Stipe Miocic - have I missed something?

[Mike]

Immediate rematches are stupid. You guys are literally used to seeing them purely because the ufc started doing them far too often. Up until that point there was no expectation a champ would get a rematch.

We should only be seeing them when the result of the fight is EXTREMELY controversial.

 

[Fergelmince]

The overall data you are focusing on is outdated. So it actually doesn't matter. If Stipe and Ngannou were still at that same skill level it would matter. If they are not, then it's useless information.

No, not outdated. 7 months before his 2nd fight vs nagannoo, Miocic won his 2nd fight against the 2nd best HW of this era in cormier. The same Cormier that ngannoo ducked for the last few years.

 

[CroCopsLHK]

I want Stipe to be champ again, but it ain't looking good. Ngannou fight was different than DC fight.

 

[Lychrel]

Depends on how Gane-Ngannou goes. If it's a good fight they'll run it back. Dana doesn't like Stipe. Besides, Stipe neads to earn another title shot with a W.

Stipe really should just fight Jon Jones, assuming he really moves up. Advantages:

• It might be a bigger fight than Stipe remacthing Francis for the belt (and would definitely be bigger than him vs Gane)
• If he wins it ups his stock with fans, tremendously boosts his legacy, and positions him perfectly for another title shot

 

[Lychrel]

stipe was winning the first DC fight, even controlling the wrestling then got caught on a break. A rematch in that case was a lil more justified. Frankis on the other hand was plooking stipe up in every aspect of their last fight and then shadow realmed him. It was apparent that stipe could do absolutely nothing to frankis in their second fight. A rematch in that case makes way less sense.

Them being 1-1 against each other is not enough to justify an insta rematch considering that stipe beat an early not yet fully developed frank n how 1 sided of a beat down it was once stipe fought frank 2.0. Stipe also being 40 and will only be worse and worse as each day goes by while frank is still improving is another reason.

This is how I felt about the DC/Stipe rubber match. It was reasonably competitive, but Stipe was old and DC was well past his prime; what’s the point? It didn’t feel especially relevant either to the division or to either man’s legacy.

 

[Jorge Luis Borges]

Stipe holds the record for most wins in heavyweight title fights along with the longest title defending streak in the heavyweight division. Arguably one of the greatest Heavyweights in UFC History.

Yet what I don’t understand is this, how can he hold those accolades and yet not be given an immediate rematch for his title after a loss? Case in point..

First of all, I always going to support any champ not being given an immediate rematch. It's an awful phenomenon that has made a mess of the top of every division for years now.

Second, Miocic looked terrible. He needs to show he can still compete at a high level, because that was not in evidence in his loss to Ngannou.

 

[Mmmmmmma1234]

Agree his decision to fight at a lighter weight backfired. If he puts some mass back on again, he ragdolled Ngannou in the first fight and he definitely can do it again.

A 40 yr old Stipe will never be as good as the 36 yr old version stop lying to yourself. These younger guys have passed him by.

 

[FIghtxIQ]

No, not outdated. 7 months before his 2nd fight vs nagannoo, Miocic won his 2nd fight against the 2nd best HW of this era in cormier. The same Cormier that ngannoo ducked for the last few years.

You are looking at time frame, not if that actual information or skill is relevant. If Ngannou is not at the same skill level, it doesn't matter if it's 7 months or 7 mins, it's outdated information. The rematch made it very clear that the same game plan Stipe tried in the 1st fight doesn't work anymore. Once he realized he couldn't take Ngannou down he was left having to stand with him and got KO. Ngannou even took him down. So once again, that information is irrelevant because it's outdated and useless information. You don't watch old fights to look for things to exploit, you watch their most recent fights unless there is no change in skill levels/techniques/tactics/strategies/etc, then yeah you can watch old tape and it'll still be relevant information. But with fighters that evolve and progress, old footage is outdated and will be useless for the most part.

 

[Orochimaru 大蛇丸]

Jose Aldo approves this thread..

{<Mcgoat}

I don’t remember Jose ever complaining either. He is one of my all time favorites.

 

[Fergelmince]

You are looking at time frame, not if that actual information or skill is relevant. If Ngannou is not at the same skill level, it doesn't matter if it's 7 months or 7 mins, it's outdated information. The rematch made it very clear that the same game plan Stipe tried in the 1st fight doesn't work anymore. Once he realized he couldn't take Ngannou down he was left having to stand with him and got KO. Ngannou even took him down. So once again, that information is irrelevant because it's outdated and useless information. You don't watch old fights to look for things to exploit, you watch their most recent fights unless there is no change in skill levels/techniques/tactics/strategies/etc, then yeah you can watch old tape and it'll still be relevant information. But with fighters that evolve and progress, old footage is outdated and will be useless for the most part.

Miocic didn't use the same gameplan. He thought he caught ngannoo and started swinging. Nothing like the first one.

 

[FIghtxIQ]

Miocic didn't use the same gameplan. He thought he caught ngannoo and started swinging. Nothing like the first one.

That's because he couldn't get the takedown like he was able to in the 1st fight. Plus Ngannou actually took him down after he defended Stipe's takedown. Ngannou left Stipe with no other choice but to stand with him.

You have to look at things like updates in software/applications. They update to fix bugs and exploits, so the newer versions won't have those issues. You wouldn't try to exploit a newer version software/application with old bugs/exploits. It wouldn't work because it's patched up already. Same thing with fighting. When fighters patch up holes in their games, you can't try old exploits because they no longer work. You have to figure something new to exploit in their game.

 

[Fergelmince]

That's because he couldn't get the takedown like he was able to in the 1st fight. Plus Ngannou actually took him down after he defended Stipe's takedown. Ngannou left Stipe with no other choice but to stand with him.

You have to look at things like updates in software/applications. They update to fix bugs and exploits, so the newer versions won't have those issues. You wouldn't try to exploit a newer version software/application with old bugs/exploits. It wouldn't work because it's patched up already. Same thing with fighting. When fighters patch up holes in their games, you can't try old exploits because they no longer work. You have to figure something new to exploit in their game.

No, it's because he caught nganoo on the chin early. If he wanted it, Miocic deserves an immediate rematch. He's the GOAT UFC HW. He didn't duck anyone like ngannoo ducked cormier before he retired, and now he ducked Lewis over the Summer and Gane in August. Nganno won't hold the title for very long, so this will not even be worth discussing in a year or so.

 

[JonJonesNeedle]

Meochich the POS