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Television THE FALCON AND THE WINTER SOLDIER Discussion

If you have seen the whole season of FALCON AND THE WINTER SOLDIER, how would you rate it?

  • Total voters
    90
sleepwalk said:
He bludgeoned a Cap fan? When? Who?


In the comics, Walker's parents were killed by a far-right group called Watchdog. He went on a slaughter rampage and left two of his former associates (Left-winger & Right-winger) to die in a fire after finding out they were complicit.


"B-b-b-but... that's not what Steve would've done!" The fuck it isn't. He killed the shit out if the guy who "killed" Bucky.


This Walker seems to have a pretty serious case of adjustment disorder (self-imposed obsession and anxiety over any and all failures or even sub-optimal decisions) compounded by PTSD, the pressures of being a replacement symbol, and the super soldier serum.
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Nico, the guy Walker killed, told Karli that he was a Captain America fan growing up.

The guy who, "killed" Bucky was a fully armed Hydra soldier. Not a terrified prisoner begging for mercy.
 
KnightTemplar said:
Nico, the guy Walker killed, told Karli that he was a Captain America fan growing up.

The guy who, "killed" Bucky was a fully armed Hydra soldier. Not a terrified prisoner begging for mercy.
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Same guy? Okay.
But he wasn't a prisoner. He was fleeing the scene of a murder as part of a terrorist group.
(Make no mistake about it, though, that what Walker did was fucked up.)
 
KnightTemplar said:
I remember the story where the Watchdogs kidnap Walker's parents. So Walker kills the Watchdogs with his bare hands and saves his mom and dad...

Except he didn't; they were killed in the crossfire, and the last panel is Walker cradling his parents' bullet-riddled corpses and happily talking to them as though they were still alive:eek::eek:
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Walker is really captivating character. It's a shame that a lot of writers don't have the inclination to write him well because he's probably up there with Batman and Punisher as a case study of mental health.
 
sleepwalk said:
Same guy? Okay.
But he wasn't a prisoner. He was fleeing the scene of a murder as part of a terrorist group.
(Make no mistake about it, though, that what Walker did was fucked up.)
Click to expand...

TBF not all of the flag smashers are as extreme as Karli. They aren't all terrorists...
 
Fedorgasm said:
I like the MCU version better so far. More realistic.

The comic version had him seem very petty, like he wanted the attention that captain america got.

The MCU version seems much more like he wants to do the right thing, but he falls short of having Steve's incredible restraint and impeccable morals.

Loved USAgent in the comics in the 90s though. They made him into a great character.
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Yeah, for all his physical weakness, Steve wasn't motivated by his inadequacy... he persevered in spite of it. Walker is someone apparently used to being enough, to winning his fights, of being what he wants to be. Given the way the serum works, or is at least supposed to work (lord knows what this new douche cooked up) it stands to reason that someone with those motivations taking a thing that amplifies your inner compass... is going to have issues.
 
PRIDEWASBETTER said:
He's been sick of his shit...and so have I lol

He's got good heel heat with me, though. I like what they've done with him.
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Walker:
"I am Captain America."

Bucky:
giphy.gif
 
It's interesting to see the lines getting drawn among the fans on this storyline.

"I have sympathy for the violent terrorists and hate the guy wearing the Cap uniform because he isn't Steve or Sam."

-OR-

"I'm all for the guy who executed a dude at a public monument because he's just trying to stop globalists."
 
can we explore the psychology behind the shield?

is sam/falcon's reason for relenquishing shield justifiable?
or
is bucky right for being upset that sam didnt truly keep his word to steve?
 
sleepwalk said:
Same guy? Okay.
But he wasn't a prisoner. He was fleeing the scene of a murder as part of a terrorist group.
(Make no mistake about it, though, that what Walker did was fucked up.)
Click to expand...

Walker hit him twice with the Shield, knocked his ass down and put his boot on the man's chest. All Nico could do was say, "It wasn't me!" He wasn't going anywhere and he wasn't a threat, to Walker or anyone else.

Cap would never have killed a man in those circumstances. Like all good soldiers, Steve was ruthless, but not sadistic. It's summed up perfectly in his first meeting with Dr Erskine,

Dr Erskine, "Do you want to kill Nazis?"

Steve, "I don't want to kill anyone. I just don't like bullies".
 
rustledjimjams said:
can we explore the psychology behind the shield?

is sam/falcon's reason for relenquishing shield justifiable?
or
is bucky right for being upset that sam didnt truly keep his word to steve?
Click to expand...
Bucky felt like he should rightfully be 1st runner up to be Miss America, so if Sam didn't want, Bucky should have had 1st dibs.
 
How I see it is Captain American should represent American values (if he is going to use that name and dress up as a flag) which isn't the version of Captain America Steve Rogers was. How many innocent people die every time a superhero use's the 'don't kill code', at some point Batman needs to realise the only way to stop the joker is by ending it for good.

This was in the heat of battle, but also a warning to the next group of terrorist who try to ambush him and murder his friends that there are dire consequences. “The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting”, not by allowing the enemy to know they can try to kill you and your friends without fear of death.

His mistake wasn't killing the guy (unless you are arguing he should have captured him for interrogation), but for doing it in front of a crowd.
 
KnightTemplar said:
Walker hit him twice with the Shield, knocked his ass down and put his boot on the man's chest. All Nico could do was say, "It wasn't me!" He wasn't going anywhere and he wasn't a threat, to Walker or anyone else.
Click to expand...
Yet.


Cap would never have killed a man in those circumstances. Like all good soldiers, Steve was ruthless, but not sadistic. It's summed up perfectly in his first meeting with Dr Erskine,

Dr Erskine, "Do you want to kill Nazis?"

Steve, "I don't want to kill anyone. I just don't like bullies".
Click to expand...
Correct. Steve Rogers wouldn't have killed anyone like that. Nobody really should kill anyone like that. I do have to argue about the assertion that Steve, as a soldier, was "ruthless" while what Walker did was "sadistic." When a soldier or police officer uses violence, it should always come from an objective and practical place, cold and impartial (so, yeah, I guess somewhat ruthless.) What Walker did was driven by rage. The Hulk isn't sadistic, he's lashing out. And, after a lifetime of fearing failure and constantly failing at the greatest test of his personal and professional life, the one person who he relied upon to help him (when others like Sam and Buck were working opposite him) was killed by a terrorist while protecting him. Walker lashed out and did it on Nico with Captain America's shield and the power of the super soldier serum.
 
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