, but the rest of the card(outside of anyone with ppv points) sees no bump at all.

 

[SuperNerd]

I think you're applying it too directly. I wouldn't claim Conor is some savior or anything..

I don't think the first point holds much weight. Theoretically, Payroll does "magically increase" from show to show because every show makes more or less than the previous, and fractions are given out.

If Conor raises attention in MMA, he indirectly creates buzz for others. I don't think Nate is ever going to get paid what he was making previously with UFC.


and this, since he said it better than I attempted to.

The history of Sport, Movies, Musicians is that once that bar is raised it is very hard to lower it again and all who follow tend to benefit.

When a top athlete pushes for a new ground breaking contract you see others use it as leverage to gain more and they do. Same for when Actors and Musicians establish new limits with studios or tour promoters.

 

[SCTwins]

Hey do you guys remember when this was a thing...

 

[what-wut]

If Conor breaks out of the UFC than that will benefit the fighters, but if he stays than it doesn't help the fighters at all.

 

[Hans Gruber]

I think you're applying it too directly. I wouldn't claim Conor is some savior or anything..

I don't think the first point holds much weight. Theoretically, Payroll does "magically increase" from show to show because every show makes more or less than the previous, and fractions are given out.

If Conor raises attention in MMA, he indirectly creates buzz for others. I don't think Nate is ever going to get paid what he was making previously with UFC.


and this, since he said it better than I attempted to.

MMA has been different so far. How much has fighter pay increased since Brock came around?

He brought more attention and brought in more fans...has pay changed that much?

 

[SuperNerd]

MMA has been different so far. How much has fighter pay increased since Brock came around?

He brought more attention and brought in more fans...has pay changed that much?

I'm not going to check, but I assume yes. MMA was on a natural rise regardless of Brock, although he helped ratings a lot.

The common discussion pre-Conor was "UFC is dying bro".

Conor can bring attention, it's up to these fighters to keep it.

 

[Grenz]

In his last fight, do you think Nate got paid more or less than his previous bout against Michael Johnson?

Obviously he got paid a lot more, but that was due to fighting Conor on short notice. How many others will that same privilege extend to? Maybe 5 more guys before Conor actually retires? So 1% of the fighters. It's my point exactly, this isn't helping the majority of the fighters.

The history of Sport, Movies, Musicians is that once that bar is raised it is very hard to lower it again and all who follow tend to benefit.

When a top athlete pushes for a new ground breaking contract you see others use it as leverage to gain more and they do. Same for when Actors and Musicians establish new limits with studios or tour promoters.

There are literally millions of musicians, actors and athletes barely scraping by. Sure it's true that if Brad Pitt gets paid 50 million per movie, Johnny Depp can now also ask for 50 million. But it doesn't mean shit for struggling actors trying to get a TV commercial. The same goes for musicians. So Lady Gaga makes 30 million a year by prancing around in ridiculous outfits singing shitty songs. That does nothing to increase the pay for bands who are working their asses off, playing real live music, hoping to get a break in the business. Again, this is my point exactly. Conor asking for more pay is great for the guys that have the same leverage as him, but it doesn't do shit all for all the guys who lack leverage (which is basically everyone not headlining PPVs).

 

[Hans Gruber]

I'm not going to check, but I assume yes. MMA was on a natural rise regardless of Brock, although he helped ratings a lot.

The common discussion pre-Conor was "UFC is dying bro".

Conor can bring attention, it's up to these fighters to keep it.

It hasn't changed that much IMO. Wages rose a little (partially due to inflation.) How much has the average pay actually went up since Brock was around? Very little

 

[Son of Jamin]

Trickle-down Conoromics

 

[wlu29]

MMA has been different so far. How much has fighter pay increased since Brock came around?

He brought more attention and brought in more fans...has pay changed that much?

more for dana and fertittas

not so much for fighters

 

[SuperNerd]

There are literally millions of musicians, actors and athletes barely scraping by. Sure it's true that if Brad Pitt gets paid 50 million per movie, Johnny Depp can now also ask for 50 million. But it doesn't mean shit for struggling actors trying to get a TV commercial. The same goes for musicians. So Lady Gaga makes 30 million a year by prancing around in ridiculous outfits singing shitty songs. That does nothing to increase the pay for bands who are working their asses off, playing real live music, hoping to get a break in the business. Again, this is my point exactly. Conor asking for more pay is great for the guys that have the same leverage as him, but it doesn't do shit all for all the guys who lack leverage (which is basically everyone not headlining PPVs).

So you're a communist?

 

[Hans Gruber]

Obviously he got paid a lot more, but that was due to fighting Conor on short notice. How many others will that same privilege extend to? Maybe 5 more guys before Conor actually retires? So 1% of the fighters. It's my point exactly, this isn't helping the majority of the fighters.



There are literally millions of musicians, actors and athletes barely scraping by. Sure it's true that if Brad Pitt gets paid 50 million per movie, Johnny Depp can now also ask for 50 million. But it doesn't mean shit for struggling actors trying to get a TV commercial. The same goes for musicians. So Lady Gaga makes 30 million a year by prancing around in ridiculous outfits singing shitty songs. That does nothing to increase the pay for bands who are working their asses off, playing real live music, hoping to get a break in the business. Again, this is my point exactly. Conor asking for more pay is great for the guys that have the same leverage as him, but it doesn't do shit all for all the guys who lack leverage (which is basically everyone not headlining PPVs).

Exactly. MMA is set up more like this unlike many other sports. Certain popular fighters get paid. Others don't.

Even a known guy like Rory makes peanuts

 

[GordoBarraBJJ]

Yep. If he gets paid 10 million others (who are not facing him and who don't have PPV points) on the card aren't likely to get paid more so they can still make large profits

I am all for increased fighter pay but there is a huge difference between someone who gets paid millions wanting to get paid more and someone like Rory wanting more than 40 to 60 K for his fight against Lawler

Also, using his position of power to advocate for all fighters to get higher pay. NOPE, not once did he ever stand up for the lesser paid fighters. It was, and is, all about conor.